<html><head></head><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px"><div id="yui_3_16_0_1_1447801829092_3545"><span>Alan,</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1447801829092_3547"><span id="yui_3_16_0_1_1447801829092_3546">The problem with that is, if a float did fail you could not find it or maybe not even notice if it did fail. I think a float rack under the cowling should work. I am dealing on 4 titanium spheres at the moment. Each sphere gives 200 lbs buoyancy NET </span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yui_3_16_0_1_1447801829092_3548"><span>Hank</span></div> <br><div class="qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class="yahoo_quoted" style="display: block;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 12px;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 16px;"> <div dir="ltr"><font size="2" face="Arial"> On Tuesday, November 17, 2015 3:51 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<br></font></div> <br><br> <div class="y_msg_container"><div id="yiv7943099501"><div><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6910"><span>Hank,</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6912"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6911">if the trawl floats crushed they would do it one at a time.</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6913"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6914">Maybe make a fiberglass form in the shape you need &</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6913"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7122">fill it with differing sizes of trawl floats. With smaller trawl floats filling the</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6913"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7123">gaps between the bigger ones. Then in stages fill in the gaps with syntactic foam.</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6913"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7124">That should add strength to the trawl floats. I should think the whole unit </span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6913"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7244">would be much stronger than it's individual parts, but that's a Sean question:)</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_6913"><span>Alan</span></div><br clear="none"> <div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7127" style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7126" style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div class="yiv7943099501yqt1201531109" id="yiv7943099501yqt04160"><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7125"> <hr id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7129" size="1"> <font id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7128" size="2" face="Arial"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">To:</span></b> Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> <br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, November 18, 2015 10:03 AM<br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] syntactic foam<br clear="none"> </font> </div> <div class="yiv7943099501y_msg_container" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7310"><br clear="none"><div id="yiv7943099501"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7312"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7311" style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447793755639_3350"><span>Sean,</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447793755639_3350"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447793755639_3694">I have looked at building steel buoyancy tanks- they are just to heavy to be effective. I am trying to keep the sub as light as possible and trawl floats are better than 50% </span>buoyant to weight. Unless there is a serious risk to using trawl floats, I think they are the most logical and cost effective choice at 3 dollars per lb of buoyancy . I will also have substantial MBT volume to offset failed trawl floats. If I am wrong, please correct me, I would love to have steel tanks, that is right up my alley.</div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447793755639_3350">Hank</div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447793755639_3350"><br clear="none"></div> <br clear="none"><div class="yiv7943099501qtdSeparateBR" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7313"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><div class="yiv7943099501yahoo_quoted" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7318" style="display:block;"> <div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7317" style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"> <div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7316" style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div class="yiv7943099501qtdSeparateBR"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><div class="yiv7943099501yqt4827714119" id="yiv7943099501yqt48982"><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7315"> <font id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7314" size="2" face="Arial"> On Tuesday, November 17, 2015 9:19 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<br clear="none"> </font> </div> <br clear="none"><br clear="none"> <div class="yiv7943099501y_msg_container" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7321"><div id="yiv7943099501"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7320"><div dir="ltr">I was referring to Cliff's suggestion that you fabricate steel pressure vessels as permanent buoyancy, as opposed to using foam at all.</div>
<div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7319">Sean<br clear="none">
</div>
<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><div class="yiv7943099501yqt3313749457" id="yiv7943099501yqtfd50267"><div class="yiv7943099501gmail_quote" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447798579063_7322">On November 16, 2015 5:56:58 PM MST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<blockquote class="yiv7943099501gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);padding-left:1ex;">
<div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447721717578_3220"><span>Yes, trawl floats as Macro spheres.</span></div><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447721717578_3220"><span>Hank</span></div> <br clear="none"><div class="yiv7943099501qtdSeparateBR"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><div class="yiv7943099501yahoo_quoted" style="display:block;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> On Monday, November 16, 2015 5:36 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<br clear="none"> </font> </div> <br clear="none"><br clear="none"> <div class="yiv7943099501y_msg_container"><div id="yiv7943099501"><div><div dir="ltr">He might have been on to something wrt fabricating b!
uoyancy
vessels.</div>
<div dir="ltr">Sean<br clear="none">
</div>
<br clear="none"><br clear="none"><div class="yiv7943099501gmail_quote">On November 16, 2015 5:19:13 PM MST, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<blockquote class="yiv7943099501gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);padding-left:1ex;">
<div class="yiv7943099501yqt2337449559" id="yiv7943099501yqt95978"><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447719371646_2891"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447719371646_2892">Just had a look at Cliff's PDF on Syntactic foam. Wow very nice! and there is a cost breakdown I see. It is much cheaper than buying but still twice the cost of trawl floats. </span></div><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447719371646_2891"><span>Hank</span></div> <br clear="none"><div class="yiv7943099501qtdSeparateBR"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><div class="yiv7943099501yahoo_quoted" style="display:block;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> On Monday, November 16, 2015 5:05 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
<personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<br clear="none"> </font> </div> <br clear="none"><br clear="none"> <div class="yiv7943099501y_msg_container"><div id="yiv7943099501"><div><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447718470378_2759"><span>Alan,</span></div><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447718470378_2759"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447718470378_2760">Yes I could save a few bucks and look good at the same time :-) I doubt I could make foam for less than trawl floats but maybe Cliff has a cost per lb buoyancy. There is syntactic foam available that you mix together into your own mould also. I am also still woking on the titanium spheres. I have time to sort it out.</span></div><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447718470378_2759"><span>Hank</span></div> <br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div><div class="yiv7943099501yahoo_quoted" style="display:block;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"> <div style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div class="yiv7943099501yqt9822389816" id="yiv7943099501yqt74768"><div dir="ltr"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> On Monday, November 16, 2015 5:01 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> wrote:<br clear="none"> </font> </div> <br clear="none"><br clear="none"> <div class="yiv7943099501y_msg_container"><div id="yiv7943099501"><div><div style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4481"><span>Hank,</span></div><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4482"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4483">you could go on a diet :)</span></div><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4485"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4484">There is this pdf on making syntactic foam by Cliff</span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4486"><span id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4494"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4492" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/design/PDF/SyntacticFoam.pdf">http://www.psubs.org/design/PDF/SyntacticFoam.pdf</a><br clear="none"></span></div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4486">I went to Alvins 50th Birthday party in New Orleans.</div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4486">They said the syntactic foam on it cost $3million. </div><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4486">That included all the pressure testing</div><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4486">of the individual segments.</div>Alan<br clear="none"> <div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4491" style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4490" style="font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:16px;"> <div class="yiv7943099501yqt7705397220" id="yiv7943099501yqt64016"><div dir="ltr" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4489"> <hr id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4496" size="1"> <font id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4488" size="2" face="Arial"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles@psubs.org><br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">To:</span></b> Personal Submersibles General Discussion
<personal_submersibles@psubs.org> <br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, November 17, 2015 12:39 PM<br clear="none"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">Subject:</span></b> [PSUBS-MAILIST] syntactic foam<br clear="none"> </font> </div> <div class="yiv7943099501y_msg_container" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4599"><br clear="none"><div id="yiv7943099501"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4616"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4615" style="color:#000;background-color:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447716988636_2399">Yikes! syntactic foam is costly. Syntactic foam for 1,000M is 8 dollars per pound buoyancy- trawl floats are 3 dollars per lb buoyancy. I need almost 1,000 lbs buoyancy.</div><div id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447716988636_2399">Hank</div></div></div></div><br clear="none">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4617" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" id="yiv7943099501yui_3_16_0_1_1447717195717_4618" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><br clear="none"><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div></div> </div> </div> </div></div></div><br clear="none"><div class="yiv7943099501yqt7705397220" id="yiv7943099501yqt14329">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><br clear="none"></div><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div></div> </div> </div> </div></div></div></div><br clear="none"><div class="yiv7943099501yqt9822389816" id="yiv7943099501yqt82866">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org</a><br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><br clear="none"></div><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div> </div> </div> </div></div></blockquote></div><div style="margin-top:2.5em;margin-bottom:1em;border-bottom:1px solid #000;"></div><pre class="yiv7943099501k9mail"></pre><hr><br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles@psubs.org<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles">http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles</a><br clear="none"></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br clear="none"><div class="yiv7943099501yqt2337449559" id="yiv7943099501yqt30929">_______________________________________________<br clear="none">Personal_Submersibles mailing list<br clear="none"><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" 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