<html><head></head><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px"><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_5364">WOW ! Are you going to rotate the sphere to have the port ( I assume you mean View Port) where you want it ?</div><div><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_4263">You seem to have cracked quite a few nuts that challenged Psubbers.</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_5360"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_4632">What about <br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_4724"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_5362">Thru hulls for control, power, life support, comm, etc.</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_5367"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_6104" dir="ltr">Battery banks ( I'm especially interested in this. I am working on a design of a K350 variant and I don't the like battery pods<br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_5365"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_7130">Thrusters and compansation.</div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_7308"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_7309">I hope you win the lottery some day.<br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_6105"><br></div><div id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_2897"><span></span></div><div class="qtdSeparateBR" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_3807"><br><br></div><div class="yahoo_quoted" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_3811" style="display: block;"> <div style="font-family: Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_3810"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_3809"> <div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_3808"> <font id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_3812" size="2" face="Arial"> <hr id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_6763" size="1"> <b id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_6947"><span style="font-weight:bold;" id="yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498350954842_6946">From:</span></b> hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Saturday, June 24, 2017 6:38 PM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] syntactic foam.<br> </font> </div> <div class="y_msg_container"><br><div id="yiv6198430777"><div><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:13px;"><div>Hi Pete,</div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv6198430777yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498346797682_3980">Elementary 12,000 will have a 48 inch by 3.25 in thick occupant sphere 516-70 steel, and it will weigh 8,000 lbs. The port and hatch will be combined, and the hatch land will be a bolt in place part. I will machine the conical opening with my own flange facing machine. If I achieve the accuracy with the land that I have with Elementary, 3000 that will be great, if not then I will have it re-machined professionally. The new sphere will go in place of the sphere in Elementary 3000 and all the parts will be swapped out. That is the plan </div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv6198430777yui_3_16_0_ym19_1_1498346797682_3980">Hank</div> <div class="yiv6198430777qtdSeparateBR"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><div class="yiv6198430777yqt2204489099" id="yiv6198430777yqt88737"><div class="yiv6198430777yahoo_quoted" style="display:block;"> <div style="font-family:Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:13px;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div dir="ltr"><font size="2" face="Arial"> On Saturday, June 24, 2017 2:22 PM, Pete Niedermayr via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<br clear="none"></font></div> <br clear="none"><br clear="none"> <div class="yiv6198430777y_msg_container"><div dir="ltr">Hank, What are your preliminary hull specs for Elementary 12000?<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr">--------------------------------------------<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr">On Fri, 6/23/17, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] syntactic foam.<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> To: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Date: Friday, June 23, 2017, 8:44 PM<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank,yes the gas tanks may<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> be expensive. You could possibly make<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> a series of boxes for the petrol. Make a box out<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> ofmarine<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> ply, seal it with epoxy, drill a couple of holes in the<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> bottom & glue ina flexible membrane<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> across the inside bottom of the box. Then seal a top<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> on with a<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> valve for filling. Just brain storming here!Alan<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> from my iPad<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 24/06/2017, at 1:12 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Alan,Those<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> look amazing and expensive. I am not saying it is not<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> doable, I am just very nervous due to lack of<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> knowledge. I am sure with proper engineering and safety<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> grounding it can be safe. I would go with CNG type 4 tanks<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> before I did gasoline. I can buy one brand new tank that<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> will provide all the buoyancy I need for 2,500-3,000 or I<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> can buy a used tank that is current until 2030 for 1,100<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> dollars plus shipping. Also the CNG tank only adds 105 lbs<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> plus compressed air weight to the dry weight, making the<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> sub easy to lift onto the deck of my proposed landing<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> craft.Hank<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Friday, June 23,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 6:32 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank,I had<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> another quick Google on collapsible petrol<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> containers.There<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> is a huge variety, with manufacturers offering tailor<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> made products.Here<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> is a news item about them using them on the jetpack. They<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> have a collapsible<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> fuel tank strapped to their back.http://www.atlinc.com/newsreleases.htmlAlan<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> From: hank pronk via<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> To: Personal<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Submersibles General Discussion <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent: Saturday, June<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 24, 2017 11:16 AM<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Subject: Re:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> [PSUBS-MAILIST] syntactic foam.<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Alan,I am<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> still considering that idea but Sean said NO ;-( It is<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> cheap and I would have lots of exta buoyancy. This is good<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> for Elementary 3,000 but not Elementary 12,000. I want to<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> explore all ideas, and will end up where I started with<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> spheres in epoxy ;-)Hank<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Friday, June 23, 2017 5:01 PM,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Alan via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank,what happened to your<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> idea of using composite tanks pressurised with<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> air?As long<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> as they were in test & you had multiple tanks, with a<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> drop weight thatcould compensate for<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> one failing, that would be ok wouldn't it?If you were filling to<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 3000psi, they wouldn't see external pressure till<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 6000ft.You<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> could always test the idea at Nuytco.Alan<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent from my iPad<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 24/06/2017, at 10:17 AM, hank pronk via<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> LOL,I<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> checked on the compressibility and it will compress<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> .5 percent, per 1,000 psi same as hydraulic oil. I have<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> weighed two types of Olive oil today and the specific<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> gravity is actually .86g\cc so it is to heavy. I<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> can't seem to find the light weight stuff .703g\cc<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> if you buy in bulk it is 5 dollars per kg so<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> far.I am<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> not even sure I can drive down the road with that much gas,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> mind you it would be hidden behind panels on the sub. Then<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> there is the expansion while it sits in the hot weather.<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> If the tree huggers heard about it they would crap in<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> their pants and chase me down, luckily my truck can out run<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> a VW van lol.Hank<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Friday, June 23,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 3:53 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank,is that extra virgin or<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> cold pressed? I wonder if it compressesunder<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> pressure.Olive oil would be an<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> expensive way to go. Whereas petrol costsnothing if you re-use<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> it. Not<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> sure why you fear gasoline; they let women pump it in to<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> their cars<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> at gas stations!Cheers Alan<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> from my iPad<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 24/06/2017, at 4:21 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Alec,Thank<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> you, I should have bought those instead of the 11 inch,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> grrrr. I could go with those floats, but I do hope to<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> build the next generation Elementary sub. I want to<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> figure out the whole foam thing and possibly carry it over<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> to the next sub. Alan has really intrigued me with using<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> gasoline, I am terrified of that idea but it has caused me<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> to stumble onto another liquid. In searching I have<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> discovered that Olive Oil is even lighter<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> than gasoline, and obviously safer for me and the<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> environment. I have no idea yet if it is an option, I only<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> stumbled onto it this morning. If anyone knows of a bad<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> reason to use Olive Oil, please let me know. Olive Oil is<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> .703 g\cc and I can put it into plastic containers that<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> are .93 g\cc Hank<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Friday, June 23,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 9:28 AM, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Actually there are<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> trawl floats rated to 1800m. That should have you covered<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank! Check out #629 below.<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://trawlworks.com/floats.html">http://trawlworks.com/floats.html</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Best,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Alec<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Mon, Jun 19, 2017 at<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 1:21 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</a>><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> These guys have 14"<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> spherical buoys rated to 800 meters - $120.00 with<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> a positive buoyancy of 39 # they are not syntactic. <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> The syntactics start at 30" in dia<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.mooringsystems.com/">http://www.mooringsystems.com/</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> buoyancy.htm Brian <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> --- <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> From: james<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> cottrell via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> To:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal Submersibles General Discussion <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] syntactic<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> foam.<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2017 16:52:56<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> +0000 (UTC)<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Deep sea glass floats are rated for 10,000<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> psi<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://teledynebenthos.com/">http://teledynebenthos.com/</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> product/flotation_instrument_ housings/flotation-glass-<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> spheres<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Greg<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> From: Alan via<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> To: Personal<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Submersibles General Discussion <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent: Monday, June 12,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 6:18 PM<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Subject: Re:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> [PSUBS-MAILIST] syntactic foam.<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank,if you<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> are getting 3lb of floatation per gallon then you need<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 184gallons of gas. 184 x 3 = 552 ( near<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> enough).Cheers Alan<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent from my iPad<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On 13/06/2017, at 9:50 AM, hank pronk via<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Alan,I need 550 lbs flotation and one imp<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> gallon of water is 10 lbs and gas is 7 lbs that gives me 3<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> lbs buoyancy per imp gallon that means I need 1650 gallons<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> of gas.Hank<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Monday, June 12,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 3:43 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank,are you sure that's<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> right!That would give 1900kg of floatation (<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> nearly 2 ton)That is based on gasoline being .71<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> of the weight of water. So every litreof gas<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> gives you about 290 grams of floatation. Metric<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> system is much easier for calculating these<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> things.Cheers Alan<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent from my iPad<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On 12/06/2017, at 11:42 PM, hank pronk via<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Alan,Those<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> are nice, I can see other uses for them. If I use<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> gasoline, I would need about 1,750 imperial gallons for<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Elementary. I was mistaken about the liquid paraffin,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> gasoline is better. <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Sunday, June 11,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 11:36 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Maybe<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> something like this collapsable plastic fuel<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> tank, inside a protective fibreglass housing, or<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> a grate arrangement. <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="https://www.bdoutdoors.com/">https://www.bdoutdoors.com/</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> atl-fuel-bladder-extra/Alan<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent from my iPad<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On 12/06/2017, at 12:28 PM, hank pronk via<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Alan,Yes I<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> have, it is very simple and effective. There are of coarse<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> some hazardous logistical problems not to<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> mention environmental concerns. I would opt for<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> diesel fuel to reduce the fire hazard. Any time you have<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> plastic and gas it is dangerous. Last week I did a barge<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> job replacing dock piles. When I walked up and down the<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> plastic dock floats, every time I touched the steel piles I<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> got a spark. Actually Liquid paraffin is even better at<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> .8g\ccHank <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Sunday, June 11,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 5:32 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank,have you looked at using<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> gasoline?More volume required for the same<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> floatation as syntactic foam,but apart from the<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> holding tanks it would cost you nothing, as<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> youcould use it after the dive. If you designed<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> right you could fill the tanksat your<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> destination.Alan<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent from my iPad<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On 12/06/2017, at 6:03 AM, hank pronk via<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Greg,that sounds good,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> I would love to find a more cost effective foam. I still<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> want to build one more sub that goes much deeper, but the<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> foam cost is not manageable. I estimate I can build a<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Titanic capable sub for 100,000 and 80,000 of that is<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> foam. ;-(Hank<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Sunday, June 11,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 8:29 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Greg,There has to be good reason to make foam by<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> other means than standard practices. Cost would be the<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> biggest reason, and using wax will probably work, but is<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> there a saving? Using wax means you have to use a<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> deeper rated sphere to offset the loss of reinforcement<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> provided by the resin. I have no idea what the cost<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> difference would be. Maybe the cost is still much<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> better. When I look at Cliff's report, the resin is<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> not the expensive part. Perhaps the direction should be,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> to look for a replacement for the spheres. In Cliff's<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> report it shows the resin triples the sphere's<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> performance. That implies that the true strength comes<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> from the resin. Maybe a sawdust resin or a styrofoam<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> granule resin is worth looking at also. Maybe it is a<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> simple as air entrained resin?Fun to<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> think about anyways.Hank <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Sunday, June 11,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 6:22 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hi Scott,Thanks<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> for the offer, but I need foam for 3,000<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> feet.Hank <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> On Saturday, June 10,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> 2017 9:03 PM, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> wrote:<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank,<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hola from Costa Rica!<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Depends on if they are glass or<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> carbon fiber spheres and what size they are. They are all<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> pretty durable. We are actually cutting up the foam on<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Pisces and reattaching it to get the shapes we<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> want. <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> I do have a<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> ton of syntactic foam that is cert to 400m that I'd sell<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> you for super cheap. Like all of it for $200<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Thanks,Scott<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Waters<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Sent from my<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> U.S. Cellular® Smartphone<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> -------- Original message<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> --------From: hank pronk via<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> Date: 6/10/17 12:38 PM (GMT-06:00)<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <<a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.">personal_submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] syntactic<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> foam. <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> I have an idea, but not sure if it will work. <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> My idea is to fill a neutrally buoyant container with macro<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> and micro spheres. After the container is as full as<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> possible, then fill with an environmentally friendly oil. <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> This would be more buoyant than using a resin and less<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> complicated and cheaper. My concern is, how well will the<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> spheres stand up against breaking from being in contact with<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> the other spheres and the container. Are these spheres<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> delicate?<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Hank______________________________<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> _________________<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> Personal_Submersibles<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> mailing list<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs." target="_blank" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> org<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/</a><br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles<br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> <br clear="none"></div><div dir="ltr"> ______________________________<br clear="none"></div><div 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