<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:tahoma, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt"><div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">Good point Alec,</SPAN></div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">better to add volume for batteries and make it stream lined.<VAR id=yui-ie-cursor></VAR></SPAN></div>
<div style="RIGHT: auto"><SPAN style="RIGHT: auto">Hank</SPAN></div>
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<DIV class=hr style="FONT-SIZE: 0px; BORDER-TOP: #ccc 1px solid; HEIGHT: 0px; BORDER-RIGHT: #ccc 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: #ccc 1px solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; PADDING-TOP: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 5px 0px; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid; LINE-HEIGHT: 0; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px" readonly="true" contenteditable="false"></DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Private <alecsmyth@gmail.com><BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles@psubs.org> <BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Saturday, October 12, 2013 7:28:44 PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Thrusters, Air & Diesel Musings<BR></FONT></DIV>
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<DIV>Interesting, because for my part I'm heading in the exact opposite direction. My next sub aims to be the ultimate in simplicity, and will make Snoopy look really complex by comparison. As for the heat, I don't want the complexity of A/C and would be content if I could simply open the hatch, hence freeboard is a priority. I could augment that by simply adding a blower for ventilation on the surface. The thrusters will be fixed, no linkages and actuators like Snoopy. No VBT. Thrusters and speed controllers will be four identical units, and will be replaceable in a few minutes (thrusters are emergency-droppable, so to replace you just drop them). The goal is to have a sub so simple that I can ship it to a remote location and know it will have no technical glitches whatsoever and that I will have spares on hand at all times for it's few moving parts. </DIV>
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<DIV>It will have 12 batteries in the main banks, and when you add to that the rate at which battery density is improving, I think there'll be enough juice to render a diesel unnecessary.</DIV>
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<DIV>I once went as far as buying a tiny diesel to evaluate it for use in a sub, but after tests I resold it on eBay. Too much noise, heat, and complexity for me.</DIV>
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<DIV>Just my two pennies... The more I dive the simpler my ideal sub gets.</DIV>
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<DIV>Best,</DIV>
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<DIV>Alec</DIV>
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<DIV><BR clear=none>On Oct 12, 2013, at 8:56 PM, Pete Niedermayr <<A href="mailto:freepetesub@yahoo.com" shape=rect rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:freepetesub@yahoo.com">freepetesub@yahoo.com</A>> wrote:<BR clear=none><BR clear=none></DIV>
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<DIV><SPAN>Where do you keep the fuel ?</SPAN></DIV>
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<DIV><SPAN>Pete</SPAN></DIV>
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<DIV class=yiv7132421959hr style="FONT-SIZE: 0px; BORDER-TOP: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; HEIGHT: 0px; BORDER-RIGHT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; BORDER-BOTTOM: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; PADDING-TOP: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; MARGIN: 5px 0px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid; LINE-HEIGHT: 0; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px"></DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> Joe Perkel <<A href="mailto:josephperkel@yahoo.com" shape=rect rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:josephperkel@yahoo.com">josephperkel@yahoo.com</A>><BR clear=none><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> Psubbers Mailist <<A href="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org" shape=rect rel=nofollow target=_blank ymailto="mailto:personal_submersibles@psubs.org">personal_submersibles@psubs.org</A>> <BR clear=none><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Saturday, October 12, 2013 7:17 PM<BR
clear=none><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [PSUBS-MAILIST] Thrusters, Air & Diesel Musings<BR clear=none></FONT></DIV>
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<DIV>Some quick questions / observations / musing come to mind as I sit here editing <VAR id=yiv7132421959yui-ie-cursor></VAR>videos.</DIV>
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<DIV>It looks to me like Alvin's thrusters all have a 90 deg drive arrangement like yacht bow thrusters. Some of these off the <SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-0>shelf</SPAN> units are hydraulic, but way over powered for a Delta / Gamma sized sub. <SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-1><SPAN>There</SPAN></SPAN> are however, lots of little hydraulic motors out there, a slew of them. Ive also seen drive components, reductions, etc, that simply were not available to George. How much trouble would it be to go hydraulic all around? </DIV>
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<DIV>If DC motors must be used, in my view then the single must have improvement to the T-Rex design is the addition of a mag coupling.</DIV>
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<DIV><SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-2>Alecs</SPAN> <SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-3><SPAN>experience</SPAN></SPAN> has me rethinking self sufficiency. It would be nice to charge the batteries and the HP tanks independent of a surface boat, eliminating the need to raft alongside in swells. All this <SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-4><SPAN>convenience</SPAN></SPAN> means a "Tours 66" type of arrangement. But Tours 66 weighed in at 10 tons.</DIV>
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<DIV>Everything is now downsized like that little AC unit I posted,.. take a look at this marine gen-set (note dimensions) <A href="http://www.nextgenerationpower.com/Info/Support/3-5Specs.pdf" shape=rect rel=nofollow target=_blank>http://www.nextgenerationpower.com/Info/Support/3-5Specs.pdf</A> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-5>Hmm</SPAN>, could this not be enclosed in the hull during a build, or otherwise slung longways down the hatch into a 42" hull? No prop shaft and seals, (you still get towed) but <SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-6><SPAN>independent</SPAN></SPAN> re-<SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-7><SPAN>charge</SPAN></SPAN> capability for both batteries and HP air with an equally downsized compressor!?! </DIV>
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<DIV>So the question of the day is,...</DIV>
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<DIV>Is a comfy air conditioned & self sufficient research capable PSUB for sport diving in Florida / <SPAN id=yiv7132421959misspell-9><SPAN>Caribbean</SPAN></SPAN> waters, a realistic goal at around 3.5 tons and $8-$10 lb?</DIV>
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