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<DIV>All:</DIV>
<DIV>Nuytco has had experience classing with most of the majors – Lloyds
Register, Germanischer Lloyds, American Bureau of Shipping, Det Norske
Veritas (now combined with GL) and Cayman Islands register of Shipping. All of
these classifying agencies use as their reference “Pressure Vessels for Human
Occupancy – section 8”, commonly referred to as ‘PVHO8’. Several of these
agencies have additional requirements but in the main they stick to PVHO8. The
choice of who you go with is usually governed by: basic prices for initial ‘Plan
Approval’ and hourly rates for witnessing tests, materials, etc., the proximity
of the surveyors to your place of build (since you have to cover all costs of
the surveyor if they are not in your area) and finally, the location of the
office who will make the final decision relative to your subs
classification -relative to where their local representatives offices are
located. The good news is that almost all of these agencies accept each others
witnessing and certs. </DIV>
<DIV>Be prepared, though, it is expensive to class – particularly if you are
only building one sub. In the case of a manufacturer like Nuytco, we can spread
our costs over a number of subs by getting ‘type approval’ so much of the
initial stuff does not have to redone with each sub, as long as you don’t change
the design.</DIV>
<DIV>Phil</DIV>
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<DIV style="BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=alanlindsayjames@yahoo.com
href="mailto:alanlindsayjames@yahoo.com">Alan James</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Monday, November 25, 2013 7:52 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=personal_submersibles@psubs.org
href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">Personal Submersibles General
Discussion</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] G.L. Submersible
Classification</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: small; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; TEXT-DECORATION: none; DISPLAY: inline">
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style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, helvetica neue, helvetica, arial, lucida grande, sans-serif; COLOR: #000; BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fff">
<DIV><SPAN>Hi Jon,</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>I
have very little idea as to what requirements there are in both,</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>other
than what I've heard over the years on this site & snippets
elsewhere.</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>They
could be very close, I don't know.</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN
style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent">I intend to read through ABS as well but
for some reason I've started on G.L..</SPAN><BR></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>I
doubt there will be an issue of competition here as I can't see too many
Psubbers </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>wanting
to spend the money to certify. However from a safety standpoint there
may</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>be
some interest. And either group would be a good guideline for this.</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>I
could start with ABS, but members may be more familiar with them than G.L.,
&</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>able
to comment on discrepancies. </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>I
think Jim & David were interested in following classification
guidelines.</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>How
far are you two down the track with this? And would it be preferred if we
went</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>over
ABS instead???</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); FONT-STYLE: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent"><SPAN>Regards
Alan</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
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<HR SIZE=1>
<FONT size=2 face=Arial><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Jon
Wallace <jonw@psubs.org><BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> Personal Submersibles General
Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> <BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Tuesday, November 26, 2013 3:37
PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST]
G.L. Submersible Classification<BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=y_msg_container>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV id=yiv0397110829>
<DIV>
<DIV class=yiv0397110829moz-cite-prefix><BR clear=none>I don't have any issues
with it as long as the discussion remains objective. I have been reminded
that we have a working relationship with ABS that we've worked hard to build up
over the years and don't want to jeopardize. However, we would certainly
entertain and approve of a working relationship with GL as well, and any others
that might want a working relationship with PSUBS. I would also note that
we do have links to GL on our website right now at <A
class=yiv0397110829moz-txt-link-abbreviated href="http://www.psubs.org/"
shape=rect rel=nofollow target=_blank>WWW.PSUBS.ORG</A> -> Resources &
Reference -> Guidelines & Standards -> Germanischer Lloyd AG
(hopefully still current).<BR clear=none><BR clear=none>I've never personally
looked at certification as "us vs them". Kittredge used both ABS and
Lloyd's, as has Nuytco I believe. In fact, Kittredge also used Nippon
once. I believe the choice usually comes down to financials rather than
one set of rules being better than another.<BR clear=none><BR clear=none>If you
think there's a propensity for the discussion to get critical of a particular
certifying authority let's have it on the member-only list instead of the public
list.<BR clear=none><BR clear=none>Jon<BR clear=none><BR clear=none><BR
clear=none>On 11/25/2013 6:33 PM, Alan James wrote:<BR clear=none></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV id=yiv0397110829yqt69874 class=yiv0397110829yqt4526973369>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(255,255,255)">
<DIV><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">Hi,</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">I've
just started going through the Germanic LLoyds rules for classification</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">of
manned submersibles, with view to building as close as possible to them.</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)"><A
style="COLOR: rgb(17,85,204)"
href="http://www.gl-group.com/pdf/GL_Rules_MannedSubmersibles.pdf" shape=rect
rel=nofollow target=_blank>http://www.gl-group.com/pdf/
GL_Rules_MannedSubmersibles. pdf</A><BR clear=none></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">Is
anyone interested in me summarizing the rules as I go along?</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">There
are a few people in the group with GL classification experience who</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">may
want to chip in & keep an eye on what I'm saying in case my
understanding</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">is
not quite right. Also any variations from ABS that people pick up on</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">would
be interesting to know.</DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px">I am hopeful this will generate discussion in some
areas.</SPAN><BR clear=none></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px">Jon if you don't like this idea email me</SPAN><IMG
style="FONT-SIZE: 14pt; FONT-FAMILY: helveticaneue, 'Helvetica Neue', helvetica, arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0)"
alt="*:) happy"
src="http://mail.yimg.com/ok/u/assets/img/emoticons/emo1.gif"></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-SIZE: 12px; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34)">Alan</DIV></DIV></DIV><BR
clear=none>
<FIELDSET class=yiv0397110829mimeAttachmentHeader></FIELDSET> <BR clear=none><PRE>_______________________________________________
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