From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 2 23:40:42 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 16:40:42 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics Message-ID: <32A0AFFE-E039-4893-9936-9A7A72522FD7@yahoo.com> Wandered on to the Blue Robotics site & saw these reasonably priced cable penetrators that may be of use to someone. https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/connectors/penetrator-10-25-a-8mm-r2/ If I used them I would go over the cable jacket with a good pvc glue. They also have a 1500 lumen light for $99- that is rated to 300 meters. https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/electronics/lumen-light-r1/ Alan Sent from my iPad -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 10:43:26 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 10:43:26 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer Message-ID: <002301d33c55$f93dcce0$ebb966a0$@gmail.com> Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves - can anyone recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run a trolling motor or two? Just musing here for now. Thanks. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 10:59:38 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 10:59:38 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics Message-ID: <002801d33c58$3c7251f0$b556f5d0$@gmail.com> What a great site!!! All sorts of ways for me to spend money. Servos . hmmm .. Might be small, but maybe one of them could be powerful enough to work as an external rear thruster actuator . Hmmm .. Mount the new motor on Delrin bearings so basically frictionless in water .. Hmmm .. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 11:07:38 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (k6fee via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2017 08:07:38 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer Message-ID: <831527.5364.bm@smtp210.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Brian, It will need to be a converter as transformers only work on AC not DC voltage. The difference is a converter uses a chopper circuit to convert the DC to AC so it can then raise or lower the voltage to the desired value then rectifies it back to DC. Keith T? Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message --------From: Brian via Personal_Submersibles Date: 10/3/17 7:43 AM (GMT-08:00) To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer ?? Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves ? can anyone recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run a trolling motor or two?? Just musing here for now.? Thanks.?? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 11:12:44 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 11:12:44 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer Message-ID: <003901d33c5a$10c31560$32494020$@gmail.com> Yes, so is there one you'd recommend? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 11:17:43 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 11:17:43 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v converter Message-ID: <004001d33c5a$c3173e80$4945bb80$@gmail.com> Largest I can find online is 40A -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 12:48:17 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 16:48:17 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer In-Reply-To: <002301d33c55$f93dcce0$ebb966a0$@gmail.com> References: <002301d33c55$f93dcce0$ebb966a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2104515685.597521.1507049297357@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,In a pinch for testing etc, you can take 24v off your 36v bank. ?I have done it lots but 12v of 36v bank, it will mess up the 36v performance but it works. ?I am not saying it is a good idea, just saying it works.Hank On Tuesday, October 3, 2017, 8:43:43 AM MDT, Brian via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ? ? Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves ? can anyone recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run a trolling motor or two?? Just musing here for now.? Thanks. ? ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 13:32:50 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 19:32:50 +0200 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Sub on TV Message-ID: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> Not the first tv action I shared with you but the video work is very nice. For those who don't understand Dutch; The challenge was : How to make a selfie with the world champion kickboxing (without being hit) Klaas did drive the sub himself and Rico Verhoeven was really suprised https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VBx_OQ6MR8 BR Emile -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 14:19:09 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 14:19:09 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 52, Issue 1 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Brian, I've been looking at higher current dc-dc converters recently. The brand I've been looking at is "Vicor." Other brands I've used are Pololu and Dimension Engineering. River J Dolfi Rdolfi7 at gmail.com 412-997-2526 <(412)%20997-2526> On Oct 3, 2017 10:11 AM, "via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > personal_submersibles-owner at psubs.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Personal_Submersibles digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: magnetic linear actuator (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) > 2. Blue Robotics (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) > 3. 36v to 24v transformer (Brian via Personal_Submersibles) > 4. Re: Blue Robotics (Brian via Personal_Submersibles) > 5. Re: 36v to 24v transformer (k6fee via Personal_Submersibles) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2017 04:28:03 +1300 > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] magnetic linear actuator > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Hank, > you mean like a solenoid with a long stroke? > I have been designing a solenoid operated ballast valve but haven't got > round to working out how many turns of wire, how much force I need & > how many amps it will draw. > A lot of solenoids have a short duty cycle, as they heat up pretty quick. > I would imagine this could be a problem if you wanted to hold something > in position for a long time. > Alan > > > Sent from my iPad > > > On 30/09/2017, at 10:32 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > > > Alan, > > I have not taken one apart yet but it sounds like it is a tricky one. I > was hoping there was some sort of magnetic rail actuator. I have been > Googling around but have not found anything yet. I have had superb results > with electro magnets under water (fresh) and figure that could be the > answer. I will keep looking. > > Hank > > > > On Friday, September 29, 2017, 8:07:33 PM MDT, Alan via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > > > > Hank, > > I spent a lot of time investigating oil compensation of linear actuators > along > > with Frank.. He was looking at the Lenco trim tab actuators. > > Have several. The motors in them are small & brushed & run rough in > > oil. When the rod extends that leaves a void inside the actuator that > needs > > to be filled. So you end up with an external oil reservoir to fill the > actuator > > with ambient pressure oil as it extends. ( so why not just push it out > with the oil) > > There are micro switches that I drilled with tiny holes, to let ambient > pressure > > in so they didn't trigger under pressure. Also there are electronics in > some > > actuators that may be effected by pressure. And of course there is the > wiring > > going in to the actuator that needs sealing & the seals on the rod that > may need replacing. > > Much simpler to use hydraulics. I did see an electric manipulator > operating > > at the Underwater Intervention Convention. Can't recall it's name. > > From time to time I have a google on robot sites to see what is new. > Or > > Alibaba to see if the Chinese have come up with anything cheap. > > Nearly bought a kids hydraulic arm toy that you assemble, with view to > > scaling up out of aluminium. > > Keep thinking, but the robotics World is big & if there is a new & > easier way > > of doing it they'll find it. > > Alan > > > > > > Sent from my iPad > > > >> On 30/09/2017, at 1:08 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> > >> I have been brain storming looking for a less expensive and less > complicated means of building manipulators. The obvious choice would be > electric liner actuators, oil filled etc. Then I was thinking about a > magnetic actuator like a mag lev rail. Is there such a thing? You know, > add more voltage and the actuator moves out further. Any ideas? > >> Hank > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: 20171001/1eb29d67/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 16:40:42 +1300 > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics > Message-ID: <32A0AFFE-E039-4893-9936-9A7A72522FD7 at yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > Wandered on to the Blue Robotics site & saw these reasonably priced > cable penetrators that may be of use to someone. > https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/connectors/penetrator-10-25-a-8mm-r2/ > If I used them I would go over the cable jacket with a good pvc glue. > They also have a 1500 lumen light for $99- that is rated to 300 meters. > https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/electronics/lumen-light-r1/ > Alan > > > > Sent from my iPad > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: 20171003/f459d555/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 10:43:26 -0400 > From: Brian via Personal_Submersibles > > To: > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer > Message-ID: <002301d33c55$f93dcce0$ebb966a0$@gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > > > Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves - can anyone > recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run a > trolling motor or two? Just musing here for now. Thanks. > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: 20171003/1708d744/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 10:59:38 -0400 > From: Brian via Personal_Submersibles > > To: > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics > Message-ID: <002801d33c58$3c7251f0$b556f5d0$@gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > What a great site!!! All sorts of ways for me to spend money. Servos . > hmmm > .. Might be small, but maybe one of them could be powerful enough to work > as > an external rear thruster actuator . Hmmm .. Mount the new motor on Delrin > bearings so basically frictionless in water .. Hmmm .. > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: 20171003/e99d6268/attachment-0001.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2017 08:07:38 -0700 > From: k6fee via Personal_Submersibles > > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer > Message-ID: <831527.5364.bm at smtp210.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Brian, > It will need to be a converter as transformers only work on AC not DC > voltage. > The difference is a converter uses a chopper circuit to convert the DC to > AC so it can then raise or lower the voltage to the desired value then > rectifies it back to DC. > Keith T? > > > Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone > -------- Original message --------From: Brian via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> Date: 10/3/17 7:43 AM (GMT-08:00) To: > personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v > transformer > ?? Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves ? can > anyone recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run > a trolling motor or two?? Just musing here for now.? Thanks.?? > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: 20171003/76f6725e/attachment.html> > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 52, Issue 1 > **************************************************** > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 15:42:01 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 08:42:01 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer In-Reply-To: <002301d33c55$f93dcce0$ebb966a0$@gmail.com> References: <002301d33c55$f93dcce0$ebb966a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <681537D2-A032-47F2-837E-946BDBDB08CC@yahoo.com> Brian, what other items do you have that run off 36V. Can't you just run a 24V system seeing that that voltage will belong to your main energy consumer.. You could look at a boost converter to bump the voltage up to 36V for any other items. There are a lot of cheap boost converters around & you wouldn't require the high amp draw for the other electronics. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 4/10/2017, at 3:43 AM, Brian via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves ? can anyone recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run a trolling motor or two? Just musing here for now. Thanks. > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 16:33:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 09:33:14 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Sub on TV In-Reply-To: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> References: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> Message-ID: <0B3EC129-3D0D-48F2-914D-4A31E277D354@yahoo.com> Great video Emile, enjoyed it. Brings back memories. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 4/10/2017, at 6:32 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Not the first tv action I shared with you but the video work is very nice. > For those who don?t understand Dutch; The challenge was : How to make a selfie with the world champion kickboxing (without being hit) Klaas did drive the sub himself and Rico Verhoeven was really suprised > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VBx_OQ6MR8 > > > BR Emile > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 17:30:01 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 21:30:01 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Sub on TV In-Reply-To: <0B3EC129-3D0D-48F2-914D-4A31E277D354@yahoo.com> References: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> <0B3EC129-3D0D-48F2-914D-4A31E277D354@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <664197231.779271.1507066201832@mail.yahoo.com> Excellent video Emile, ?your having to much fin I see.Hank On Tuesday, October 3, 2017, 2:33:36 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Great video Emile, enjoyed it.Brings back memories.Alan Sent from my iPad On 4/10/2017, at 6:32 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv0434069598 #yiv0434069598 -- _filtered #yiv0434069598 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv0434069598 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}#yiv0434069598 #yiv0434069598 p.yiv0434069598MsoNormal, #yiv0434069598 li.yiv0434069598MsoNormal, #yiv0434069598 div.yiv0434069598MsoNormal {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:11.0pt;}#yiv0434069598 a:link, #yiv0434069598 span.yiv0434069598MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv0434069598 a:visited, #yiv0434069598 span.yiv0434069598MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv0434069598 span.yiv0434069598E-mailStijl17 {color:windowtext;}#yiv0434069598 .yiv0434069598MsoChpDefault {} _filtered #yiv0434069598 {margin:70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt;}#yiv0434069598 div.yiv0434069598WordSection1 {}#yiv0434069598 Not the first tv action I shared with you but the video work is very nice. For those who don?t understand Dutch; The challenge was : How to make a selfie with the world champion kickboxing (without being hit) Klaas did drive the sub himself and Rico Verhoeven was really suprised https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VBx_OQ6MR8 ? ? BR Emile _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs..org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 3 23:01:42 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 03 Oct 2017 21:01:42 -0600 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer In-Reply-To: zORrdIZtTOUUczORsdJWcT References: zORrdIZtTOUUczORsdJWcT Message-ID: <29fde8f9-d165-4eb7-b562-fd45b7f86502@email.android.com> A bit of clarification: Transformers change one AC voltage to another. Rectifiers convert AC to DC. Inverters convert DC to AC. (rectifier --> inverter) is a variable frequency drive. (inverter --> rectifier) is a DC-DC converter. Sorry, can't help you with specifics. I don't deal much with DC components. Sean On October 3, 2017 8:43:26 AM MDT, Brian via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > >Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves - can >anyone >recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run a >trolling motor or two? Just musing here for now. Thanks. > > > > > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >Personal_Submersibles mailing list >Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 02:13:49 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 08:13:49 +0200 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer In-Reply-To: <29fde8f9-d165-4eb7-b562-fd45b7f86502@email.android.com> References: zORrdIZtTOUUczORsdJWcT <29fde8f9-d165-4eb7-b562-fd45b7f86502@email.android.com> Message-ID: <04db01d33cd7$f1fe81e0$d5fb85a0$@nl> Don?t know it already discussed. But; The convertors often give electrical noise on sonars and communications. So it you use sonar, they should be well build, screened or avoided. BR, emile Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: woensdag 4 oktober 2017 5:02 Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Onderwerp: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer A bit of clarification: Transformers change one AC voltage to another. Rectifiers convert AC to DC. Inverters convert DC to AC. (rectifier --> inverter) is a variable frequency drive. (inverter --> rectifier) is a DC-DC converter. Sorry, can't help you with specifics. I don't deal much with DC components. Sean On October 3, 2017 8:43:26 AM MDT, Brian via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves ? can anyone recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run a trolling motor or two? Just musing here for now. Thanks. _____ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 07:20:10 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 12:20:10 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Sub on TV In-Reply-To: <664197231.779271.1507066201832@mail.yahoo.com> References: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> <0B3EC129-3D0D-48F2-914D-4A31E277D354@yahoo.com> <664197231.779271.1507066201832@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Great video Emile. Your getting to be quite a celebrity! regards James On 3 October 2017 at 22:30, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Excellent video Emile, your having to much fin I see. > Hank > > On Tuesday, October 3, 2017, 2:33:36 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > > Great video Emile, enjoyed it. > Brings back memories. > Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > On 4/10/2017, at 6:32 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Not the first tv action I shared with you but the video work is very nice. > > For those who don?t understand Dutch; The challenge was : How to make a > selfie with the world champion kickboxing (without being hit) Klaas did > drive the sub himself and Rico Verhoeven was really suprised > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VBx_OQ6MR8 > > > > > > BR Emile > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs..org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 07:56:55 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 11:56:55 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer In-Reply-To: <002301d33c55$f93dcce0$ebb966a0$@gmail.com> References: <002301d33c55$f93dcce0$ebb966a0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <436508221.1173902.1507118215803@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,?Opps, I had the wrong Brian witch means wrong sub. ?In the case of a K350 my idea to take 24v off the bank for testing will not work. ?But, if you are using the 24v for side thrusters, you will likely use as much 24v as 36v. ?How about use one battery pod for 24v and the other pod for 36v. ?Just make 24v bank in one pod.Hank On Tuesday, October 3, 2017, 8:43:43 AM MDT, Brian via Personal_Submersibles wrote: ? ? Before I start scouring the web and before I make any moves ? can anyone recommend a 36v to 24v transformer that supports enough amps to run a trolling motor or two?? Just musing here for now.? Thanks. ? ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 10:44:16 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 07:44:16 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics Message-ID: <20171004074416.DDF20E41@m0117458.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 11:05:57 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 11:05:57 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Shallow Water Helmet Message-ID: <001001d33d22$487eac80$d97c0580$@gmail.com> One of my other hobbies/passions is collecting and using shallow water diving helmets. Both my kids grew up learning how to walk along the bottom of a pool. A really cool looking version just popped up on eBay. I already have more than enough of these toys, but this might be of interest to someone who wants the latest in pool toys. Hook it up with a Gast wobble compressor, a Keene Engineering tank or other way to smooth out the pulses, and you're in business. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Diving-Helmet-dive-helmet-maritime-scuba-/3227888668 33?hash=item4b27b73b11:g:~WkAAOSwfRdZKi~g Brian -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 14:54:22 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 14:54:22 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v to 24v transformer Message-ID: <003701d33d42$317a9790$946fc6b0$@gmail.com> Harold is setup with two banks - 12v and 36v. Both are redundant as the sub has two banks each - ten batteries total. Two sets of three in series for the 36v, two sets of two in parallel for the 12v. After much reflection decided to go with 45lb 12v side thrusters. They can pull from the 12v bank. For maneuvering I think they'll be plenty. They'll be on a motor controller as will the 101lb 36v rear thruster. Got just the motor heads for $100.00 each so a score on that. Will probably attach 3 bladed props. I have a couple of 10A 36v to 12v converters already so I'm thinking maybe I'll pull 12v off the 36v bank to run some other things like external lights. I can mount them in the box that currently has the motor solenoids as I won't need them for the side thrusters. Might be able to get a motor controller in there too. Harold was originally designed to use those huge Honeywell 36v motors so I figure I have overkill reserve battery power once I switch the thrusters to trolling motors. Maynard added more batteries than the original Kittredge design. Thanks for all the input. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 14:56:02 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 18:56:02 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PWM controllers References: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823@mail.yahoo.com> Hi All,When a dc motor is speed ?controlled with a PWM controller is the motor at full power regardless of rpm?Hank -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 15:04:22 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 15:04:22 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Sub on TV In-Reply-To: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> References: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> Message-ID: <57de92dd-c381-2ff0-9f0e-29ee258e5e6d@psubs.org> Great work Emile!! On 10/3/2017 1:32 PM, emile via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Not the first tv action I shared with you but the video work is very > nice. > > For those who don?t understand Dutch; The challenge was : How to make > a selfie with the world champion kickboxing (without being hit) Klaas > did drive the sub himself and Rico Verhoeven was really suprised > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VBx_OQ6MR8 > > BR Emile > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 15:33:36 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 08:33:36 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PWM controllers In-Reply-To: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823@mail.yahoo.com> References: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Hank, yes. If you have your speed controller on full speed there would be no pulsing of the power to the motor, it would be fully on. You can have full power & no rpm in a stall situation. Most modern controllers I have seen have current limiting that you can program in; so in a stall or overloaded situation it would back off the power. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 5/10/2017, at 7:56 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi All, > When a dc motor is speed controlled with a PWM controller is the motor at full power regardless of rpm? > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 15:50:51 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 08:50:51 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics In-Reply-To: <20171004074416.DDF20E41@m0117458.ppops.net> References: <20171004074416.DDF20E41@m0117458.ppops.net> Message-ID: <68A4E2B5-BB22-464B-8CED-907936561392@yahoo.com> Brian, here is a link to two lights that are daisy chained to a single penetrator. https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/rov/lumen-set-r1/ You can just wire this straight to a switch inside your sub for on/off. If you want to have a dimming function, it is saying that you need pwm & that it is compatible with Arduino or raspberry Pi. It has the code & instructions for setting up the pwm dimming control. There may be something else about that you can just wire up to & turn a knob to get pwm dimming. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 5/10/2017, at 3:44 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Alan, I like that light. How hard would it be to wire up all the electronics to make it work? What additional components would I need to make that work? > > > Brian Cox > > > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics > Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 16:40:42 +1300 > > Wandered on to the Blue Robotics site & saw these reasonably priced > cable penetrators that may be of use to someone. > https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/connectors/penetrator-10-25-a-8mm-r2/ > If I used them I would go over the cable jacket with a good pvc glue. > They also have a 1500 lumen light for $99- that is rated to 300 meters. > https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/electronics/lumen-light-r1/ > Alan > > > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 16:24:44 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 20:24:44 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PWM controllers In-Reply-To: References: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1461607131.1556630.1507148684505@mail.yahoo.com> Alan,If I have a 1\4 hp motor and I have the controller turning the motor at say 50 rpm, is the motor giving me 1\4 hp at 50 rpm?Hank On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 1:33:59 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Hank,yes. If you have your speed controller on full speed there would be nopulsing of the power to the motor, it would be fully on.You can have full power & no rpm in a stall situation. Most moderncontrollers I have seen have current limiting that you can program in;so in a stall or overloaded situation it would back off the power.Alan Sent from my iPad On 5/10/2017, at 7:56 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi All,When a dc motor is speed ?controlled with a PWM controller is the motor at full power regardless of rpm?Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 17:27:43 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 10:27:43 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PWM controllers In-Reply-To: <1461607131.1556630.1507148684505@mail.yahoo.com> References: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823@mail.yahoo.com> <1461607131.1556630.1507148684505@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6949D218-8E94-4772-8470-FB3ACD2DD9BF@yahoo.com> Hank, tutorial on torque & speed! http://lancet.mit.edu/motors/motors3.html another on understanding gearbox design http://www.instructables.com/id/Understanding-Motor-and-Gearbox-Design/ In a nut shell your maximum power is at about half your no load speed. So run the motor with no load & check the rpm of the output shaft with a tachometer, then check the rpm under load to make sure it is around half of the no load rpm. So in your case if the rpm under load was half the no load speed it would be close to the motors rated power. Cheers Alan Sent from my iPad > On 5/10/2017, at 9:24 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Alan, > If I have a 1\4 hp motor and I have the controller turning the motor at say 50 rpm, is the motor giving me 1\4 hp at 50 rpm? > Hank > > On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 1:33:59 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hi Hank, > yes. If you have your speed controller on full speed there would be no > pulsing of the power to the motor, it would be fully on. > You can have full power & no rpm in a stall situation. Most modern > controllers I have seen have current limiting that you can program in; > so in a stall or overloaded situation it would back off the power. > Alan > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On 5/10/2017, at 7:56 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> When a dc motor is speed controlled with a PWM controller is the motor at full power regardless of rpm? >> Hank >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 18:39:21 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 22:39:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PWM controllers In-Reply-To: <6949D218-8E94-4772-8470-FB3ACD2DD9BF@yahoo.com> References: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823@mail.yahoo.com> <1461607131.1556630.1507148684505@mail.yahoo.com> <6949D218-8E94-4772-8470-FB3ACD2DD9BF@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <224522403.1627647.1507156761904@mail.yahoo.com> Thanks AlanHank On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 3:28:06 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,tutorial on torque & speed!http://lancet.mit.edu/motors/motors3.htmlanother on understanding gearbox designhttp://www.instructables.com/id/Understanding-Motor-and-Gearbox-Design/In a nut shell your maximum power is at about half your no load speed.So run the motor with no load & check the rpm of the output shaft with a tachometer, then check the rpm under load to make sure it is around half of the no load rpm.So in your case if the rpm under load was half the no load speed it would be close to themotors rated power.Cheers Alan Sent from my iPad On 5/10/2017, at 9:24 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Alan,If I have a 1\4 hp motor and I have the controller turning the motor at say 50 rpm, is the motor giving me 1\4 hp at 50 rpm?Hank On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 1:33:59 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Hank,yes. If you have your speed controller on full speed there would be nopulsing of the power to the motor, it would be fully on.You can have full power & no rpm in a stall situation. Most moderncontrollers I have seen have current limiting that you can program in;so in a stall or overloaded situation it would back off the power.Alan Sent from my iPad On 5/10/2017, at 7:56 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi All,When a dc motor is speed ?controlled with a PWM controller is the motor at full power regardless of rpm?Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 18:47:51 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 11:47:51 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PWM controllers In-Reply-To: <1461607131.1556630.1507148684505@mail.yahoo.com> References: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823@mail.yahoo.com> <1461607131.1556630.1507148684505@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, are you working out the gearing for your electric manipulator? I worked out that that 1/4 horsepower motor could lift 18kg, 1 metre in 1 second. Not bad for a tiny little motor! They are selling 200W brushless motors for $14 on Hobby King. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 5/10/2017, at 9:24 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Alan, > If I have a 1\4 hp motor and I have the controller turning the motor at say 50 rpm, is the motor giving me 1\4 hp at 50 rpm? > Hank > > On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 1:33:59 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hi Hank, > yes. If you have your speed controller on full speed there would be no > pulsing of the power to the motor, it would be fully on. > You can have full power & no rpm in a stall situation. Most modern > controllers I have seen have current limiting that you can program in; > so in a stall or overloaded situation it would back off the power. > Alan > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On 5/10/2017, at 7:56 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> When a dc motor is speed controlled with a PWM controller is the motor at full power regardless of rpm? >> Hank >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 19:35:49 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 23:35:49 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] PWM controllers In-Reply-To: References: <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <2095738772.1505079.1507143362823@mail.yahoo.com> <1461607131.1556630.1507148684505@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1500142198.1658773.1507160149158@mail.yahoo.com> Alan,That 1\4 hp was just an example. ?I am building my own pressure proof electric liner actuators to build two arms on Gamma. ?I have a motor type in mind and will start testing it for power and speed this weekend. ?That is why I want to know if the PWM ?will effect the power output. ?Hank On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 4:48:12 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,are you working out the gearing for your electric manipulator?I worked out that that 1/4 horsepower motor could lift 18kg, 1 metre in1 second. Not bad for a tiny little motor! They are selling 200Wbrushless motors for $14 on Hobby King.Alan Sent from my iPad On 5/10/2017, at 9:24 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Alan,If I have a 1\4 hp motor and I have the controller turning the motor at say 50 rpm, is the motor giving me 1\4 hp at 50 rpm?Hank On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 1:33:59 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Hank,yes. If you have your speed controller on full speed there would be nopulsing of the power to the motor, it would be fully on.You can have full power & no rpm in a stall situation. Most moderncontrollers I have seen have current limiting that you can program in;so in a stall or overloaded situation it would back off the power.Alan Sent from my iPad On 5/10/2017, at 7:56 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi All,When a dc motor is speed ?controlled with a PWM controller is the motor at full power regardless of rpm?Hank _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 21:41:06 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 18:41:06 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics Message-ID: <20171004184106.DDF1C03A@m0117457.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 22:27:10 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 15:27:10 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics In-Reply-To: <20171004184106.DDF1C03A@m0117457.ppops.net> References: <20171004184106.DDF1C03A@m0117457.ppops.net> Message-ID: Brian, if you made the through hull yourself you could. I bought a bunch of stainless fittings that you can fit in to a blue globe cable gland & expoxy the wiring in to. The hole going through them reduced in size with a step so that you could key the epoxy in & it couldn't be extruded through. The blue robotics team are reasonably small & would probably sell the daisy chained lights without the through hull. Another option would be to use their through hull & take the thread off on the lathe, if you think it will then fit your compression fitting. It may be anodised, so make sure any exposed aluminium is inside the compression fitting. I am away for another 2 weeks so can't tell you what my stainless fitting is. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 5/10/2017, at 2:41 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Alan, What about the wires on that unit? On my marine radio I'm using the compression fittings that go into a 1/2" female coupling where the coax gets compressed and seals down to 900 feet. But the coax is a solid wire with plastic core, the wires on this light are just three wires in a sheath, doesn't seem like it would seal with my compression fittings. Any way to make it go through a compression fitting? > > Brian > > > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics > Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 08:50:51 +1300 > > Brian, > here is a link to two lights that are daisy chained to a single penetrator.. > https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/rov/lumen-set-r1/ > You can just wire this straight to a switch inside your sub for on/off. > If you want to have a dimming function, it is saying that you need pwm > & that it is compatible with Arduino or raspberry Pi. It has the code & > instructions for setting up the pwm dimming control. There may be something > else about that you can just wire up to & turn a knob to get pwm dimming. > Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > On 5/10/2017, at 3:44 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Alan, I like that light. How hard would it be to wire up all the electronics to make it work? What additional components would I need to make that work? > > > Brian Cox > > > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics > Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 16:40:42 +1300 > > Wandered on to the Blue Robotics site & saw these reasonably priced > cable penetrators that may be of use to someone. > https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/connectors/penetrator-10-25-a-8mm-r2/ > If I used them I would go over the cable jacket with a good pvc glue. > They also have a 1500 lumen light for $99- that is rated to 300 meters. > https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/electronics/lumen-light-r1/ > Alan > > > > Sent from my iPad > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 22:52:25 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 15:52:25 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics In-Reply-To: References: <20171004184106.DDF1C03A@m0117457.ppops.net> Message-ID: Brian, I was using something similar to this. Just google 316 straight adapter parker on image search & you'll find some. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 5/10/2017, at 3:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Brian, > if you made the through hull yourself you could. > I bought a bunch of stainless fittings that you can fit in to a blue > globe cable gland & expoxy the wiring in to. The hole going through > them reduced in size with a step so that you could key the epoxy in > & it couldn't be extruded through. > The blue robotics team are reasonably small & would probably sell > the daisy chained lights without the through hull. > Another option would be to use their through hull & take the thread > off on the lathe, if you think it will then fit your compression fitting. > It may be anodised, so make sure any exposed aluminium is inside > the compression fitting. > I am away for another 2 weeks so can't tell you what my stainless > fitting is. > Alan > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On 5/10/2017, at 2:41 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> Alan, What about the wires on that unit? On my marine radio I'm using the compression fittings that go into a 1/2" female coupling where the coax gets compressed and seals down to 900 feet. But the coax is a solid wire with plastic core, the wires on this light are just three wires in a sheath, doesn't seem like it would seal with my compression fittings. Any way to make it go through a compression fitting? >> >> Brian >> >> >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics >> Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 08:50:51 +1300 >> >> Brian, >> here is a link to two lights that are daisy chained to a single penetrator. >> https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/rov/lumen-set-r1/ >> You can just wire this straight to a switch inside your sub for on/off. >> If you want to have a dimming function, it is saying that you need pwm >> & that it is compatible with Arduino or raspberry Pi. It has the code & >> instructions for setting up the pwm dimming control. There may be something >> else about that you can just wire up to & turn a knob to get pwm dimming. >> Alan >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On 5/10/2017, at 3:44 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> Alan, I like that light. How hard would it be to wire up all the electronics to make it work? What additional components would I need to make that work? >> >> >> Brian Cox >> >> >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org >> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics >> Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 16:40:42 +1300 >> >> Wandered on to the Blue Robotics site & saw these reasonably priced >> cable penetrators that may be of use to someone. >> https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/connectors/penetrator-10-25-a-8mm-r2/ >> If I used them I would go over the cable jacket with a good pvc glue. >> They also have a 1500 lumen light for $99- that is rated to 300 meters. >> https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/electronics/lumen-light-r1/ >> Alan >> >> >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image1.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 13313 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 23:03:45 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 16:03:45 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics In-Reply-To: References: <20171004184106.DDF1C03A@m0117457.ppops.net> Message-ID: <3A9A00CD-6D66-4AE5-997A-7ECCC63BDFCD@yahoo.com> Brian, thinking some more! It would probably be better to buy something similar to this below. Or a 316 adapter with o- ring. If there is no step in hole size inside, then drill it out. Then you can do away with the compression fitting & have one place it can leak rather than 2. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 5/10/2017, at 3:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Brian, > if you made the through hull yourself you could. > I bought a bunch of stainless fittings that you can fit in to a blue > globe cable gland & expoxy the wiring in to. The hole going through > them reduced in size with a step so that you could key the epoxy in > & it couldn't be extruded through. > The blue robotics team are reasonably small & would probably sell > the daisy chained lights without the through hull. > Another option would be to use their through hull & take the thread > off on the lathe, if you think it will then fit your compression fitting. > It may be anodised, so make sure any exposed aluminium is inside > the compression fitting. > I am away for another 2 weeks so can't tell you what my stainless > fitting is. > Alan > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On 5/10/2017, at 2:41 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> Alan, What about the wires on that unit? On my marine radio I'm using the compression fittings that go into a 1/2" female coupling where the coax gets compressed and seals down to 900 feet. But the coax is a solid wire with plastic core, the wires on this light are just three wires in a sheath, doesn't seem like it would seal with my compression fittings. Any way to make it go through a compression fitting? >> >> Brian >> >> >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics >> Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 08:50:51 +1300 >> >> Brian, >> here is a link to two lights that are daisy chained to a single penetrator. >> https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/rov/lumen-set-r1/ >> You can just wire this straight to a switch inside your sub for on/off. >> If you want to have a dimming function, it is saying that you need pwm >> & that it is compatible with Arduino or raspberry Pi. It has the code & >> instructions for setting up the pwm dimming control. There may be something >> else about that you can just wire up to & turn a knob to get pwm dimming. >> Alan >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On 5/10/2017, at 3:44 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> Alan, I like that light. How hard would it be to wire up all the electronics to make it work? What additional components would I need to make that work? >> >> >> Brian Cox >> >> >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org >> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Blue Robotics >> Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 16:40:42 +1300 >> >> Wandered on to the Blue Robotics site & saw these reasonably priced >> cable penetrators that may be of use to someone. >> https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/connectors/penetrator-10-25-a-8mm-r2/ >> If I used them I would go over the cable jacket with a good pvc glue. >> They also have a 1500 lumen light for $99- that is rated to 300 meters. >> https://www.bluerobotics.com/store/electronics/lumen-light-r1/ >> Alan >> >> >> >> Sent from my iPad >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image1.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128522 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 23:08:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (roberto alvarez via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2017 20:08:14 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Sub on TV In-Reply-To: <57de92dd-c381-2ff0-9f0e-29ee258e5e6d@psubs.org> References: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> <57de92dd-c381-2ff0-9f0e-29ee258e5e6d@psubs.org> Message-ID: This vedeo make me search for Cornelius Drebbel, did some one read and have the information about her fifth ecense of the air, on the description that i found, he open a bottle and just a drop was able to clean the air, more info? any idea ? 2017-10-04 12:04 GMT-07:00 Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org>: > > Great work Emile!! > > On 10/3/2017 1:32 PM, emile via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Not the first tv action I shared with you but the video work is very nice. > > For those who don?t understand Dutch; The challenge was : How to make a > selfie with the world champion kickboxing (without being hit) Klaas did > drive the sub himself and Rico Verhoeven was really suprised > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VBx_OQ6MR8 > > > > > > BR Emile > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 4 23:15:49 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 03:15:49 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Marine trim tab actuator Message-ID: The electric version. Anyone know if they'd be water proof at depth? Get Outlook for Android -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 5 00:05:07 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 17:05:07 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Marine trim tab actuator In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5AB9BA73-6286-4FD5-BAF2-33E02DC8904B@yahoo.com> Brian, can't remember off hand but I don't recall them being able to be submersed too far. They are regarded as waterproof! We had a good look at the Lenco trim tab actuator a number of years ago, with Frank giving a talk on electric linear actuators at a Psub conference. I fibreglassed over one & oil compensated it. I was going to mount a rubber boot over the piston, but gave up on it. Hank is looking at making up his own compensated actuator for an electric manipulator. ( hope that wasn't a secret Hank) Alan Sent from my iPad > On 5/10/2017, at 4:15 PM, Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > The electric version. Anyone know if they'd be water proof at depth? > > > > Get Outlook for Android > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 5 03:58:27 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 09:58:27 +0200 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Sub on TV In-Reply-To: References: <049301d33c6d$a2f71540$e8e53fc0$@nl> <57de92dd-c381-2ff0-9f0e-29ee258e5e6d@psubs.org> Message-ID: <05e601d33daf$ba78b3c0$2f6a1b40$@nl> Roberto, It was said the he made oxygen by heating Kalium nitrate. Sounds possible as he was also into chemistry (called alchemy back then..) Unfortunately the submarine project was not well documented. The English dived actually the wooden replica! Br, Emile Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens roberto alvarez via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: donderdag 5 oktober 2017 5:08 Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Onderwerp: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Sub on TV This vedeo make me search for Cornelius Drebbel, did some one read and have the information about her fifth ecense of the air, on the description that i found, he open a bottle and just a drop was able to clean the air, more info? any idea ? 2017-10-04 12:04 GMT-07:00 Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles : Great work Emile!! On 10/3/2017 1:32 PM, emile via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Not the first tv action I shared with you but the video work is very nice. For those who don?t understand Dutch; The challenge was : How to make a selfie with the world champion kickboxing (without being hit) Klaas did drive the sub himself and Rico Verhoeven was really suprised https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VBx_OQ6MR8 BR Emile _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 5 05:49:23 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 09:49:23 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Marine trim tab actuator In-Reply-To: <5AB9BA73-6286-4FD5-BAF2-33E02DC8904B@yahoo.com> References: <5AB9BA73-6286-4FD5-BAF2-33E02DC8904B@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1418307123.1878674.1507196963173@mail.yahoo.com> Most electric actuators are ip65 or ip66, so they can be sprayed with water. ?You can get ip69 rated so they can be submerged is all. ?I am making a version that can handle 500 feet without extra compensating. ?The actuators will be under a constant internal pressure all the time. ?The internal pressure is not to prevent leakage but rather to reinforce the light body. ?I will put one in my chamber and see if the internal pressure is actually needed. ?I am just planning ahead and expect to add air.Hank On Wednesday, October 4, 2017, 10:05:49 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Brian,can't remember off hand but I don't recall them being able to besubmersed too far. They are regarded as waterproof!We had a good look at the Lenco trim tab actuator a number ofyears ago, with Frank giving a talk on electric linear actuators at a?Psub conference.I fibreglassed over one & oil compensated it. I was going to mount a rubber?boot over the piston, but gave up on it.Hank is looking at making up his own compensated actuator foran electric manipulator. ( hope that wasn't a secret Hank)?Alan Sent from my iPad On 5/10/2017, at 4:15 PM, Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles wrote: The electric version. Anyone know if they'd be water proof at depth? Get Outlook for Android _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 5 07:01:25 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 5 Oct 2017 11:01:25 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Marine trim tab actuator Message-ID: I bought a couple of cheap ones to play with and they got me thinking. Internally I'm contemplating one on the variable ballast tank lever so I won't have reach back behind the seat to open/close. It works currently in a low tech way, but I have to get off the seat and crouch down, giving a less than ideal view of when the boat has completely submerged. Externally I'm thinking something on the rear thruster, getting rid of all the linkage that runs forward to the foot bar. Could be directly attached to the motor housing or maybe a cable, like a motorcycle brake cable, attached to a pivoting bar where the eMotor is enclosed and just an o-ring sealed shaft poking out to lever it. Things to muse upon. Get Outlook for Android -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 6 21:37:22 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2017 14:37:22 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Underwater linear actuator to 2000ft Message-ID: <6E7E7DD5-8837-4B51-A54D-213EECFED550@yahoo.com> Found this underwater actuator. Wouldn't dare estimate the price, but it is probably something we could make easy enough! https://www.ultramotion.com/industries/underwater-linear-actuator/ It is oil compensated & uses a brushless motor. From the pictures, it has an enclosure near the rod end that has slots in it. I am guessing there is a rubber bellows / bladder in there to keep the inside of the actuator at ambient pressure & to expand & contract to compensate for displaced oil as the piston moves in & out. Of interest is that it is saying that the motors can be over-driven by 2-3 times due to the dissipation of the heat off the coils to the seawater through the oil. A good argument for oil compensating rather than air. Also being brushless the oil is not going to lift the brushes. Alan Sent from my iPad -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 7 02:18:08 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2017 23:18:08 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Underwater linear actuator to 2000ft In-Reply-To: <6E7E7DD5-8837-4B51-A54D-213EECFED550@yahoo.com> References: <6E7E7DD5-8837-4B51-A54D-213EECFED550@yahoo.com> Message-ID: For that price, I'm sure hank could build a dozen of them. On Oct 6, 2017 6:38 PM, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Found this underwater actuator. > Wouldn't dare estimate the price, but it is probably something we > could make easy enough! > https://www.ultramotion.com/industries/underwater-linear-actuator/ > It is oil compensated & uses a brushless motor. > From the pictures, it has an enclosure near the rod end that has slots > in it. I am guessing there is a rubber bellows / bladder in there to keep > the inside of the actuator at ambient pressure & to expand & contract > to compensate for displaced oil as the piston moves in & out. > Of interest is that it is saying that the motors can be over-driven by > 2-3 times due to the dissipation of the heat off the coils to the seawater > through the oil. A good argument for oil compensating rather than air. > Also being brushless the oil is not going to lift the brushes. > Alan > > > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 03:20:27 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Message-ID: Hi Guys, We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 04:04:45 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 21:04:45 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <68368E19-6D9C-4832-8788-0F15A59188C5@yahoo.com> Hi David, great stuff. Must feel good getting back in to it & seeing some progress. Look forward to seeing the cut outs assembled. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 8/10/2017, at 8:20 PM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi Guys, > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > > 804 College Ave > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 06:46:49 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 10:46:49 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: <68368E19-6D9C-4832-8788-0F15A59188C5@yahoo.com> References: <68368E19-6D9C-4832-8788-0F15A59188C5@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1932070115.3593600.1507459609819@mail.yahoo.com> David,Very smart building from the inside out. ?We tend to build a hull then let it sit for ages while we make all the bits and pieces. ?Hank On Sunday, October 8, 2017, 2:05:06 AM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi David,great stuff. Must feel good getting back in to it & seeingsome progress. Look forward to seeing the cut outs assembled.Alan Sent from my iPad On 8/10/2017, at 8:20 PM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Guys, We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 10:41:44 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 10:41:44 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: That's the way to do it... if I were on day one of this endeavor, I would start by becoming a CAD expert and then try to use all the CNC fabrication techniques instead of my dinosaur methods. Great job David, I can't wait to see this one come together! Best, Alec On Sun, Oct 8, 2017 at 3:20 AM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi Guys, > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the > SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to > start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > > 804 College Ave > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 12:50:10 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 11:50:10 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Underwater linear actuator to 2000ft In-Reply-To: References: <6E7E7DD5-8837-4B51-A54D-213EECFED550@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Great to see progress. My experience on small boats is this is a very important step to make sure you can get in and out of the boat and to get access to critical components. Helps bring the project to life when you can sit in the wooden mockup. Keep up the good work! Cliff On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 1:18 AM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > For that price, I'm sure hank could build a dozen of them. > On Oct 6, 2017 6:38 PM, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> Found this underwater actuator. >> Wouldn't dare estimate the price, but it is probably something we >> could make easy enough! >> https://www.ultramotion.com/industries/underwater-linear-actuator/ >> It is oil compensated & uses a brushless motor. >> From the pictures, it has an enclosure near the rod end that has slots >> in it. I am guessing there is a rubber bellows / bladder in there to keep >> the inside of the actuator at ambient pressure & to expand & contract >> to compensate for displaced oil as the piston moves in & out. >> Of interest is that it is saying that the motors can be over-driven by >> 2-3 times due to the dissipation of the heat off the coils to the seawater >> through the oil. A good argument for oil compensating rather than air. >> Also being brushless the oil is not going to lift the brushes. >> Alan >> >> >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 13:10:08 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 10:10:08 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Message-ID: <20171008101008.EEF9B3A9@m0117459.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 15:23:32 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: <20171008101008.EEF9B3A9@m0117459.ppops.net> References: <20171008101008.EEF9B3A9@m0117459.ppops.net> Message-ID: Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final hull when complete. At least that's the plan. On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. > After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very > insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the > actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength > to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the > inside and one for the outside dimensions. > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 > > Hi Guys, > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the > SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to > start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > > 804 College Ave > > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 15:35:11 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:35:11 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Underwater linear actuator to 2000ft In-Reply-To: References: <6E7E7DD5-8837-4B51-A54D-213EECFED550@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks Cliff. My very first mockup of the front pilot station was full scale. It also drove a design change from a 24" hatch to 30" diameter hatch. I found out the hard way one Sunday evening after everyone was in bed, my cell phone was on the workshop bench, and I climbed inside, a little smaller than I liked, and defianatly two small when I discovered that I could not extricate myself as I could not bend my knees. Good thing I had a drill motor within arms reach to deconstruct the hull from the inside. So I am a big believer in full scale models. On Oct 8, 2017 9:51 AM, "Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Great to see progress. My experience on small boats is this is a very > important step to make sure you can get in and out of the boat and to get > access to critical components. Helps bring the project to life when you > can sit in the wooden mockup. > > Keep up the good work! > > Cliff > > On Sat, Oct 7, 2017 at 1:18 AM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> For that price, I'm sure hank could build a dozen of them. >> On Oct 6, 2017 6:38 PM, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >>> Found this underwater actuator. >>> Wouldn't dare estimate the price, but it is probably something we >>> could make easy enough! >>> https://www.ultramotion.com/industries/underwater-linear-actuator/ >>> It is oil compensated & uses a brushless motor. >>> From the pictures, it has an enclosure near the rod end that has slots >>> in it. I am guessing there is a rubber bellows / bladder in there to keep >>> the inside of the actuator at ambient pressure & to expand & contract >>> to compensate for displaced oil as the piston moves in & out. >>> Of interest is that it is saying that the motors can be over-driven by >>> 2-3 times due to the dissipation of the heat off the coils to the >>> seawater >>> through the oil. A good argument for oil compensating rather than air. >>> Also being brushless the oil is not going to lift the brushes. >>> Alan >>> >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 15:38:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:38:14 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: <68368E19-6D9C-4832-8788-0F15A59188C5@yahoo.com> References: <68368E19-6D9C-4832-8788-0F15A59188C5@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Alan, I have been waiting a long time to finally pull the trigger. Now I have to create a space to accommodate the assembly. I can hardly wait. On Oct 8, 2017 1:06 AM, "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi David, > great stuff. Must feel good getting back in to it & seeing > some progress. Look forward to seeing the cut outs assembled. > Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > On 8/10/2017, at 8:20 PM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Hi Guys, > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the > SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to > start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > > 804 College Ave > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 15:41:55 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:41:55 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: <1932070115.3593600.1507459609819@mail.yahoo.com> References: <68368E19-6D9C-4832-8788-0F15A59188C5@yahoo.com> <1932070115.3593600.1507459609819@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, I came this close to placing the order for the rear hull section and semi hemisphere cap. I figured it was in my best interest with my wife to stick with cnc work verses getting out the welder and grinder. At least for the moment anyway. On Oct 8, 2017 3:51 AM, "hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > David, > Very smart building from the inside out. We tend to build a hull then let > it sit for ages while we make all the bits and pieces. > Hank > > On Sunday, October 8, 2017, 2:05:06 AM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > > Hi David, > great stuff. Must feel good getting back in to it & seeing > some progress. Look forward to seeing the cut outs assembled. > Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > On 8/10/2017, at 8:20 PM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Hi Guys, > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the > SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to > start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > > 804 College Ave > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 15:47:57 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:47:57 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Alec, I've been learning Rhino, and doing a lot of visualizations with the 3d model, and making refinements to the form, and developing models of different parts. I finally decided I had fiddled with it enough, and needed a full scale to make sure things were actually working. So now I get to build a giant tinker toy and sit in it. Yah. More videos to come as I progress. On Oct 8, 2017 7:42 AM, "Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > That's the way to do it... if I were on day one of this endeavor, I would > start by becoming a CAD expert and then try to use all the CNC fabrication > techniques instead of my dinosaur methods. Great job David, I can't wait to > see this one come together! > > Best, > > Alec > > On Sun, Oct 8, 2017 at 3:20 AM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> Hi Guys, >> We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the >> SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to >> start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. >> >> https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 >> >> Best Regards, >> David Colombo >> >> 804 College Ave >> Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 >> (707) 536-1424 >> www.SeaQuestor.com >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 21:07:28 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:07:28 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Message-ID: <20171008180728.EEFC980D@m0117567.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 8 21:24:53 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:24:53 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: <20171008180728.EEFC980D@m0117567.ppops.net> References: <20171008180728.EEFC980D@m0117567.ppops.net> Message-ID: Hey Brian, that's spell check for you. It's Sono Tube. Used for concrete forms, 8" od to 48" od. On Oct 8, 2017 6:08 PM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > David, What's a "Sonoma tube" ? > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 > > Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model > which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" > fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even > the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma > tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that > has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final > hull when complete. At least that's the plan. > On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. > After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very > insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the > actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength > to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the > inside and one for the outside dimensions. > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 > > Hi Guys, > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the > SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to > start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > > 804 College Ave > > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 01:01:32 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2017 18:01:32 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Reversing Current Spike Message-ID: <4D188161-6B63-4BD1-AE26-F9B858F59382@yahoo.com> Just passing on some information from technadyne's thruster Q&A that I thought was interesting. The question was whether you could put the thruster from full forward to full reverse instantaneously. No!! It is necessary that your system has a time based ramp from zero speed to full speed and from full speed to zero speed in both forward and reverse. If you are controlling the thrusters with hand operated joystick, the time required to move the joystick from one position to another is probably enough for the thrusters. However, if you are driving the thrusters with computer, it is essential that you program a linear ramp into the thruster control algorithm. The reason that this time based ramp is necessary is because the thrusters generate back EMF and the back EMF is much greater when the speed changes very rapidly. For example, if the time ramp from full power forward to full power reverse is 20ms, the back EMF current spikes will be 10-20 times greater than the steady state current (we have actually measured this). If this ramp is increased to 50ms, then the back EMF current spikes will be about 4-8 times the steady state current. And increase the ramp to over 100ms, and the current spikes will be about 2 times the steady state current. Make the ramp as long as you can and contact the factory if you have any questions. Alan Sent from my iPad From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 01:21:05 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 22:21:05 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Message-ID: <20171008222105.EEF9BC42@m0117458.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 10:50:58 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2017 07:50:58 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Message-ID: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 10:53:15 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Jon Wallace via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2017 14:53:15 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Motor Reversing Current Spike In-Reply-To: <4D188161-6B63-4BD1-AE26-F9B858F59382@yahoo.com> References: <4D188161-6B63-4BD1-AE26-F9B858F59382@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1147456604.4013053.1507560795064@mail.yahoo.com> Most modern robotic motor controllers take this into account.? When you order one, just confirm that it does. On Monday, October 9, 2017 1:03 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Just passing on some information from technadyne's thruster Q&A that I thought was interesting. The question was whether you could put the thruster from full forward to full reverse instantaneously. No!! It is necessary that your system has a time based ramp from zero speed to full speed and from full speed to zero speed in both forward and reverse. If you are controlling the thrusters with hand operated joystick, the time required to move the joystick from one position to another is probably enough for the thrusters. However, if you are driving the thrusters with computer, it is essential that you program a linear ramp into the thruster control algorithm. The reason that this time based ramp is necessary is because the thrusters generate back EMF and the back EMF is much greater when the speed changes very rapidly. For example, if the time ramp from full power forward to full power reverse is 20ms, the back EMF current spikes will be 10-20 times greater than the steady state current (we have actually measured this). If this ramp is increased to 50ms, then the back EMF current spikes will be about 4-8 times the steady state current. And increase the ramp to over 100ms, ! and the current spikes will be about 2 times the steady state current. Make the ramp as long as you can and contact the factory if you have any questions. Alan Sent from my iPad _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 14:00:51 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2017 11:00:51 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> References: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> Message-ID: Hey Brian,We evacuated the motorhome last night to my office. Left our ranch this morning after the fire circled most of the northern outskirts of the city. As we evacuated this morning with animals loaded and a caravan of vehicles, the fire was across the road and coming up the face of Calistoga grade east. They did a hard close of Calistoga at Harville 20 min after we left. At my office now getting organized, not knowing if the fire passed us by or not, or if we will living in the motorhome for a while. At least all of the family has evacuated and are safe. On Oct 9, 2017 7:52 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > David, what's the deal with those fires up there? > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:24:53 -0700 > > Hey Brian, that's spell check for you. It's Sono Tube. Used for concrete > forms, 8" od to 48" od. > On Oct 8, 2017 6:08 PM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, What's a "Sonoma tube" ? > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 > > Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model > which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" > fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even > the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma > tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that > has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final > hull when complete. At least that's the plan. > On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. > After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very > insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the > actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength > to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the > inside and one for the outside dimensions. > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 > > Hi Guys, > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the > SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to > start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > > 804 College Ave > > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 14:48:09 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2017 07:48:09 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: References: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> Message-ID: <34450AC1-9C79-4B59-B992-5A4B24AAEF47@yahoo.com> David, hope that turns out ok. You've just spent a lot of time on that house. Keep us updated! Alan Sent from my iPad > On 10/10/2017, at 7:00 AM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hey Brian,We evacuated the motorhome last night to my office. Left our ranch this morning after the fire circled most of the northern outskirts of the city. As we evacuated this morning with animals loaded and a caravan of vehicles, the fire was across the road and coming up the face of Calistoga grade east. They did a hard close of Calistoga at Harville 20 min after we left.. At my office now getting organized, not knowing if the fire passed us by or not, or if we will living in the motorhome for a while. At least all of the family has evacuated and are safe. > >> On Oct 9, 2017 7:52 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: >> David, what's the deal with those fires up there? >> >> Brian >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins >> Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:24:53 -0700 >> >> Hey Brian, that's spell check for you. It's Sono Tube. Used for concrete forms, 8" od to 48" od. >> >> On Oct 8, 2017 6:08 PM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: >> David, What's a "Sonoma tube" ? >> >> Brian >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins >> Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 >> >> Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final hull when complete. At least that's the plan. >> >> On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: >> David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the inside and one for the outside dimensions. >> >> Brian >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins >> Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 >> >> Hi Guys, >> We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. >> >> https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 >> >> Best Regards, >> David Colombo >> >> 804 College Ave >> Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 >> (707) 536-1424 >> www.SeaQuestor.com >> >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 15:18:49 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2017 12:18:49 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Batteries Message-ID: <20171009121849.EEF94F0A@m0117458.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 15:53:23 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2017 08:53:23 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: References: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> Message-ID: <00d401d34138$463a8290$d2af87b0$@gmail.com> Good luck and best wishes, David. Terrible situation! Regards, Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Tuesday, 10 October 2017 7:01 AM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Hey Brian,We evacuated the motorhome last night to my office. Left our ranch this morning after the fire circled most of the northern outskirts of the city. As we evacuated this morning with animals loaded and a caravan of vehicles, the fire was across the road and coming up the face of Calistoga grade east. They did a hard close of Calistoga at Harville 20 min after we left. At my office now getting organized, not knowing if the fire passed us by or not, or if we will living in the motorhome for a while. At least all of the family has evacuated and are safe. On Oct 9, 2017 7:52 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: David, what's the deal with those fires up there? Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:24:53 -0700 Hey Brian, that's spell check for you. It's Sono Tube. Used for concrete forms, 8" od to 48" od. On Oct 8, 2017 6:08 PM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: David, What's a "Sonoma tube" ? Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final hull when complete. At least that's the plan. On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the inside and one for the outside dimensions. Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 Hi Guys, We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 17:04:50 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2017 14:04:50 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: <00d401d34138$463a8290$d2af87b0$@gmail.com> References: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> <00d401d34138$463a8290$d2af87b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi guys, just wanted to thank each of you for your support. I was just able to get back up to the ranch a few minutes ago..(had to sneak in the back roads). The fire never jumped the road, so everything on my side of the road is untouched, the other side is in pretty bad shape and still battling small fires. So as long as the winds don't pick up like last night we may be able to return in a day or two. On Oct 9, 2017 12:54 PM, "Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Good luck and best wishes, David. Terrible situation! > > Regards, Hugh > > > > *From:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- > bounces at psubs.org] *On Behalf Of *David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > *Sent:* Tuesday, 10 October 2017 7:01 AM > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > > > > Hey Brian,We evacuated the motorhome last night to my office. Left our > ranch this morning after the fire circled most of the northern outskirts of > the city. As we evacuated this morning with animals loaded and a caravan of > vehicles, the fire was across the road and coming up the face of Calistoga > grade east. They did a hard close of Calistoga at Harville 20 min after we > left. At my office now getting organized, not knowing if the fire passed us > by or not, or if we will living in the motorhome for a while. At least all > of the family has evacuated and are safe. > > On Oct 9, 2017 7:52 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, what's the deal with those fires up there? > > > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:24:53 -0700 > > Hey Brian, that's spell check for you. It's Sono Tube. Used for concrete > forms, 8" od to 48" od. > > On Oct 8, 2017 6:08 PM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, What's a "Sonoma tube" ? > > > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 > > Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model > which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" > fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even > the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma > tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that > has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final > hull when complete. At least that's the plan. > > On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. > After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very > insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the > actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength > to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the > inside and one for the outside dimensions. > > > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 > > Hi Guys, > > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the > SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to > start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > > 804 College Ave > > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 18:44:35 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2017 11:44:35 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: References: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> <00d401d34138$463a8290$d2af87b0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <566D4796-B358-45BE-8F35-33BFC0BC2052@yahoo.com> Thanks David, that's great news. A couple more days & back in to your sub project! Alan Sent from my iPad > On 10/10/2017, at 10:04 AM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi guys, just wanted to thank each of you for your support. I was just able to get back up to the ranch a few minutes ago..(had to sneak in the back roads). The fire never jumped the road, so everything on my side of the road is untouched, the other side is in pretty bad shape and still battling small fires. So as long as the winds don't pick up like last night we may be able to return in a day or two. > >> On Oct 9, 2017 12:54 PM, "Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: >> Good luck and best wishes, David. Terrible situation! >> >> Regards, Hugh >> >> >> >> From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles >> Sent: Tuesday, 10 October 2017 7:01 AM >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins >> >> >> >> Hey Brian,We evacuated the motorhome last night to my office. Left our ranch this morning after the fire circled most of the northern outskirts of the city. As we evacuated this morning with animals loaded and a caravan of vehicles, the fire was across the road and coming up the face of Calistoga grade east. They did a hard close of Calistoga at Harville 20 min after we left. At my office now getting organized, not knowing if the fire passed us by or not, or if we will living in the motorhome for a while. At least all of the family has evacuated and are safe. >> >> On Oct 9, 2017 7:52 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: >> >> David, what's the deal with those fires up there? >> >> >> >> Brian >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins >> Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:24:53 -0700 >> >> Hey Brian, that's spell check for you. It's Sono Tube. Used for concrete forms, 8" od to 48" od. >> >> On Oct 8, 2017 6:08 PM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: >> >> David, What's a "Sonoma tube" ? >> >> >> >> Brian >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins >> Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 >> >> Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final hull when complete. At least that's the plan. >> >> On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: >> >> David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the inside and one for the outside dimensions. >> >> >> >> Brian >> >> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: >> >> From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins >> Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 >> >> Hi Guys, >> >> We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. >> >> https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 >> >> Best Regards, >> David Colombo >> >> 804 College Ave >> Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 >> (707) 536-1424 >> www.SeaQuestor.com >> >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 18:57:31 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2017 11:57:31 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Batteries In-Reply-To: <20171009121849.EEF94F0A@m0117458.ppops.net> References: <20171009121849.EEF94F0A@m0117458.ppops.net> Message-ID: <866EDF60-120A-4E8C-8746-9156493ABADD@yahoo.com> Brian, you must be getting close ordering the batteries. I also need to sort out navigation lights! Carsten posted a link to lights he used, & compensated but can't find it! They were a bit expensive. I will be looking through marine chandleries to see if there is anything that looks suitable for Oil compensating. Let us know if you come up with anything that looks promising. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 10/10/2017, at 8:18 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi All , Just ordered my batteries - 8 - 6v 224 Ah , should be here in a week ! Still need navigation lights. > > Brian > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 19:50:21 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2017 12:50:21 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Magnetic Couplers In-Reply-To: <4D188161-6B63-4BD1-AE26-F9B858F59382@yahoo.com> References: <4D188161-6B63-4BD1-AE26-F9B858F59382@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <648BB064-FBEE-49D2-8356-CDE83AFF9313@yahoo.com> Passing on more info from Technadynes FAQ. We have discussed magnetic couplers before, which have an external water lubricated bearing. It says below that they last 2000hrs at best, & this is severely reduced in messy water. Good to see some of these things quantified! The thrusters have an MTBF of 20,000 hours. However, it is very important to remember that the propeller bearings are lubricated by the sea water. If the sea water is clean, the bearings will last for 2,000 hours. If the sea water is sandy (when operating on the bottom) the bearing life is severely reduced. It is easy to check for propeller bearing wear, just by rocking the propeller back and forth. And replacing the bearings takes only several minutes and the bearings are really inexpensive. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 9/10/2017, at 6:01 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Just passing on some information from technadyne's thruster Q&A > that I thought was interesting. The question was whether you could put > the thruster from full forward to full reverse instantaneously. > > No!! It is necessary that your system has a time based ramp from zero speed to full speed and from full speed to zero speed in both forward and reverse. If you are controlling the thrusters with hand operated joystick, the time required to move the joystick from one position to another is probably enough for the thrusters. However, if you are driving the thrusters with computer, it is essential that you program a linear ramp into the thruster control algorithm. The reason that this time based ramp is necessary is because the thrusters generate back EMF and the back EMF is much greater when the speed changes very rapidly. For example, if the time ramp from full power forward to full power reverse is 20ms, the back EMF current spikes will be 10-20 times greater than the steady state current (we have actually measured this). If this ramp is increased to 50ms, then the back EMF current spikes will be about 4-8 times the steady state current. And increase the ramp to over 100ms, ! > and the current spikes will be about 2 times the steady state current. Make the ramp as long as you can and contact the factory if you have any questions. > Alan > > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 20:33:42 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2017 17:33:42 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Batteries Message-ID: <20171009173342.EEFC78BE@m0117566.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 20:35:16 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2017 00:35:16 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Magnetic Couplers In-Reply-To: <648BB064-FBEE-49D2-8356-CDE83AFF9313@yahoo.com> References: <4D188161-6B63-4BD1-AE26-F9B858F59382@yahoo.com> <648BB064-FBEE-49D2-8356-CDE83AFF9313@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <453102955.4642186.1507595716452@mail.yahoo.com> Alan you are a wealth of information. When I built my magnetic coupled drive, I used regular roller bearings and housed them in oil with a compensator. ?Glad I did now, mind you I have been looking at going with a water lubricated bearing but that idea is not getting traction. ?I plan on putting that drive back into Gamma. ?It works better than two side thrusters.Hank On Monday, October 9, 2017, 5:50:45 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Passing on more info from Technadynes FAQ. We have discussed magnetic couplers before, which have an external water lubricated bearing. It says below that they last 2000hrs at best, & this is severely reduced in messy water. Good to see some of these things quantified! The thrusters have an MTBF of 20,000 hours. However, it is very important to remember that the propeller bearings are lubricated by the sea water. If the sea water is clean, the bearings will last for 2,000 hours. If the sea water is sandy (when operating on the bottom) the bearing life is severely reduced. It is easy to check for propeller bearing wear, just by rocking the propeller back and forth. And replacing the bearings takes only several minutes and the bearings are really inexpensive. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 9/10/2017, at 6:01 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Just passing on some information from technadyne's thruster Q&A > that I thought was interesting. The question was whether you could put > the thruster from full forward to full reverse instantaneously. > > No!! It is necessary that your system has a time based ramp from zero speed to full speed and from full speed to zero speed in both forward and reverse. If you are controlling the thrusters with hand operated joystick, the time required to move the joystick from one position to another is probably enough for the thrusters. However, if you are driving the thrusters with computer, it is essential that you program a linear ramp into the thruster control algorithm. The reason that this time based ramp is necessary is because the thrusters generate back EMF and the back EMF is much greater when the speed changes very rapidly. For example, if the time ramp from full power forward to full power reverse is 20ms, the back EMF current spikes will be 10-20 times greater than the steady state current (we have actually measured this). If this ramp is increased to 50ms, then the back EMF current spikes will be about 4-8 times the steady state current. And increase the ramp to over 100ms! , ! > and the current spikes will be about 2 times the steady state current. Make the ramp as long as you can and contact the factory if you have any questions. > Alan > > > Sent from my iPad > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 9 20:38:27 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2017 00:38:27 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Batteries In-Reply-To: <20171009173342.EEFC78BE@m0117566.ppops.net> References: <20171009173342.EEFC78BE@m0117566.ppops.net> Message-ID: <1305567470.4660022.1507595907567@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,So the plan is to surface and put the light on a mast? ?good idea, keep it simple. ?You could have an external plug to connect to so there are no wires going through the hatch. ?Or does it have a better?Hank On Monday, October 9, 2017, 6:33:58 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Alan,??????? Actually I'm just going to go for this one for the time being.? I will just mount it when I need it , maybe later I will do?a full on submersible unit.?https://www.hodgesmarine.com/Clipper-Supernova-Combi-Led-Tricolor-Masthead-An-p/clicl-ctc.htm???I got this for $100.00? must have been on sale or something.?Brian? --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Batteries Date: Tue, 10 Oct 2017 11:57:31 +1300 Brian,you must be getting close ordering the batteries.I also need to sort out navigation lights!Carsten posted a link to lights he used, & compensated but can't find it!They were a bit expensive. I will be looking through marine chandleriesto see if there is anything that looks suitable for Oil compensating.Let us know if you come up with anything that looks promising.Alan Sent from my iPad On 10/10/2017, at 8:18 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi All ,??????????? Just ordered my batteries - 8 -?6v 224 Ah? , should be here in a week !???? Still need navigation lights.?Brian _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 11 15:35:16 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 12:35:16 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing Message-ID: <20171011123516.EEFF0C5C@m0117568.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 11 16:18:20 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 20:18:20 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing In-Reply-To: <20171011123516.EEFF0C5C@m0117568.ppops.net> References: <20171011123516.EEFF0C5C@m0117568.ppops.net> Message-ID: <2079851408.55765.1507753100391@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,Where are your batteries going to be, I am assuming in the horizontal tube. ? When you say of gassing, I assume you mean Hydrogen. ?The Hydrogen is going to float up and keep going up out the hatch isn't it? ?I think the venting systems are for pods or in my case in Gamma where the batteries are sealed in a small ?area. ? It is wierd they off gas, what did you buy?Hank On Wednesday, October 11, 2017, 1:35:34 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi All,??????????????? The batteries I'm getting will off gas while cycle charging at a rate of 23 cc/hr per battery ( I will have 8 - 6v batteries)?, the discharge rate they say is zero? .? Does anybody have a good air flow system they would recommend while charging???Brian_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 11 16:55:19 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 20:55:19 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing In-Reply-To: <20171011123516.EEFF0C5C@m0117568.ppops.net> References: <20171011123516.EEFF0C5C@m0117568.ppops.net> Message-ID: Brian I welded short SS sleeves in each end of my battery pods and had solid SS plugs machined with O ring grooves to fit into the sleeves so when charging, I just pop the plugs out and will inject air at a slow rate in the aft ends of each pod while charging moving good air across the batteries and forcing the bad air out the other ends to the atmosphere instead of it going inside the sub per plans. Rick On Wed, Oct 11, 2017 at 9:36 AM Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi All, The batteries I'm getting will off gas while cycle > charging at a rate of 23 cc/hr per battery ( I will have 8 - 6v > batteries) , the discharge rate they say is zero . Does anybody have a > good air flow system they would recommend while charging? > > > Brian > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 11 22:23:42 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 19:23:42 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing Message-ID: <20171011192342.EEF8B9AC@m0117459.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 11 22:48:46 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 19:48:46 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: 1gnSeX1LI7r5x1gnUe9t79 References: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> <00d401d34138$463a8290$d2af87b0$@gmail.com> 1gnSeX1LI7r5x1gnUe9t79 Message-ID: <002d01d34304$a0be90d0$e23bb270$@telus.net> I am glad to hear the fires have missed you, David. It's been a very bad summer for us as well? most of southern British Columbia seemed to be on fire. Best of luck. Tim From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of Alan via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Monday, October 9, 2017 3:45 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Thanks David, that's great news. A couple more days & back in to your sub project! Alan Sent from my iPad On 10/10/2017, at 10:04 AM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: Hi guys, just wanted to thank each of you for your support. I was just able to get back up to the ranch a few minutes ago..(had to sneak in the back roads). The fire never jumped the road, so everything on my side of the road is untouched, the other side is in pretty bad shape and still battling small fires. So as long as the winds don't pick up like last night we may be able to return in a day or two. On Oct 9, 2017 12:54 PM, "Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles" > wrote: Good luck and best wishes, David. Terrible situation! Regards, Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org ] On Behalf Of David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Tuesday, 10 October 2017 7:01 AM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Hey Brian,We evacuated the motorhome last night to my office. Left our ranch this morning after the fire circled most of the northern outskirts of the city. As we evacuated this morning with animals loaded and a caravan of vehicles, the fire was across the road and coming up the face of Calistoga grade east. They did a hard close of Calistoga at Harville 20 min after we left. At my office now getting organized, not knowing if the fire passed us by or not, or if we will living in the motorhome for a while. At least all of the family has evacuated and are safe. On Oct 9, 2017 7:52 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" > wrote: David, what's the deal with those fires up there? Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:24:53 -0700 Hey Brian, that's spell check for you. It's Sono Tube. Used for concrete forms, 8" od to 48" od. On Oct 8, 2017 6:08 PM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" > wrote: David, What's a "Sonoma tube" ? Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final hull when complete. At least that's the plan. On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" > wrote: David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the inside and one for the outside dimensions. Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 Hi Guys, We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 594 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 12 00:07:37 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 21:07:37 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins In-Reply-To: <002d01d34304$a0be90d0$e23bb270$@telus.net> References: <20171009075058.EEF95154@m0117458.ppops.net> <00d401d34138$463a8290$d2af87b0$@gmail.com> <002d01d34304$a0be90d0$e23bb270$@telus.net> Message-ID: Thanks Tim, The fire storm is not over yet as it is still circling the outskirts of santa rosa and rohnert park and windsor, and healdsburg area. so far 115,000 acres. If we are lucky, I'm hoping to return on Friday once they open the road back up. Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Wed, Oct 11, 2017 at 7:48 PM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > I am glad to hear the fires have missed you, David. It's been a very bad > summer for us as well? most of southern British Columbia seemed to be on > fire. Best of luck. Tim > > > > *From:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- > bounces at psubs.org] *On Behalf Of *Alan via Personal_Submersibles > *Sent:* Monday, October 9, 2017 3:45 PM > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > > > > Thanks David, > > that's great news. A couple more days & back in to your sub project! > > Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > > On 10/10/2017, at 10:04 AM, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Hi guys, just wanted to thank each of you for your support. I was just > able to get back up to the ranch a few minutes ago..(had to sneak in the > back roads). The fire never jumped the road, so everything on my side of > the road is untouched, the other side is in pretty bad shape and still > battling small fires. So as long as the winds don't pick up like last night > we may be able to return in a day or two. > > On Oct 9, 2017 12:54 PM, "Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Good luck and best wishes, David. Terrible situation! > > Regards, Hugh > > > > *From:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- > bounces at psubs.org] *On Behalf Of *David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > *Sent:* Tuesday, 10 October 2017 7:01 AM > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > > > > Hey Brian,We evacuated the motorhome last night to my office. Left our > ranch this morning after the fire circled most of the northern outskirts of > the city. As we evacuated this morning with animals loaded and a caravan of > vehicles, the fire was across the road and coming up the face of Calistoga > grade east. They did a hard close of Calistoga at Harville 20 min after we > left. At my office now getting organized, not knowing if the fire passed us > by or not, or if we will living in the motorhome for a while. At least all > of the family has evacuated and are safe. > > On Oct 9, 2017 7:52 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, what's the deal with those fires up there? > > > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 18:24:53 -0700 > > Hey Brian, that's spell check for you. It's Sono Tube. Used for concrete > forms, 8" od to 48" od. > > On Oct 8, 2017 6:08 PM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, What's a "Sonoma tube" ? > > > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 12:23:32 -0700 > > Hi Brian, all of the parts cut on the cnc are based on the Rhino model > which based on actual thicknesses. The expectation is that the 3/8" > fiberglass exoskeleton when molded should fit over the plywood forms. Even > the cutout is sized for the 36" x 3/8" hull. I will be using a 36" Sonoma > tube which has a 3/8" wall thickness, so the interior pilot console that > has been fabricated out of ss, will be able to be relocated into the final > hull when complete. At least that's the plan. > > On Oct 8, 2017 10:10 AM, "Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > David, Yeah, my whole design changed after doing a full scale mock up. > After seeing one of Phil Nuyten's plywood mock ups in Vancouver it was very > insightful. However the plywood doesn't necessarily correspond to the > actual dimensions of the outside of the sub because you need some strength > to hold it together , so I made two mock ups, one for ergonomics for the > inside and one for the outside dimensions. > > > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SeaQuestor CNC begins > Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 00:20:27 -0700 > > Hi Guys, > > We just CNC'd the station ribs for the full scale mock-up of the > SeaQuestor. Nest step is to assemble the puzzle on a rolling platform to > start all of the electrical and plumbing rough-ins. > > https://youtu.be/XiWSaSF6UT0 > > Best Regards, > David Colombo > [image: Image removed by sender.] > > 804 College Ave > > Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 > > (707) 536-1424 > www.SeaQuestor.com > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 594 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 12 06:18:01 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2017 10:18:01 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing In-Reply-To: <20171011192342.EEF8B9AC@m0117459.ppops.net> References: <20171011192342.EEF8B9AC@m0117459.ppops.net> Message-ID: <153491090.404920.1507803481630@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,I was under the impression that AGM batteries did not. ?Your probably right though and in my case the batteries are not sealed up in a compartment and are well vented. ?You must be getting real close to having a working sub.Hank On Wednesday, October 11, 2017, 8:23:57 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,?? I think all batteries will off gas hydrogen to some degree.?Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 20:18:20 +0000 (UTC) Brian,Where are your batteries going to be, I am assuming in the horizontal tube. ? When you say of gassing, I assume you mean Hydrogen. ?The Hydrogen is going to float up and keep going up out the hatch isn't it? ?I think the venting systems are for pods or in my case in Gamma where the batteries are sealed in a small ?area. ? It is wierd they off gas, what did you buy?Hank On Wednesday, October 11, 2017, 1:35:34 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi All,??????????????? The batteries I'm getting will off gas while cycle charging at a rate of 23 cc/hr per battery ( I will have 8 - 6v batteries)?, the discharge rate they say is zero? .? Does anybody have a good air flow system they would recommend while charging???Brian_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 12 11:43:36 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2017 08:43:36 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing Message-ID: <20171012084336.EEFF3450@m0117568.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 12 16:39:51 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2017 20:39:51 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing In-Reply-To: <20171012084336.EEFF3450@m0117568.ppops.net> References: <20171012084336.EEFF3450@m0117568.ppops.net> Message-ID: <135955389.806170.1507840791399@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,before you fill the other motor with oil, check the rpm if you have a rpm gauge. ?Then check it after filling to see how much it drops.Are you going to remove the oil filled motor and check the brushes and comutatator to make sure it is all good.Hank On Thursday, October 12, 2017, 9:44:00 AM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,????? Just waiting for the batteries, which is good, allows me to sew up little loose ends.? I've been running the motors with an external cheapo battery bank.? My port side motor had been sitting in the wd-40 for 3 or 4 months and ran with no problems !?Brian? --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2017 10:18:01 +0000 (UTC) Brian,I was under the impression that AGM batteries did not. ?Your probably right though and in my case the batteries are not sealed up in a compartment and are well vented. ?You must be getting real close to having a working sub.Hank On Wednesday, October 11, 2017, 8:23:57 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,?? I think all batteries will off gas hydrogen to some degree.?Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 20:18:20 +0000 (UTC) Brian,Where are your batteries going to be, I am assuming in the horizontal tube. ? When you say of gassing, I assume you mean Hydrogen. ?The Hydrogen is going to float up and keep going up out the hatch isn't it? ?I think the venting systems are for pods or in my case in Gamma where the batteries are sealed in a small ?area. ? It is wierd they off gas, what did you buy?Hank On Wednesday, October 11, 2017, 1:35:34 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi All,??????????????? The batteries I'm getting will off gas while cycle charging at a rate of 23 cc/hr per battery ( I will have 8 - 6v batteries)?, the discharge rate they say is zero? .? Does anybody have a good air flow system they would recommend while charging???Brian_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 12 18:07:13 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2017 15:07:13 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Battery off gassing Message-ID: <20171012150713.EEF9F2BE@m0117457.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 13 11:18:44 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 15:18:44 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator References: <1693536277.1253240.1507907924039.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1693536277.1253240.1507907924039@mail.yahoo.com> Okay new idea, can't fit a diesel in my escape pod, so, I am thinking that I will put a 36v dc generator (home made) in my inflatable tender that I tow behind Gamma. ?I am installing the original 2hp drive in the escape pod with the jettisoning prop assembly. ?I will feed the 2 hp 24v motor with 36v so it will be 3hp. ?The motor is rated at 3hp 36v. ?I will run a power cable from the generator to 3 12v batteries in the pod, and I will travel on that power. ?When I dive I will switch to my 36v agm ?bank. ? That should work since I am towing the tender anyways. ?I am having trouble finding a 36v alternator. ?I want an alternator with internal regulator. ?I guess in a pinch I can use 3 12v alternators but then it is not compact anymore. ?Any ideas?Hank? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 13 13:06:38 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 10:06:38 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Message-ID: <20171013100638.EEFD07A3@m0117566.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 13 15:49:00 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 19:49:00 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator In-Reply-To: <20171013100638.EEFD07A3@m0117566.ppops.net> References: <20171013100638.EEFD07A3@m0117566.ppops.net> Message-ID: <2131053510.1415348.1507924140593@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,I just need the alternator, I have a motor etc. ?There is a 36v dc gas generator on eBay for 1400 bucks, I had no idea such a thing existedHank On Friday, October 13, 2017, 11:06:59 AM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,??? A 36v generator is going to be hard to find at a good price ;-)??? .? Maybe a little Honda AC generator with a inverter could do the job.? ?Brian? --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 15:18:44 +0000 (UTC) Okay new idea, can't fit a diesel in my escape pod, so, I am thinking that I will put a 36v dc generator (home made) in my inflatable tender that I tow behind Gamma. ?I am installing the original 2hp drive in the escape pod with the jettisoning prop assembly. ?I will feed the 2 hp 24v motor with 36v so it will be 3hp. ?The motor is rated at 3hp 36v. ?I will run a power cable from the generator to 3 12v batteries in the pod, and I will travel on that power. ?When I dive I will switch to my 36v agm ?bank. ? That should work since I am towing the tender anyways. ?I am having trouble finding a 36v alternator. ?I want an alternator with internal regulator. ?I guess in a pinch I can use 3 12v alternators but then it is not compact anymore. ?Any ideas?Hank?_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 16 18:51:49 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 15:51:49 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Message-ID: <20171016155149.EEFE9A36@m0117566.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 16 19:09:44 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 23:09:44 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator In-Reply-To: <20171016155149.EEFE9A36@m0117566.ppops.net> References: <20171016155149.EEFE9A36@m0117566.ppops.net> Message-ID: <1027709356.176952.1508195384580@mail.yahoo.com> Brian, I don't have a 36v charger. ?I charge my bank 12v at a time.Hank On Monday, October 16, 2017, 4:52:05 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,??? Does your 36 volt charger put out enough amperage to power your motors ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 15:18:44 +0000 (UTC) Okay new idea, can't fit a diesel in my escape pod, so, I am thinking that I will put a 36v dc generator (home made) in my inflatable tender that I tow behind Gamma. ?I am installing the original 2hp drive in the escape pod with the jettisoning prop assembly. ?I will feed the 2 hp 24v motor with 36v so it will be 3hp. ?The motor is rated at 3hp 36v. ?I will run a power cable from the generator to 3 12v batteries in the pod, and I will travel on that power. ?When I dive I will switch to my 36v agm ?bank. ? That should work since I am towing the tender anyways. ?I am having trouble finding a 36v alternator. ?I want an alternator with internal regulator. ?I guess in a pinch I can use 3 12v alternators but then it is not compact anymore. ?Any ideas?Hank?_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 16 20:15:12 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 17:15:12 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Message-ID: <20171016171512.EEFB8A76@m0117458.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 16 20:54:03 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 00:54:03 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator In-Reply-To: <20171016171512.EEFB8A76@m0117458.ppops.net> References: <20171016171512.EEFB8A76@m0117458.ppops.net> Message-ID: <296197989.230352.1508201643370@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,?On 24v the motor takes 70A ?so at 36v it should be around 50A ?so I don't think a charger will do it. ?I like your AC motor idea, except that I intend to switch over to AGM when I dive and will drive the sub with the main motor. ?I have to give it to the Nekton engineers, that drive with a rudder, really works well. ?The addition of positioning thrusters up front will be perfect. ?It would be different if I didn't use gamma as a boat and sub all in one. ?I sure like your idea! I ?am going to see if I can find a 3hp universal AC\DC motor.Hank On Monday, October 16, 2017, 6:15:36 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,?????? If you did have one I wonder if that would work.? I think they put out about 10 amps.? But there may be a duty cycle issue running a charger for that purpose may shorten it's life.? What about just running a AC motor off of a regular AC generator for the sole purpose of getting across the lake?? ?Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 23:09:44 +0000 (UTC) Brian, I don't have a 36v charger. ?I charge my bank 12v at a time.Hank On Monday, October 16, 2017, 4:52:05 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,??? Does your 36 volt charger put out enough amperage to power your motors ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 15:18:44 +0000 (UTC) Okay new idea, can't fit a diesel in my escape pod, so, I am thinking that I will put a 36v dc generator (home made) in my inflatable tender that I tow behind Gamma. ?I am installing the original 2hp drive in the escape pod with the jettisoning prop assembly. ?I will feed the 2 hp 24v motor with 36v so it will be 3hp. ?The motor is rated at 3hp 36v. ?I will run a power cable from the generator to 3 12v batteries in the pod, and I will travel on that power. ?When I dive I will switch to my 36v agm ?bank. ? That should work since I am towing the tender anyways. ?I am having trouble finding a 36v alternator. ?I want an alternator with internal regulator. ?I guess in a pinch I can use 3 12v alternators but then it is not compact anymore. ?Any ideas?Hank?_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 16 21:24:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (k6fee via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 18:24:14 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Message-ID: <74951.37208.bm@smtp219.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Hank, What about using a surplus golf car motor as a generator? I know they are 48 volts and if you run at lower rpm you should be able to get 36v out, I would think. Keith T. Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message --------From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date: 10/16/17 5:54 PM (GMT-08:00) To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Brian,?On 24v the motor takes 70A ?so at 36v it should be around 50A ?so I don't think a charger will do it. ?I like your AC motor idea, except that I intend to switch over to AGM when I dive and will drive the sub with the main motor. ?I have to give it to the Nekton engineers, that drive with a rudder, really works well. ?The addition of positioning thrusters up front will be perfect. ?It would be different if I didn't use gamma as a boat and sub all in one. ?I sure like your idea! I ?am going to see if I can find a 3hp universal AC\DC motor.Hank On Monday, October 16, 2017, 6:15:36 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,?????? If you did have one I wonder if that would work.? I think they put out about 10 amps.? But there may be a duty cycle issue running a charger for that purpose may shorten it's life.? What about just running a AC motor off of a regular AC generator for the sole purpose of getting across the lake?? ?Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 23:09:44 +0000 (UTC) Brian, I don't have a 36v charger. ?I charge my bank 12v at a time.Hank On Monday, October 16, 2017, 4:52:05 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,??? Does your 36 volt charger put out enough amperage to power your motors ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 15:18:44 +0000 (UTC) Okay new idea, can't fit a diesel in my escape pod, so, I am thinking that I will put a 36v dc generator (home made) in my inflatable tender that I tow behind Gamma. ?I am installing the original 2hp drive in the escape pod with the jettisoning prop assembly. ?I will feed the 2 hp 24v motor with 36v so it will be 3hp. ?The motor is rated at 3hp 36v. ?I will run a power cable from the generator to 3 12v batteries in the pod, and I will travel on that power. ?When I dive I will switch to my 36v agm ?bank. ? That should work since I am towing the tender anyways. ?I am having trouble finding a 36v alternator. ?I want an alternator with internal regulator. ?I guess in a pinch I can use 3 12v alternators but then it is not compact anymore. ?Any ideas?Hank?_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 17 00:11:16 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 21:11:16 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. Message-ID: Hey guys, just received my copy of the Handbook of Acrylics by Jerry Strachiw. Looks like I've got some serious reading to do. Any recommendations on where to start with 1065 pages to choose from? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 17 01:26:05 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 22:26:05 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. In-Reply-To: 4JEne5hPfhCDu4JEoeyqrC References: 4JEne5hPfhCDu4JEoeyqrC Message-ID: <004a01d34708$6f05adf0$4d1109d0$@telus.net> Surprisingly, you can start with Section 1 and go forward from there. It's all interesting stuff, so don?t be surprised if you end up reading it cover to cover. Chapter 2 is a good introduction, but knowing your sub design you will probably spend most of your time in Section 11. I think that you will probably enjoy the math, David. Tim From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Monday, October 16, 2017 9:11 PM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. Hey guys, just received my copy of the Handbook of Acrylics by Jerry Strachiw. Looks like I've got some serious reading to do. Any recommendations on where to start with 1065 pages to choose from? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 17 02:36:48 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 23:36:48 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. In-Reply-To: <004a01d34708$6f05adf0$4d1109d0$@telus.net> References: <004a01d34708$6f05adf0$4d1109d0$@telus.net> Message-ID: Thanks Tim, it will a great distraction from the wild fires here. Still waiting to go home. On Oct 16, 2017 10:26 PM, "T Novak via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Surprisingly, you can start with Section 1 and go forward from there. > It's all interesting stuff, so don?t be surprised if you end up reading it > cover to cover. > > Chapter 2 is a good introduction, but knowing your sub design you will > probably spend most of your time in Section 11. > > I think that you will probably enjoy the math, David. > > Tim > > > > *From:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- > bounces at psubs.org] *On Behalf Of *David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > *Sent:* Monday, October 16, 2017 9:11 PM > *To:* personal_submersibles at psubs.org > *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. > > > > Hey guys, just received my copy of the Handbook of Acrylics by Jerry > Strachiw. Looks like I've got some serious reading to do. Any > recommendations on where to start with 1065 pages to choose from? > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 17 05:53:02 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 09:53:02 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator In-Reply-To: <74951.37208.bm@smtp219.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> References: <74951.37208.bm@smtp219.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1212657017.389811.1508233982093@mail.yahoo.com> Kieth,I have an extra 36v golf cart motor here, but there are two problems ,I think, anyways. ?My understanding is, for a dc motor to work as a generator it must have permanent magnets, I think? ?The next problem is the sheer size and weight. ?these motors are quite heavy, witch is probably why they are so robust. ?If it did work, it would be very tough and reliable.Hank On Monday, October 16, 2017, 7:25:10 PM MDT, k6fee via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank, What about using a surplus golf car motor as a generator? I know they are 48 volts and if you run at lower rpm you should be able to get 36v out, I would think. Keith T. Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message --------From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date: 10/16/17 5:54 PM (GMT-08:00) To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Brian,?On 24v the motor takes 70A ?so at 36v it should be around 50A ?so I don't think a charger will do it. ?I like your AC motor idea, except that I intend to switch over to AGM when I dive and will drive the sub with the main motor. ?I have to give it to the Nekton engineers, that drive with a rudder, really works well. ?The addition of positioning thrusters up front will be perfect. ?It would be different if I didn't use gamma as a boat and sub all in one. ?I sure like your idea! I ?am going to see if I can find a 3hp universal AC\DC motor.Hank On Monday, October 16, 2017, 6:15:36 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,?????? If you did have one I wonder if that would work.? I think they put out about 10 amps.? But there may be a duty cycle issue running a charger for that purpose may shorten it's life.? What about just running a AC motor off of a regular AC generator for the sole purpose of getting across the lake?? ?Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 23:09:44 +0000 (UTC) Brian, I don't have a 36v charger. ?I charge my bank 12v at a time.Hank On Monday, October 16, 2017, 4:52:05 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,??? Does your 36 volt charger put out enough amperage to power your motors ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 15:18:44 +0000 (UTC) Okay new idea, can't fit a diesel in my escape pod, so, I am thinking that I will put a 36v dc generator (home made) in my inflatable tender that I tow behind Gamma. ?I am installing the original 2hp drive in the escape pod with the jettisoning prop assembly. ?I will feed the 2 hp 24v motor with 36v so it will be 3hp. ?The motor is rated at 3hp 36v. ?I will run a power cable from the generator to 3 12v batteries in the pod, and I will travel on that power. ?When I dive I will switch to my 36v agm ?bank. ? That should work since I am towing the tender anyways. ?I am having trouble finding a 36v alternator. ?I want an alternator with internal regulator. ?I guess in a pinch I can use 3 12v alternators but then it is not compact anymore. ?Any ideas?Hank?_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 17 05:55:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 09:55:14 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. In-Reply-To: References: <004a01d34708$6f05adf0$4d1109d0$@telus.net> Message-ID: <1950941907.420095.1508234114854@mail.yahoo.com> David,I started by looking at the pictures ;-) ?Hank On Tuesday, October 17, 2017, 12:37:06 AM MDT, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks Tim, it will a great distraction from the wild fires here.? Still waiting to go home. On Oct 16, 2017 10:26 PM, "T Novak via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: Surprisingly, you can start with Section 1 and go forward from there.? It's all interesting stuff, so don?t be surprised if you end up reading it cover to cover. Chapter 2 is a good introduction, but knowing your sub design you will probably spend most of your time in Section 11. I think that you will probably enjoy the math, David. Tim ? From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Monday, October 16, 2017 9:11 PM To: personal_submersibles at psubs. org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. ? Hey guys, just received my copy of the Handbook of Acrylics by Jerry Strachiw. Looks like I've got some serious reading to do. Any recommendations on where to start with 1065 pages to choose from? ______________________________ _________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 17 10:55:40 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 07:55:40 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. In-Reply-To: <1950941907.420095.1508234114854@mail.yahoo.com> References: <004a01d34708$6f05adf0$4d1109d0$@telus.net> <1950941907.420095.1508234114854@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, Then you read the articles ... LOL Started to read last night. Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Tue, Oct 17, 2017 at 2:55 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > David, > I started by looking at the pictures ;-) > Hank > On Tuesday, October 17, 2017, 12:37:06 AM MDT, David Colombo via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Thanks Tim, it will a great distraction from the wild fires here. Still > waiting to go home. > On Oct 16, 2017 10:26 PM, "T Novak via Personal_Submersibles" < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Surprisingly, you can start with Section 1 and go forward from there. > It's all interesting stuff, so don?t be surprised if you end up reading it > cover to cover. > > Chapter 2 is a good introduction, but knowing your sub design you will > probably spend most of your time in Section 11. > > I think that you will probably enjoy the math, David. > > Tim > > > > *From:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- > bounces at psubs.org ] *On Behalf > Of *David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles > *Sent:* Monday, October 16, 2017 9:11 PM > *To:* personal_submersibles at psubs. org > *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Handbook of Acrylics. > > > > Hey guys, just received my copy of the Handbook of Acrylics by Jerry > Strachiw. Looks like I've got some serious reading to do. Any > recommendations on where to start with 1065 pages to choose from? > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 17 10:59:26 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 07:59:26 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator In-Reply-To: <1212657017.389811.1508233982093@mail.yahoo.com> References: <74951.37208.bm@smtp219.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> <1212657017.389811.1508233982093@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank Id look at the regenerative systems that are used in the Tesla cars. Might be able to adapt a regenerative brake as your generator. Not sure of their amp output though. Best Regards, David Colombo 804 College Ave Santa Rosa, CA. 95404 (707) 536-1424 www.SeaQuestor.com On Tue, Oct 17, 2017 at 2:53 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Kieth, > I have an extra 36v golf cart motor here, but there are two problems ,I > think, anyways. My understanding is, for a dc motor to work as a generator > it must have permanent magnets, I think? The next problem is the sheer > size and weight. these motors are quite heavy, witch is probably why they > are so robust. If it did work, it would be very tough and reliable. > Hank > > On Monday, October 16, 2017, 7:25:10 PM MDT, k6fee via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, > > What about using a surplus golf car motor as a generator? I know they are > 48 volts and if you run at lower rpm you should be able to get 36v out, I > would think. > > Keith T. > > > > Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone > > -------- Original message -------- > From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles org> > Date: 10/16/17 5:54 PM (GMT-08:00) > To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator > > Brian, > On 24v the motor takes 70A so at 36v it should be around 50A so I don't > think a charger will do it. I like your AC motor idea, except that I > intend to switch over to AGM when I dive and will drive the sub with the > main motor. I have to give it to the Nekton engineers, that drive with a > rudder, really works well. The addition of positioning thrusters up front > will be perfect. It would be different if I didn't use gamma as a boat and > sub all in one. I sure like your idea! I am going to see if I can find a > 3hp universal AC\DC motor. > Hank > > On Monday, October 16, 2017, 6:15:36 PM MDT, Brian Cox via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, If you did have one I wonder if that would work. I think they > put out about 10 amps. But there may be a duty cycle issue running a > charger for that purpose may shorten it's life. What about just running a > AC motor off of a regular AC generator for the sole purpose of getting > across the lake? > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles org> > To: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator > Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2017 23:09:44 +0000 (UTC) > > Brian, I don't have a 36v charger. I charge my bank 12v at a time. > Hank > > On Monday, October 16, 2017, 4:52:05 PM MDT, Brian Cox via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, Does your 36 volt charger put out enough amperage to power your > motors ? > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles org> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion org> > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator > Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2017 15:18:44 +0000 (UTC) > > Okay new idea, can't fit a diesel in my escape pod, so, I am thinking that > I will put a 36v dc generator (home made) in my inflatable tender that I > tow behind Gamma. I am installing the original 2hp drive in the escape pod > with the jettisoning prop assembly. I will feed the 2 hp 24v motor with > 36v so it will be 3hp. The motor is rated at 3hp 36v. I will run a power > cable from the generator to 3 12v batteries in the pod, and I will travel > on that power. When I dive I will switch to my 36v agm bank. That > should work since I am towing the tender anyways. I am having trouble > finding a 36v alternator. I want an alternator with internal regulator. I > guess in a pinch I can use 3 12v alternators but then it is not compact > anymore. Any ideas? > Hank > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ > listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ > listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 17 18:17:49 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 15:17:49 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] 36v alternator Message-ID: <20171017151749.EEF4670E@m0117164.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 20 13:24:01 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 12:24:01 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] =?utf-8?q?DNVGL?= Message-ID: <20171020172401.9014.qmail@server268.com> Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 20 13:51:03 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (MerlinSub@t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 19:51:03 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: <20171020172401.9014.qmail@server268.com> References: <20171020172401.9014.qmail@server268.com> Message-ID: <1508521863120.4346715.b9b7a31294f0949eb0d35cf49f81a464ef01b29f@spica.telekom.de> Scott the rules are online : https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) No need to ask an inspector. vbr Carsten -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" An: "PSUBS" Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 20 14:07:53 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 07:07:53 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: <20171020172401.9014.qmail@server268.com> References: <20171020172401.9014.qmail@server268.com> Message-ID: Scott, I have had contact with DNVGL for interpretation of some of their rules & have their answers on file somewhere. I didn't ask them about electrical or electronics regulations. What are you having a problem with? Alan Sent from my iPad > On 21/10/2017, at 6:24 AM, via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. > > Thank you, > Scott > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 20 17:57:32 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 16:57:32 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Message-ID: <201710202157.v9KLv6WS067291@whoweb.com> Thanks Carsten, We actually already have the rules and have been deep deep down the rabbit hole. Haha. There is some wording that does not jive with some of other parts as well as some things we are going to need acceptions on since we are a DSV and not a traditional submarine. Thank you,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: "MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles" Date: 10/20/17 12:51 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott the rules are online : https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) No need to ask an inspector. vbr Carsten -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" An: "PSUBS" Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 20 18:57:42 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 22:57:42 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: <201710202157.v9KLv6WS067291@whoweb.com> References: <201710202157.v9KLv6WS067291@whoweb.com> Message-ID: <367926139.1334555.1508540262966@mail.yahoo.com> What is the depth rating a sub needs to be to be considered a DSV?Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 3:57:54 PM MDT, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks Carsten, We actually already have the rules and have been deep deep down the rabbit hole. Haha. There is some wording that does not jive with some of other parts as well as some things we are going to need acceptions on since we are a DSV and not a traditional submarine. Thank you,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: "MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles" Date: 10/20/17 12:51 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott the rules are online : https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) No need to ask an inspector. vbr Carsten -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" An: "PSUBS" Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 20 20:26:18 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 20 Oct 2017 19:26:18 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Message-ID: <201710210025.v9L0Pq5A072734@whoweb.com> I have heard 2 things*2000m or more*Have the ballast use a high pressure pump. But there isn't a law or anything so I guess anyone could call anything they like. Haha Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date: 10/20/17 5:57 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL What is the depth rating a sub needs to be to be considered a DSV?Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 3:57:54 PM MDT, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks Carsten, We actually already have the rules and have been deep deep down the rabbit hole. Haha. There is some wording that does not jive with some of other parts as well as some things we are going to need acceptions on since we are a DSV and not a traditional submarine. Thank you,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: "MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles" Date: 10/20/17 12:51 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott the rules are online : https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) No need to ask an inspector. vbr Carsten -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" An: "PSUBS" Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 20 20:49:20 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 13:49:20 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: <201710210025.v9L0Pq5A072734@whoweb.com> References: <201710210025.v9L0Pq5A072734@whoweb.com> Message-ID: Scott, DNVGL considered my 500ft design as deep diving. Below is there response on this. Alan No. 500ft is seen as a deep depth, where even tec-divers will have difficulties to reach without special preparations. 96h additional life support is intended to enable rescue teams to arrive, find and reach the submersible as well to apply means for rescue of the submersible (if e.g. stucked or entangled, the pilot became unconscious, etc.) Sent from my iPad > On 21/10/2017, at 1:26 PM, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > I have heard 2 things > *2000m or more > *Have the ballast use a high pressure pump. > > But there isn't a law or anything so I guess anyone could call anything they like. Haha > > > > > > Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone > > -------- Original message -------- > From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > Date: 10/20/17 5:57 PM (GMT-06:00) > To: Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > > What is the depth rating a sub needs to be to be considered a DSV? > Hank > > On Friday, October 20, 2017, 3:57:54 PM MDT, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Thanks Carsten, > > We actually already have the rules and have been deep deep down the rabbit hole. Haha. There is some wording that does not jive with some of other parts as well as some things we are going to need acceptions on since we are a DSV and not a traditional submarine. > > Thank you, > Scott Waters > > > > Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone > > -------- Original message -------- > From: "MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles" > Date: 10/20/17 12:51 PM (GMT-06:00) > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > > Scott the rules are online : > > https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) > > No need to ask an inspector. > > vbr Carsten > > > > -----Original-Nachricht----- > Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 > Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" > An: "PSUBS" > > Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. > > Thank you, > Scott > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > ? > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 05:42:22 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:42:22 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: <201710210025.v9L0Pq5A072734@whoweb.com> Message-ID: <1994678613.233966.1508578942849@mail.yahoo.com> Scott,That makes sense. ?You are certainly a member of a very exclusive group. ?What is there, maybe 5 operating DSV's out there? ?Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 6:49:43 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Scott,DNVGL considered my 500ft design as deep diving.Below is there response on this.Alan No. 500ft is seen as a deep depth, where even tec-divers will have difficulties to reach without special preparations.? 96h additional life support is intended to enable rescue teams to arrive, find and reach the submersible as well to apply means for rescue of the submersible (if e.g. stucked or entangled, the pilot became unconscious, etc.) Sent from my iPad On 21/10/2017, at 1:26 PM, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: I have heard 2 things*2000m or more*Have the ballast use a high pressure pump. But there isn't a law or anything so I guess anyone could call anything they like. Haha Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date: 10/20/17 5:57 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL What is the depth rating a sub needs to be to be considered a DSV?Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 3:57:54 PM MDT, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks Carsten, We actually already have the rules and have been deep deep down the rabbit hole. Haha. There is some wording that does not jive with some of other parts as well as some things we are going to need acceptions on since we are a DSV and not a traditional submarine. Thank you,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: "MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles" Date: 10/20/17 12:51 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott the rules are online : https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) No need to ask an inspector. vbr Carsten -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" An: "PSUBS" Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www..psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 08:30:22 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (MerlinSub@t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 14:30:22 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: <1994678613.233966.1508578942849@mail.yahoo.com> References: <201710210025.v9L0Pq5A072734@whoweb.com> <1994678613.233966.1508578942849@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1508589022420.4431399.2095c508f615bae59565f3454be649be29c51c19@spica.telekom.de> 500 ft ?? Than nearly all our subs here are DSV.. By the way - the british salvage diver free the gold from the Edingburg wreck from 850 feet in the 70ies. And the record in chamber diving is around 2500 feet.. -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-21T11:50:05+0200 Von: "hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles" An: "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" Scott, That makes sense. You are certainly a member of a very exclusive group. What is there, maybe 5 operating DSV's out there? Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 6:49:43 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Scott, DNVGL considered my 500ft design as deep diving. Below is there response on this. Alan No. 500ft is seen as a deep depth, where even tec-divers will have difficulties to reach without special preparations. 96h additional life support is intended to enable rescue teams to arrive, find and reach the submersible as well to apply means for rescue of the submersible (if e.g. stucked or entangled, the pilot became unconscious, etc.) Sent from my iPad On 21/10/2017, at 1:26 PM, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org > wrote: I have heard 2 things *2000m or more *Have the ballast use a high pressure pump. But there isn't a law or anything so I guess anyone could call anything they like. Haha Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Date: 10/20/17 5:57 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL What is the depth rating a sub needs to be to be considered a DSV? Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 3:57:54 PM MDT, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: Thanks Carsten, We actually already have the rules and have been deep deep down the rabbit hole. Haha. There is some wording that does not jive with some of other parts as well as some things we are going to need acceptions on since we are a DSV and not a traditional submarine. Thank you, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: "MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles" > Date: 10/20/17 12:51 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion < personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott the rules are online : https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) No need to ask an inspector. vbr Carsten -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" > An: "PSUBS" > Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www..psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 10:03:38 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 14:03:38 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Vessel for hire Message-ID: Looking over the "6 pack" requirements for a US Coast Guard license, they don't seem to fit our world of submersibles, yet appear to be the minimum for putting a paying passenger on board. If some researcher or contractor wanted to ride around in the back of Harold, how could that happen legally? Anyone have experience in all this? Thanks. Get Outlook for Android -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 10:51:30 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 09:51:30 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Message-ID: <201710211451.v9LEp550020608@whoweb.com> There is the following operating:*Alvin (USA)*Pisces IV (USA)*Pisces V (USA)*Jialong (China)*Shinkai (Japan)*Nautile (France) MIR1 and MIR2 from Russia were retired Soon to be operating are Pisces VI and Cyclops 2 Thank you,Scott Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date: 10/21/17 4:42 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Alan via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott,That makes sense. ?You are certainly a member of a very exclusive group. ?What is there, maybe 5 operating DSV's out there? ?Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 6:49:43 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Scott,DNVGL considered my 500ft design as deep diving.Below is there response on this.Alan No. 500ft is seen as a deep depth, where even tec-divers will have difficulties to reach without special preparations.? 96h additional life support is intended to enable rescue teams to arrive, find and reach the submersible as well to apply means for rescue of the submersible (if e.g. stucked or entangled, the pilot became unconscious, etc.) Sent from my iPad On 21/10/2017, at 1:26 PM, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: I have heard 2 things*2000m or more*Have the ballast use a high pressure pump. But there isn't a law or anything so I guess anyone could call anything they like. Haha Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Date: 10/20/17 5:57 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL What is the depth rating a sub needs to be to be considered a DSV?Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 3:57:54 PM MDT, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Thanks Carsten, We actually already have the rules and have been deep deep down the rabbit hole. Haha. There is some wording that does not jive with some of other parts as well as some things we are going to need acceptions on since we are a DSV and not a traditional submarine. Thank you,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: "MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles" Date: 10/20/17 12:51 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott the rules are online : https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) No need to ask an inspector. vbr Carsten -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" An: "PSUBS" Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www..psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 13:11:52 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 12:11:52 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Message-ID: Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads. UWT pt4 ch8 sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. Thanks, -River J. Dolfi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 14:18:25 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (RICK Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 08:18:25 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Vessel for hire In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <59eb8f72.d9d3620a.f2b85.2250@mx.google.com> Brian, A friend of mine completely rebuilt an L-39 Albatross 2 seater jet for re sale and it is classed as ?experimental? so cannot legally take people up for hire but when I flew in it a couple of times before he sold it, I gave him a (donation) which he said was legal. I have also herd of people paying for a T shirt or giving money to join a club and getting a ride in something that you legally can?t charge money for. You also need a well worded disclaimer drawn up by an attorney that they sign before stepping inside the sub that they fully understand and are aware of the fact that this is considered a dangerous venture and are willing to take the chances. Things can certainly penetrate that document in court like gross negligence etc. but at least you have a better chance of prevailing than if you didn?t have them sign anything at all. Rick Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Saturday, October 21, 2017 4:04 AM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Vessel for hire Looking over the "6 pack" requirements for a US Coast Guard license, they don't seem to fit our world of submersibles, yet appear to be the minimum for putting a paying passenger on board.? If some researcher or contractor wanted to ride around in the back of Harold, how could that happen legally? Anyone have experience in all this? Thanks. Get Outlook for Android -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 14:41:36 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 14:41:36 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I don't have much to offer by way of interpreting the rule, but it does occur to me that you could skirt it by using solid bus bars instead of cables for the DC mains. Sean Sent from ProtonMail mobile -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 21, 2017, 11:11, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. > > One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads. UWT pt4 ch8 sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. > > Thanks, > > -River J. Dolfi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 14:49:46 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 14:49:46 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Also - the DC electrical should be a non ground-referenced system (neither terminal connected to chassis / safety earth), so a single failure which shorted either side of the DC mains to ground would tie these potentials together, but should not result in any sustained current flow. An alarm which alerts you to the presence of continuity between the hull / safety earth and either battery terminal should be present to warn you of such a short and allow you to fix it before a second fault to the other side of the battery actually creates a short circuit at battery potential. Sean Sent from ProtonMail mobile -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 21, 2017, 11:11, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. > > One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads. UWT pt4 ch8 sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. > > Thanks, > > -River J. Dolfi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 14:55:23 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 13:55:23 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Message-ID: <201710211855.v9LIsvDN028332@whoweb.com> Sean, On a DSV the batteries are in a separate compartment filled with oil. The cables go from the battery box to the hull.?My interpretation of the rule is it did not consider this.? Thank you,Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message --------From: "Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles" Date: 10/21/17 1:41 PM (GMT-06:00) To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries.? ? One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads. UWT pt4 ch8 sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. Thanks, -River J. Dolfi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 15:12:55 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 15:12:55 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: <201710211855.v9LIsvDN028332@whoweb.com> References: <201710211855.v9LIsvDN028332@whoweb.com> Message-ID: Noise rejection is not the only use case for cable shielding. Specifically in consideration of shielding which is also a physically robust wire braid, it is, in fact, indicated around power cables specifically because a tool or other object which inadvertently cuts into the cable will likely short that power into the shield, versus into the tool or cutting object which likely has some resistance, and it also provides a physical barrier such that inadvertent contact which cuts into the cable at all will be arrested physically as it is electrically in contact with only the safety earth potential. Think of putting a utility knife to it. You don't want to be able to slice through neoprene, PVC or polyolefin like a knife through butter and contact the core without something getting in the way for safety. Sean Sent from ProtonMail mobile -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 21, 2017, 12:55, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Sean, > > On a DSV the batteries are in a separate compartment filled with oil. The cables go from the battery box to the hull. > My interpretation of the rule is it did not consider this. > > Thank you, > Scott Waters > > Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone > > -------- Original message -------- > From: "Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles" > Date: 10/21/17 1:41 PM (GMT-06:00) > To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > > Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. > > One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads. UWT pt4 ch8 sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. > > Thanks, > > -River J. Dolfi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 16:02:16 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 15:02:16 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Message-ID: Sean, An alarmed device to measure leakage to ground on all polarities is a requirement for DNVGL, recently made a requirement for ABS, and was original equipment on Pisces VI. Fortunately, it is an easy thing to implement. I understand that because negative and ground are separate that without a second fault on the negative side there will be no current flow, but why tempt fate? Maybe I'm thinking into this too much. -River J. Dolfi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 16:51:11 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 13:51:11 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: 5v8CeBt3h3OTt5v8DeGNiM References: 5v8CeBt3h3OTt5v8DeGNiM Message-ID: <003301d34aae$552465d0$ff6d3170$@telus.net> Don't forget the soon to be operational Pronk Nekton Gamma. From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Saturday, October 21, 2017 7:52 AM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL There is the following operating: *Alvin (USA) *Pisces IV (USA) *Pisces V (USA) *Jialong (China) *Shinkai (Japan) *Nautile (France) MIR1 and MIR2 from Russia were retired Soon to be operating are Pisces VI and Cyclops 2 Thank you, Scott Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > Date: 10/21/17 4:42 AM (GMT-06:00) To: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott, That makes sense. You are certainly a member of a very exclusive group. What is there, maybe 5 operating DSV's out there? Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 6:49:43 PM MDT, Alan via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: Scott, DNVGL considered my 500ft design as deep diving. Below is there response on this. Alan No. 500ft is seen as a deep depth, where even tec-divers will have difficulties to reach without special preparations. 96h additional life support is intended to enable rescue teams to arrive, find and reach the submersible as well to apply means for rescue of the submersible (if e.g. stucked or entangled, the pilot became unconscious, etc.) Sent from my iPad On 21/10/2017, at 1:26 PM, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: I have heard 2 things *2000m or more *Have the ballast use a high pressure pump. But there isn't a law or anything so I guess anyone could call anything they like. Haha Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > Date: 10/20/17 5:57 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL What is the depth rating a sub needs to be to be considered a DSV? Hank On Friday, October 20, 2017, 3:57:54 PM MDT, Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: Thanks Carsten, We actually already have the rules and have been deep deep down the rabbit hole. Haha. There is some wording that does not jive with some of other parts as well as some things we are going to need acceptions on since we are a DSV and not a traditional submarine. Thank you, Scott Waters Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: "MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles" > Date: 10/20/17 12:51 PM (GMT-06:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Scott the rules are online : https://rules.dnvgl.com/ServiceDocuments/dnvgl/#!/industry/1/Maritime/5/DNV%20GL%20rules%20for%20classification:%20Underwater%20technology%20(RU-UWT) No need to ask an inspector. vbr Carsten -----Original-Nachricht----- Betreff: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Datum: 2017-10-20T19:26:21+0200 Von: "via Personal_Submersibles" > An: "PSUBS" > Is there anyone on PSUBS that is familiar with DNVGL rules? We have some basic questions, but are trying not to consult an inspector for every question because of the cost. Thank you, Scott _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www..psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 17:00:25 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 17:00:25 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <_QGd3CmT2GLNy1Y7iUxNhIyAGsiaoZ-kg1TYZSxseyOuMCfaY4TXxmpl_6IV5UWIb_-o8y5qjDp9mgCk1bPqcC5IvP-AM_7Ia5axRcIoRjI=@protonmail.com> I presume that even in the unlikely event of the double isolation failure which could create a short circuit current, that the DC mains are also protected as close as is feasible to the batteries by some manner of fuse or circuit breaker? Sean Sent from ProtonMail mobile -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 21, 2017, 14:02, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Sean, > An alarmed device to measure leakage to ground on all polarities is a requirement for DNVGL, recently made a requirement for ABS, and was original equipment on Pisces VI. Fortunately, it is an easy thing to implement. > > I understand that because negative and ground are separate that without a second fault on the negative side there will be no current flow, but why tempt fate? Maybe I'm thinking into this too much. > -River J. Dolfi -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 17:09:18 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 21:09:18 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: <_QGd3CmT2GLNy1Y7iUxNhIyAGsiaoZ-kg1TYZSxseyOuMCfaY4TXxmpl_6IV5UWIb_-o8y5qjDp9mgCk1bPqcC5IvP-AM_7Ia5axRcIoRjI=@protonmail.com> References: <_QGd3CmT2GLNy1Y7iUxNhIyAGsiaoZ-kg1TYZSxseyOuMCfaY4TXxmpl_6IV5UWIb_-o8y5qjDp9mgCk1bPqcC5IvP-AM_7Ia5axRcIoRjI=@protonmail.com> Message-ID: <356103685.1724027.1508620158422@mail.yahoo.com> Tim,I was going to say there is another soon to be operational as in, Elementary 3000, but it is not a DSV ;-)?Hank On Saturday, October 21, 2017, 3:00:50 PM MDT, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles wrote: I presume that even in the unlikely event of the double isolation failure which could create a short circuit current, that the DC mains are also protected as close as is feasible to the batteries by some manner of fuse or circuit breaker? Sean Sent from ProtonMail mobile -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 21, 2017, 14:02, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: Sean,An alarmed device to measure leakage to ground on all polarities is a requirement for DNVGL, recently made a requirement for ABS, and was original equipment on Pisces VI. Fortunately, it is an easy thing to implement. I understand that because negative and ground are separate that without a second fault on the negative side there will be no current flow, but why tempt fate? Maybe I'm thinking into this too much. -River J. Dolfi_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 17:12:08 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 21:12:08 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1609237950.1722793.1508620328858@mail.yahoo.com> River,My first though to this question is to use a simple tec cable, the type we burry to feed power to our house. ?The cable is shielded with an armour jacket ?encapsulated in a plastic sheath. ?That cable is EXTREMELY tough and could satisfy the rule? ?Also you can but it at True Value Hardware stores ;-)Hank On Saturday, October 21, 2017, 11:12:11 AM MDT, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries.? ? One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads. UWT pt4 ch8 sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. Thanks, -River J. Dolfi_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 18:43:27 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 17:43:27 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Sean, that all makes sense. They should pay you to write this stuff! River J Dolfi On Oct 21, 2017 3:52 PM, "via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Sean, > An alarmed device to measure leakage to ground on all polarities is a > requirement for DNVGL, recently made a requirement for ABS, and was > original equipment on Pisces VI. Fortunately, it is an easy thing to > implement. > > I understand that because negative and ground are separate that without a > second fault on the negative side there will be no current flow, but why > tempt fate? Maybe I'm thinking into this too much. > -River J. Dolfi > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 20:04:50 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:04:50 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] =?utf-8?q?DNVGL?= In-Reply-To: <_QGd3CmT2GLNy1Y7iUxNhIyAGsiaoZ-kg1TYZSxseyOuMCfaY4TXxmpl_6IV5UWIb_-o8y5qjDp9mgCk1bPqcC5IvP-AM_7Ia5axRcIoRjI=@protonmail.com> References: <_QGd3CmT2GLNy1Y7iUxNhIyAGsiaoZ-kg1TYZSxseyOuMCfaY4TXxmpl_6IV5UWIb_-o8y5qjDp9mgCk1bPqcC5IvP-AM_7Ia5axRcIoRjI=@protonmail.com> Message-ID: <20171022000450.7254.qmail@server268.com> Sean, The positive has 4 fuses in the box (4 legs) in the case one leg fails you still have power and in the case of a dead short prior to the breakers that the fuse will blow. Once the cable penetrates the hull it goes to a double pole breaker then distributed from there. The negative is a single cable with one fuse and once it penetrates the hull it goes to a double pole breaker and distributed from there. I completely agree the shielding of the battery cables is a good idea because of strength of the cable and to help if the insolation is cut by something. The part where I struggle with is why ground the shield of the battery cables to the hull? The only thing that could make sense is fault indication on the battery main cable. Is that the reason? Thank you, Scott Waters > -------Original Message------- > From: Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles > To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > Sent: Oct 21 '17 16:01 > > I presume that even in the unlikely event of the double isolation > failure which could create a short circuit current, that the DC mains > are also protected as close as is feasible to the batteries by some > manner of fuse or circuit breaker? > > Sean > > Sent from ProtonMail mobile > > -------- Original Message -------- > On Oct 21, 2017, 14:02, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Sean, > An alarmed device to measure leakage to ground on all polarities is a > requirement for DNVGL, recently made a requirement for ABS, and was > original equipment on Pisces VI. Fortunately, it is an easy thing to > implement. > > I understand that because negative and ground are separate that > without a second fault on the negative side there will be no current > flow, but why tempt fate? Maybe I'm thinking into this too much. > > -River J. Dolfi > > ------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 20:37:11 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 13:37:11 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2150FCD5-CC63-4209-A0E6-519AF7D6D3D0@yahoo.com> Scott, River. I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that I could build to their specifications without going through their $100,000 process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all depends on how many questions you have. The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for ships.. If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could wire up a super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised control. Sean is right about no earths in submarines. The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the cable is sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull fittings at UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building for a predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking their brains when I went there. They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one failure can result in a major event. What sort of batteries have you got? Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil compensated battery. http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers but I don't know if they did, or whether it's in process. https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ Alan Sent from my iPad > On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. > > One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads. UWT pt4 ch8 sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. > > Thanks, > > -River J. Dolfi > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 20:56:06 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:56:06 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] =?utf-8?q?DNVGL?= In-Reply-To: <2150FCD5-CC63-4209-A0E6-519AF7D6D3D0@yahoo.com> References: <2150FCD5-CC63-4209-A0E6-519AF7D6D3D0@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20171022005606.16494.qmail@server268.com> Alan, I believe you mean there is no Negative or Positive connected to the frame. Earth is neither negative or positive. We are going through the full process and have been working with Jonathan Struwe from DNVGL. Our batteries are lead acid and are coincidentally the exact same as DSV Alvin uses. Thank you, Scott Waters > -------Original Message------- > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > Sent: Oct 21 '17 19:38 > > Scott, River. > I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that > I > could build to their specifications without going through their > $100,000 > process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all > depends on how many questions you have. > The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for > ships. > If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could > wire up a > super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised > control. > Sean is right about no earths in submarines. > The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the > cable is > sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull > fittings at > UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building > for a > predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. > DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking > their > brains when I went there. > They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one > failure > can result in a major event. > What sort of batteries have you got? > Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil > compensated > battery. > http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery > South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were > looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers > but I don't > know if they did, or whether it's in process. > https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ > Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > > Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret > > the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the > > essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to > > oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to > > "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL > > has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. > > > > One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads.. UWT pt4 ch8 > > sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with > > (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED > > braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an > > insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery > > cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous > > ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. > > While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who > > require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to > > be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. > > > > Thanks, > > > > -River J. Dolfi > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > ------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 21 21:49:32 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 14:49:32 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: <20171022005606.16494.qmail@server268.com> References: <2150FCD5-CC63-4209-A0E6-519AF7D6D3D0@yahoo.com> <20171022005606.16494.qmail@server268.com> Message-ID: <14BFB98A-2F58-441F-BF41-17126199E698@yahoo.com> Scott, earth can mean a common return path for electrical current, as in a car. That is what I was referring to. Didn't know you were going through the whole process. What fun! I have kind of given up on it as I am building a lot of stuff myself, like lights, thrusters, solenoid ballast valves & electronic contents gauge. All these would need to go through their type approval process. I believe they have a list of DNVGL type approved items that you can choose from if you want something off the shelf. Something I found amusing was that they said you need 4 days emergency food. I asked them what they meant by this, "2 chickens in a chilli bin" They specified seven oceans emergency rations! Cheers Alan Sent from my iPad > On 22/10/2017, at 1:56 PM, via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Alan, > > I believe you mean there is no Negative or Positive connected to the frame. Earth is neither negative or positive. We are going through the full process and have been working with Jonathan Struwe from DNVGL. Our batteries are lead acid and are coincidentally the exact same as DSV Alvin uses. > > Thank you, > Scott Waters > >> -------Original Message------- >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >> Sent: Oct 21 '17 19:38 >> >> Scott, River. >> I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that >> I >> could build to their specifications without going through their >> $100,000 >> process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all >> depends on how many questions you have. >> The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for >> ships. >> If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could >> wire up a >> super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised >> control. >> Sean is right about no earths in submarines. >> The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the >> cable is >> sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull >> fittings at >> UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building >> for a >> predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. >> DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking >> their >> brains when I went there. >> They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one >> failure >> can result in a major event. >> What sort of batteries have you got? >> Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil >> compensated >> battery. >> http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery >> South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were >> looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers >> but I don't >> know if they did, or whether it's in process. >> https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ >> Alan >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles >> wrote: >> >>> Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret >>> the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the >>> essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to >>> oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to >>> "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL >>> has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. >>> >>> One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads.. UWT pt4 ch8 >>> sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with >>> (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED >>> braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an >>> insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery >>> cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous >>> ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. >>> While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who >>> require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to >>> be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> -River J. Dolfi >> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> ------------------------- >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 00:02:06 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 00:02:06 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine Message-ID: Does anyone have the entire Popular Science article from June, 1968?? I found someone who might be interested in building the thing, but I can't get the whole PS thing.? Google books didn't let me find a few of the pages. There's a source for the plans online but the article provides more information. Thanks. Mike --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 02:42:33 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 19:42:33 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3AD8B768-4DEE-4553-8F06-E5D39348D2A8@yahoo.com> Michael, you can buy it on amazon. https://www.amazon.com/Popular-Science-Astronaut-Exciting-Adventure/dp/B001PL5V2A Alan Sent from my iPad > On 22/10/2017, at 5:02 PM, Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Does anyone have the entire Popular Science article from June, 1968? I found someone who might be interested in building the thing, but I can't get the whole PS thing. Google books didn't let me find a few of the pages. > > There's a source for the plans online but the article provides more information. > > Thanks. > > > Mike > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 12:32:12 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 16:32:12 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> Hi All,Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is fully submersible. ?The actuator can lift 50lbs ?at 1 inch per second approximately. ?The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make. ?This one has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the manipulator. ? ?I can either air compensate ?or oil compensate the actuator. ?I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no compensation to an undetermined depth. ?Hank ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: hank pronk To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDTSubject: Fw: actuator From: xxx xxxxx Sent: October 22, 2017 10:23 AM To: Hendrik Subject: actuator? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_0522.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 22073 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 13:18:13 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 10:18:13 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator In-Reply-To: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> References: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, how did you modify it? Have you tested it for depth rating? I need a couple for 600 ft and a rainy day project. On Oct 22, 2017 9:37 AM, "hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi All, > Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is fully > submersible. The actuator can lift 50lbs at 1 inch per second > approximately. The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make. This one > has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the > manipulator. I can either air compensate or oil compensate the > actuator. I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no > compensation to an undetermined depth. > Hank > > ----- Forwarded Message ----- > *From:* hank pronk > *To:* hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca > *Sent:* Sunday, October 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDT > *Subject:* Fw: actuator > > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* xxx xxxxx > *Sent:* October 22, 2017 10:23 AM > *To:* Hendrik > *Subject:* actuator > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_0522.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 22073 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 13:18:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 10:18:14 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator In-Reply-To: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> References: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, how did you modify it? Have you tested it for depth rating? I need a couple for 600 ft and a rainy day project. On Oct 22, 2017 9:37 AM, "hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles" < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi All, > Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is fully > submersible. The actuator can lift 50lbs at 1 inch per second > approximately. The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make. This one > has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the > manipulator. I can either air compensate or oil compensate the > actuator. I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no > compensation to an undetermined depth. > Hank > > ----- Forwarded Message ----- > *From:* hank pronk > *To:* hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca > *Sent:* Sunday, October 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDT > *Subject:* Fw: actuator > > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* xxx xxxxx > *Sent:* October 22, 2017 10:23 AM > *To:* Hendrik > *Subject:* actuator > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_0522.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 22073 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 14:17:44 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 18:17:44 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator In-Reply-To: References: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <222683316.2038155.1508696264060@mail.yahoo.com> David,I did not modify an existing electric actuator. ?I modified an air cylinder by installing a gear head motor inside with a threaded rod.I am loading a video on youtube right now so you can see the performance. ?I can make you a couple when your ready and I have perfected them. ?I have a pressure chamber plenty bit for the actuator that can test to 5,000 feet.Hank On Sunday, October 22, 2017, 11:18:33 AM MDT, David Colombo via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,? how did you modify it? Have you tested it for depth rating? I need a couple for 600 ft and a rainy day project. On Oct 22, 2017 9:37 AM, "hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles" wrote: Hi All,Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is fully submersible.? The actuator can lift 50lbs ?at 1 inch per second approximately.? The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make.? This one has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the manipulator. ? ?I can either air compensate ?or oil compensate the actuator.? I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no compensation to an undetermined depth. ?Hank ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: hank pronk To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDTSubject: Fw: actuator From: xxx xxxxx Sent: October 22, 2017 10:23 AM To: Hendrik Subject: actuator? ______________________________ _________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_0522.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 22073 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 14:54:44 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 13:54:44 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL Message-ID: Don't give up hope (yet) Alan! If you check the DNVGL documentation requirement definitions (RU SHIP Pt1, CH3, sec 2, sub-sec 1.2) you will find that type approval (TA) is basically a short-cut method to avoid being required to submit design paperwork for direct approval (AP) by DNVGL. If allowed, you can submit a type approval instead of having your component individually approved. The good (and bad) news is, the manned submersible rules (RU UWT pt5 chp6 sec2 subsec 5.2) state that *everything* on a sub is AP, subject to approval, so there is no need to use exclusively TA components. Even if you built a sub with only type-approved components, you still need to provide engineering documents, manufacturer certificates, and they all need re-approved by the society on a case-by-case (read: expensive and slow) basis. Or atleast that's what I understand from my reading of the rules. I'm an engineer, not a lawyer god-damn-it! Thanks, -River J. Dolfi On Sun, Oct 22, 2017 at 11:36 AM, via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > personal_submersibles-owner at psubs.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Personal_Submersibles digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: DNVGL (via Personal_Submersibles) > 2. Re: DNVGL (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) > 3. Markham submarine (Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles) > 4. Re: Markham submarine (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) > 5. Fw: actuator (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:56:06 -0500 > From: via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > Message-ID: <20171022005606.16494.qmail at server268.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Alan, > > I believe you mean there is no Negative or Positive connected to the > frame. Earth is neither negative or positive. We are going through the full > process and have been working with Jonathan Struwe from DNVGL. Our > batteries are lead acid and are coincidentally the exact same as DSV Alvin > uses. > > Thank you, > Scott Waters > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > > Sent: Oct 21 '17 19:38 > > > > Scott, River. > > I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that > > I > > could build to their specifications without going through their > > $100,000 > > process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all > > depends on how many questions you have. > > The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for > > ships. > > If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could > > wire up a > > super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised > > control. > > Sean is right about no earths in submarines. > > The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the > > cable is > > sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull > > fittings at > > UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building > > for a > > predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. > > DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking > > their > > brains when I went there. > > They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one > > failure > > can result in a major event. > > What sort of batteries have you got? > > Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil > > compensated > > battery. > > http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery > > South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were > > looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers > > but I don't > > know if they did, or whether it's in process. > > https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ > > Alan > > > > Sent from my iPad > > > > On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles > > wrote: > > > > > Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret > > > the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the > > > essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to > > > oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to > > > "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL > > > has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. > > > > > > One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads.. UWT pt4 ch8 > > > sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with > > > (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED > > > braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an > > > insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery > > > cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous > > > ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. > > > While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who > > > require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to > > > be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > -River J. Dolfi > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > ------------------------- > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 14:49:32 +1300 > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > Message-ID: <14BFB98A-2F58-441F-BF41-17126199E698 at yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Scott, > earth can mean a common return path for electrical current, as > in a car. That is what I was referring to. > Didn't know you were going through the whole process. What fun! > I have kind of given up on it as I am building a lot of stuff myself, > like lights, thrusters, solenoid ballast valves & electronic contents > gauge. > All these would need to go through their type approval process. > I believe they have a list of DNVGL type approved items that you can > choose from if you want something off the shelf. > Something I found amusing was that they said you need 4 days emergency > food. I asked them what they meant by this, "2 chickens in a chilli bin" > They specified seven oceans emergency rations! > Cheers Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > > On 22/10/2017, at 1:56 PM, via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > > > Alan, > > > > I believe you mean there is no Negative or Positive connected to the > frame. Earth is neither negative or positive. We are going through the full > process and have been working with Jonathan Struwe from DNVGL. Our > batteries are lead acid and are coincidentally the exact same as DSV Alvin > uses. > > > > Thank you, > > Scott Waters > > > >> -------Original Message------- > >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > >> Sent: Oct 21 '17 19:38 > >> > >> Scott, River. > >> I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that > >> I > >> could build to their specifications without going through their > >> $100,000 > >> process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all > >> depends on how many questions you have. > >> The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for > >> ships. > >> If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could > >> wire up a > >> super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised > >> control. > >> Sean is right about no earths in submarines. > >> The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the > >> cable is > >> sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull > >> fittings at > >> UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building > >> for a > >> predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. > >> DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking > >> their > >> brains when I went there. > >> They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one > >> failure > >> can result in a major event. > >> What sort of batteries have you got? > >> Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil > >> compensated > >> battery. > >> http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery > >> South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were > >> looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers > >> but I don't > >> know if they did, or whether it's in process. > >> https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ > >> Alan > >> > >> Sent from my iPad > >> > >> On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles > >> wrote: > >> > >>> Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret > >>> the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the > >>> essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to > >>> oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to > >>> "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL > >>> has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. > >>> > >>> One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads.. UWT pt4 ch8 > >>> sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with > >>> (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED > >>> braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an > >>> insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery > >>> cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous > >>> ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. > >>> While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who > >>> require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to > >>> be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. > >>> > >>> Thanks, > >>> > >>> -River J. Dolfi > >> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >> > >> ------------------------- > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 00:02:06 -0400 > From: Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles > > To: psubs list > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed > > Does anyone have the entire Popular Science article from June, 1968?? I > found someone who might be interested in building the thing, but I can't > get the whole PS thing.? Google books didn't let me find a few of the > pages. > > There's a source for the plans online but the article provides more > information. > > Thanks. > > > Mike > > --- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 19:42:33 +1300 > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine > Message-ID: <3AD8B768-4DEE-4553-8F06-E5D39348D2A8 at yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Michael, > you can buy it on amazon. > https://www.amazon.com/Popular-Science-Astronaut-Exciting-Adventure/dp/ > B001PL5V2A > Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > > On 22/10/2017, at 5:02 PM, Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > > > Does anyone have the entire Popular Science article from June, 1968? I > found someone who might be interested in building the thing, but I can't > get the whole PS thing. Google books didn't let me find a few of the pages. > > > > There's a source for the plans online but the article provides more > information. > > > > Thanks. > > > > > > Mike > > > > --- > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 16:32:12 +0000 (UTC) > From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator > Message-ID: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939 at mail.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Hi All,Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is > fully submersible. ?The actuator can lift 50lbs ?at 1 inch per second > approximately. ?The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make. ?This one > has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the > manipulator. ? ?I can either air compensate ?or oil compensate the > actuator. ?I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no > compensation to an undetermined depth. ?Hank > ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: hank pronk To: > hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October > 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDTSubject: Fw: actuator > > > > > > From: xxx xxxxx > Sent: October 22, 2017 10:23 AM > To: Hendrik > Subject: actuator? > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: 20171022/e6d55329/attachment.html> > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: IMG_0522.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 22073 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: 20171022/e6d55329/attachment.jpeg> > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 52, Issue 33 > ***************************************************** > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 15:02:07 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 15:02:07 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: My understanding is that while all systems must be approved by the certifying agency in any case, using type-approved components wherever possible makes that much more of a rubber stamp process, versus racking up billable engineering hours. Sean T. Stevenson +1.587.873.7326 Sent with [ProtonMail](https://protonmail.com) Secure Email. > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL > Local Time: October 22, 2017 12:54 PM > UTC Time: October 22, 2017 6:54 PM > From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org > To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > Don't give up hope (yet) Alan! > > If you check the DNVGL documentation requirement definitions (RU SHIP Pt1, CH3, sec 2, sub-sec 1.2) you will find that type approval (TA) is basically a short-cut method to avoid being required to submit design paperwork for direct approval (AP) by DNVGL. If allowed, you can submit a type approval instead of having your component individually approved. > > The good (and bad) news is, the manned submersible rules (RU UWT pt5 chp6 sec2 subsec 5.2) state that *everything* on a sub is AP, subject to approval, so there is no need to use exclusively TA components. Even if you built a sub with only type-approved components, you still need to provide engineering documents, manufacturer certificates, and they all need re-approved by the society on a case-by-case (read: expensive and slow) basis. > > Or atleast that's what I understand from my reading of the rules. I'm an engineer, not a lawyer god-damn-it! > > Thanks, > > -River J. Dolfi > > On Sun, Oct 22, 2017 at 11:36 AM, via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > >> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> personal_submersibles-owner at psubs.org >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of Personal_Submersibles digest..." >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> 1. Re: DNVGL (via Personal_Submersibles) >> 2. Re: DNVGL (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) >> 3. Markham submarine (Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles) >> 4. Re: Markham submarine (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) >> 5. Fw: actuator (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:56:06 -0500 >> From: via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >> Message-ID: <20171022005606.16494.qmail at server268.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Alan, >> >> I believe you mean there is no Negative or Positive connected to the frame. Earth is neither negative or positive. We are going through the full process and have been working with Jonathan Struwe from DNVGL. Our batteries are lead acid and are coincidentally the exact same as DSV Alvin uses. >> >> Thank you, >> Scott Waters >> >>> -------Original Message------- >>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >>> Sent: Oct 21 '17 19:38 >>> >>> Scott, River. >>> I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that >>> I >>> could build to their specifications without going through their >>> $100,000 >>> process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all >>> depends on how many questions you have. >>> The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for >>> ships. >>> If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could >>> wire up a >>> super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised >>> control. >>> Sean is right about no earths in submarines. >>> The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the >>> cable is >>> sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull >>> fittings at >>> UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building >>> for a >>> predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. >>> DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking >>> their >>> brains when I went there. >>> They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one >>> failure >>> can result in a major event. >>> What sort of batteries have you got? >>> Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil >>> compensated >>> battery. >>> http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery >>> South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were >>> looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers >>> but I don't >>> know if they did, or whether it's in process. >>> https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ >>> Alan >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles >>> wrote: >>> >>> > Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret >>> > the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the >>> > essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to >>> > oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to >>> > "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL >>> > has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. >>> > >>> > One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads.. UWT pt4 ch8 >>> > sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with >>> > (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED >>> > braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an >>> > insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery >>> > cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous >>> > ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. >>> > While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who >>> > require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to >>> > be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. >>> > >>> > Thanks, >>> > >>> > -River J. Dolfi >>> >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> ------------------------- >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 2 >> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 14:49:32 +1300 >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >> Message-ID: <14BFB98A-2F58-441F-BF41-17126199E698 at yahoo.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >> >> Scott, >> earth can mean a common return path for electrical current, as >> in a car. That is what I was referring to. >> Didn't know you were going through the whole process. What fun! >> I have kind of given up on it as I am building a lot of stuff myself, >> like lights, thrusters, solenoid ballast valves & electronic contents gauge. >> All these would need to go through their type approval process. >> I believe they have a list of DNVGL type approved items that you can >> choose from if you want something off the shelf. >> Something I found amusing was that they said you need 4 days emergency >> food. I asked them what they meant by this, "2 chickens in a chilli bin" >> They specified seven oceans emergency rations! >> Cheers Alan >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On 22/10/2017, at 1:56 PM, via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >>> >>> Alan, >>> >>> I believe you mean there is no Negative or Positive connected to the frame. Earth is neither negative or positive. We are going through the full process and have been working with Jonathan Struwe from DNVGL. Our batteries are lead acid and are coincidentally the exact same as DSV Alvin uses. >>> >>> Thank you, >>> Scott Waters >>> >>>> -------Original Message------- >>>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >>>> Sent: Oct 21 '17 19:38 >>>> >>>> Scott, River. >>>> I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that >>>> I >>>> could build to their specifications without going through their >>>> $100,000 >>>> process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all >>>> depends on how many questions you have. >>>> The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for >>>> ships. >>>> If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could >>>> wire up a >>>> super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised >>>> control. >>>> Sean is right about no earths in submarines. >>>> The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the >>>> cable is >>>> sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull >>>> fittings at >>>> UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building >>>> for a >>>> predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. >>>> DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking >>>> their >>>> brains when I went there. >>>> They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one >>>> failure >>>> can result in a major event. >>>> What sort of batteries have you got? >>>> Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil >>>> compensated >>>> battery. >>>> http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery >>>> South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were >>>> looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers >>>> but I don't >>>> know if they did, or whether it's in process. >>>> https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ >>>> Alan >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>> On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret >>>>> the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the >>>>> essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to >>>>> oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to >>>>> "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL >>>>> has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. >>>>> >>>>> One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads.. UWT pt4 ch8 >>>>> sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with >>>>> (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED >>>>> braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an >>>>> insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery >>>>> cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous >>>>> ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. >>>>> While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who >>>>> require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to >>>>> be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> -River J. Dolfi >>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>>> >>>> ------------------------- >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 3 >> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 00:02:06 -0400 >> From: Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles >> >> To: psubs list >> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine >> Message-ID: >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed >> >> Does anyone have the entire Popular Science article from June, 1968?? I >> found someone who might be interested in building the thing, but I can't >> get the whole PS thing.? Google books didn't let me find a few of the pages. >> >> There's a source for the plans online but the article provides more >> information. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Mike >> >> --- >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> https://www.avast.com/antivirus >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 4 >> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 19:42:33 +1300 >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine >> Message-ID: <3AD8B768-4DEE-4553-8F06-E5D39348D2A8 at yahoo.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >> >> Michael, >> you can buy it on amazon. >> https://www.amazon.com/Popular-Science-Astronaut-Exciting-Adventure/dp/B001PL5V2A >> Alan >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On 22/10/2017, at 5:02 PM, Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >>> >>> Does anyone have the entire Popular Science article from June, 1968? I found someone who might be interested in building the thing, but I can't get the whole PS thing. Google books didn't let me find a few of the pages. >>> >>> There's a source for the plans online but the article provides more information. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> --- >>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Message: 5 >> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 16:32:12 +0000 (UTC) >> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles >> >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> >> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator >> Message-ID: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939 at mail.yahoo.com> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> Hi All,Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is fully submersible. ?The actuator can lift 50lbs ?at 1 inch per second approximately. ?The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make. ?This one has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the manipulator. ? ?I can either air compensate ?or oil compensate the actuator. ?I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no compensation to an undetermined depth. ?Hank >> ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: hank pronk To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDTSubject: Fw: actuator >> >> From: xxx xxxxx >> Sent: October 22, 2017 10:23 AM >> To: Hendrik >> Subject: actuator? >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: IMG_0522.jpeg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 22073 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> Subject: Digest Footer >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> End of Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 52, Issue 33 >> ***************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 14:37:27 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 14:37:27 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine In-Reply-To: <3AD8B768-4DEE-4553-8F06-E5D39348D2A8@yahoo.com> References: <3AD8B768-4DEE-4553-8F06-E5D39348D2A8@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <04395f13-ae5e-7194-0513-f75b38908040@ohiohills.com> On 10/22/2017 2:42 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Michael, > you can buy it on amazon. > https://www.amazon.com/Popular-Science-Astronaut-Exciting-Adventure/dp/B001PL5V2A Thanks, but in the recent past the article itself -- all I wish to have -- has been on line. Mike --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 15:45:59 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 08:45:59 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks, good to see you younger guys getting a good handle on this stuff. When I talked to DNVGL I was told I would need to submit components for their scrutiny for type approval. I would also probably need to send my designs & materials specifications. They literally want to know the material make up of every screw, nut, bolt, washer & who made them, & what certification they have etc. You also need a paper trail to prove it. I would image it would be hugely expensive for something like my thruster where they would have to look at the compensator, controller & electrical connections etc. I can remember hearing a figure of $30,000 to get to the point where all your plans ( pneumatic, hydraulic, electrical, pressure hull etc) are approved. Others like Carsten, Hugh, Vance & Phil would be more familiar with the process. It would be great to get one of their certifiers to speak at a psub conference. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 23/10/2017, at 8:02 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > My understanding is that while all systems must be approved by the certifying agency in any case, using type-approved components wherever possible makes that much more of a rubber stamp process, versus racking up billable engineering hours. > > Sean T. Stevenson > +1.587.873.7326 > > Sent with ProtonMail Secure Email. > >> -------- Original Message -------- >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >> Local Time: October 22, 2017 12:54 PM >> UTC Time: October 22, 2017 6:54 PM >> From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org >> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org >> >> Don't give up hope (yet) Alan! >> >> If you check the DNVGL documentation requirement definitions (RU SHIP Pt1, CH3, sec 2, sub-sec 1.2) you will find that type approval (TA) is basically a short-cut method to avoid being required to submit design paperwork for direct approval (AP) by DNVGL. If allowed, you can submit a type approval instead of having your component individually approved. >> >> The good (and bad) news is, the manned submersible rules (RU UWT pt5 chp6 sec2 subsec 5.2) state that *everything* on a sub is AP, subject to approval, so there is no need to use exclusively TA components. Even if you built a sub with only type-approved components, you still need to provide engineering documents, manufacturer certificates, and they all need re-approved by the society on a case-by-case (read: expensive and slow) basis. >> >> Or atleast that's what I understand from my reading of the rules. I'm an engineer, not a lawyer god-damn-it! >> >> Thanks, >> >> -River J. Dolfi >> >>> On Sun, Oct 22, 2017 at 11:36 AM, via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >>> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org >>> >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >>> http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >>> personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org >>> >>> You can reach the person managing the list at >>> personal_submersibles-owner at psubs.org >>> >>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >>> than "Re: Contents of Personal_Submersibles digest..." >>> >>> >>> Today's Topics: >>> >>> 1. Re: DNVGL (via Personal_Submersibles) >>> 2. Re: DNVGL (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) >>> 3. Markham submarine (Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles) >>> 4. Re: Markham submarine (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) >>> 5. Fw: actuator (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> Message: 1 >>> Date: Sat, 21 Oct 2017 19:56:06 -0500 >>> From: via Personal_Submersibles >>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >>> Message-ID: <20171022005606.16494.qmail at server268.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >>> >>> Alan, >>> >>> I believe you mean there is no Negative or Positive connected to the frame. Earth is neither negative or positive. We are going through the full process and have been working with Jonathan Struwe from DNVGL. Our batteries are lead acid and are coincidentally the exact same as DSV Alvin uses. >>> >>> Thank you, >>> Scott Waters >>> >>> > -------Original Message------- >>> > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >>> > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >>> > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >>> > Sent: Oct 21 '17 19:38 >>> > >>> > Scott, River. >>> > I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that >>> > I >>> > could build to their specifications without going through their >>> > $100,000 >>> > process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all >>> > depends on how many questions you have. >>> > The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for >>> > ships. >>> > If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could >>> > wire up a >>> > super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised >>> > control. >>> > Sean is right about no earths in submarines. >>> > The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the >>> > cable is >>> > sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull >>> > fittings at >>> > UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building >>> > for a >>> > predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. >>> > DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking >>> > their >>> > brains when I went there. >>> > They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one >>> > failure >>> > can result in a major event. >>> > What sort of batteries have you got? >>> > Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil >>> > compensated >>> > battery. >>> > http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery >>> > South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were >>> > looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers >>> > but I don't >>> > know if they did, or whether it's in process. >>> > https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ >>> > Alan >>> > >>> > Sent from my iPad >>> > >>> > On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles >>> > wrote: >>> > >>> > > Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret >>> > > the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the >>> > > essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to >>> > > oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to >>> > > "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL >>> > > has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. >>> > > >>> > > One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads.. UWT pt4 ch8 >>> > > sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with >>> > > (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED >>> > > braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an >>> > > insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery >>> > > cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous >>> > > ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. >>> > > While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who >>> > > require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to >>> > > be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. >>> > > >>> > > Thanks, >>> > > >>> > > -River J. Dolfi >>> > >>> > > _______________________________________________ >>> > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> > >>> > ------------------------- >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> > >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 2 >>> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 14:49:32 +1300 >>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >>> Message-ID: <14BFB98A-2F58-441F-BF41-17126199E698 at yahoo.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >>> >>> Scott, >>> earth can mean a common return path for electrical current, as >>> in a car. That is what I was referring to. >>> Didn't know you were going through the whole process. What fun! >>> I have kind of given up on it as I am building a lot of stuff myself, >>> like lights, thrusters, solenoid ballast valves & electronic contents gauge. >>> All these would need to go through their type approval process. >>> I believe they have a list of DNVGL type approved items that you can >>> choose from if you want something off the shelf. >>> Something I found amusing was that they said you need 4 days emergency >>> food. I asked them what they meant by this, "2 chickens in a chilli bin" >>> They specified seven oceans emergency rations! >>> Cheers Alan >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> > On 22/10/2017, at 1:56 PM, via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >>> > >>> > Alan, >>> > >>> > I believe you mean there is no Negative or Positive connected to the frame. Earth is neither negative or positive. We are going through the full process and have been working with Jonathan Struwe from DNVGL. Our batteries are lead acid and are coincidentally the exact same as DSV Alvin uses. >>> > >>> > Thank you, >>> > Scott Waters >>> > >>> >> -------Original Message------- >>> >> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >>> >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >>> >> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] DNVGL >>> >> Sent: Oct 21 '17 19:38 >>> >> >>> >> Scott, River. >>> >> I had a technical advice contract with DNVGL. The reason being so that >>> >> I >>> >> could build to their specifications without going through their >>> >> $100,000 >>> >> process. Costs you about the same as an expensive lawyer, but it all >>> >> depends on how many questions you have. >>> >> The electrical rules for submarines over-ride the electrical rules for >>> >> ships. >>> >> If you were totally familiar with their electrical rules you could >>> >> wire up a >>> >> super tanker! A lot in there as they have to cover computerised >>> >> control. >>> >> Sean is right about no earths in submarines. >>> >> The electrical through hulls need to be constructed so that if the >>> >> cable is >>> >> sheared off, no water can ingress. I saw a lot of through-hull >>> >> fittings at >>> >> UI New Orleans & not all had this ability. I guess if you are building >>> >> for a >>> >> predominantly ROV market it isn't so necessary. >>> >> DNVGL normally have reps at UI. I spent quite a bit of time picking >>> >> their >>> >> brains when I went there. >>> >> They are flexible in some areas & have a golden rule that no one >>> >> failure >>> >> can result in a major event. >>> >> What sort of batteries have you got? >>> >> Deep Sea Power & Light have an ABS type certification on their oil >>> >> compensated >>> >> battery. >>> >> http://www.deepsea.com/?s=sea+battery >>> >> South West Electronics have a compensated lithium battery. They were >>> >> looking to get type approval from one or more of the big certifiers >>> >> but I don't >>> >> know if they did, or whether it's in process. >>> >> https://www.swe.com/seasafe-subsea-modules/ >>> >> Alan >>> >> >>> >> Sent from my iPad >>> >> >>> >> On 22/10/2017, at 6:11 AM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles >>> >> wrote: >>> >> >>> >>> Scott and I have been driving ourselves crazy trying to interpret >>> >>> the DNVGL rules on subsea electrical cables. We think that the >>> >>> essence of the problem is that DNVGL lacks rules specific to >>> >>> oil-compensated external battery banks (except being subject to >>> >>> "approval by the society"), and to the best of our knowledge DNVGL >>> >>> has yet to certify any submersible with external ambient batteries. >>> >>> >>> >>> One rule in particular is making us scratch our heads.. UWT pt4 ch8 >>> >>> sec2-1.3 states that "All cables in the outer area shall comply with >>> >>> (cargo ship cable rules section). All cables shall have an EARTHED >>> >>> braiding or screen around the conductors and be equipped with an >>> >>> insulating outer sheet." If this is applicable to the main battery >>> >>> cable, damage could potentially create an incredibly dangerous >>> >>> ground fault condition where high voltage is passed to the sphere. >>> >>> While this requirement makes sense for low-voltage electronics who >>> >>> require protection from electromagnetic interference, it appears to >>> >>> be nonsense when applied to a high-voltage DC power cable. >>> >>> >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> >>> >>> -River J. Dolfi >>> >> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >> >>> >> ------------------------- >>> >> _______________________________________________ >>> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 3 >>> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 00:02:06 -0400 >>> From: Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles >>> >>> To: psubs list >>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine >>> Message-ID: >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed >>> >>> Does anyone have the entire Popular Science article from June, 1968?? I >>> found someone who might be interested in building the thing, but I can't >>> get the whole PS thing.? Google books didn't let me find a few of the pages. >>> >>> There's a source for the plans online but the article provides more >>> information. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> --- >>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >>> https://www.avast.com/antivirus >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 4 >>> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 19:42:33 +1300 >>> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles >>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >>> >>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Markham submarine >>> Message-ID: <3AD8B768-4DEE-4553-8F06-E5D39348D2A8 at yahoo.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >>> >>> Michael, >>> you can buy it on amazon. >>> https://www.amazon.com/Popular-Science-Astronaut-Exciting-Adventure/dp/B001PL5V2A >>> Alan >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> > On 22/10/2017, at 5:02 PM, Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >>> > >>> > Does anyone have the entire Popular Science article from June, 1968? I found someone who might be interested in building the thing, but I can't get the whole PS thing. Google books didn't let me find a few of the pages. >>> > >>> > There's a source for the plans online but the article provides more information. >>> > >>> > Thanks. >>> > >>> > >>> > Mike >>> > >>> > --- >>> > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >>> > https://www.avast.com/antivirus >>> > >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 5 >>> Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 16:32:12 +0000 (UTC) >>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles >>> >>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >>> >>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator >>> Message-ID: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939 at mail.yahoo.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >>> >>> Hi All,Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is fully submersible. ?The actuator can lift 50lbs ?at 1 inch per second approximately. ?The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make. ?This one has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the manipulator. ? ?I can either air compensate ?or oil compensate the actuator. ?I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no compensation to an undetermined depth. ?Hank >>> ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: hank pronk To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDTSubject: Fw: actuator >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> From: xxx xxxxx >>> Sent: October 22, 2017 10:23 AM >>> To: Hendrik >>> Subject: actuator? >>> >>> -------------- next part -------------- >>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >>> URL: >>> -------------- next part -------------- >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>> Name: IMG_0522.jpeg >>> Type: image/jpeg >>> Size: 22073 bytes >>> Desc: not available >>> URL: >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Subject: Digest Footer >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> End of Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 52, Issue 33 >>> ***************************************************** > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 16:18:23 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 20:18:23 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator Message-ID: Yes on the actuator waiting list! Brian Get Outlook for Android -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 16:16:27 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 20:16:27 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <278650420.2077478.1508703387840@mail.yahoo.com> New video of actuatorHank ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: xxx xxxxx To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017, 2:15:19 PM MDTSubject: MVI 0526 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESBvXrQMKHQ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 18:22:50 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 15:22:50 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Throttle control Message-ID: <20171022152250.30FA994E@m0117460.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: throttle-control.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 110256 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 18:46:10 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 11:46:10 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator In-Reply-To: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> References: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <067001d34b87$910aab20$b3200160$@gmail.com> Hi Hank, Is the other end of the rod compensated? i.e. if the rod is say ?? diameter then 50 lbs is eaten up at 113 psi approx. 250 ft depth. If it is 5/8? diam then you get to over 350 ft. Actuators with the shaft out both ends are of course perfectly balanced. Hugh From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Monday, 23 October 2017 5:32 AM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator Hi All, Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is fully submersible. The actuator can lift 50lbs at 1 inch per second approximately. The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make. This one has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the manipulator. I can either air compensate or oil compensate the actuator. I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no compensation to an undetermined depth. Hank ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: hank pronk To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDT Subject: Fw: actuator _____ From: xxx xxxxx Sent: October 22, 2017 10:23 AM To: Hendrik Subject: actuator -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 22073 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 18:42:37 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 22:42:37 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2040140917.2127350.1508712157919@mail.yahoo.com> Brian Hughes,How did the actuators look that you bought? ?did you tear them down? ?they might be good donors for building submersible actuators.Hank On Sunday, October 22, 2017, 2:18:46 PM MDT, Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Yes on the actuator waiting list! Brian Get Outlook for Android _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 19:19:56 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 12:19:56 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Throttle control In-Reply-To: <20171022152250.30FA994E@m0117460.ppops.net> References: <20171022152250.30FA994E@m0117460.ppops.net> Message-ID: <67EE00B7-46E3-4569-8AB1-41C059874743@yahoo.com> Brian, it looks like you twist the knob & it slides across & adjusts two pots. If you are using two potentiometers then why not miniaturise things & just buy a double gang pot! Also, do you not want individual control on both thrusters so you can have tractor steering? If it is for the vertical thrusters & they are vectored you could get some lateral movement by using one thruster at a time. Another way of doing it is to use a joy stick, then you can run the thrusters together or individually & in reverse. Apologies if I am not understanding the set up. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 23/10/2017, at 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi All, > Here is a pic of my new throttle actuator . This is so I can control both motors at the same time and also allows me to dial up whatever rpm I want . Once I have the desired rpm I can take my hand off the dial knob and it will keep that rpm. I used 1/2" acme screw and little tabs to push the actuators. > > Brian > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 19:25:42 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 12:25:42 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Throttle control In-Reply-To: <20171022152250.30FA994E@m0117460.ppops.net> References: <20171022152250.30FA994E@m0117460.ppops.net> Message-ID: Brian, should mention that the joy sticks come with or without return to centre option. So if you don't go with the return to centre option you can take your hands off & leave it in a fixed throttle position. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 23/10/2017, at 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi All, > Here is a pic of my new throttle actuator . This is so I can control both motors at the same time and also allows me to dial up whatever rpm I want . Once I have the desired rpm I can take my hand off the dial knob and it will keep that rpm. I used 1/2" acme screw and little tabs to push the actuators. > > Brian > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 19:22:26 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 23:22:26 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator In-Reply-To: <067001d34b87$910aab20$b3200160$@gmail.com> References: <401687781.1998185.1508689932939@mail.yahoo.com> <067001d34b87$910aab20$b3200160$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2142133279.2158438.1508714546735@mail.yahoo.com> Hugh,I have to compensate with some means for sure. ?I was thinking I could have preset internal pressure but Alan has already scolded me over the idea ;-( . ?I was also thinking about oil compensating ?but my motors will not like that. ?I will likely end up with an air compensation system. ?It would be nice if the second stage regulator can keep the internal pressure higher than ambient. ?This will help the actuators?carry the load of the arm without using up lifting power from the actuator. ??Hank On Sunday, October 22, 2017, 4:46:33 PM MDT, Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv4776199767 #yiv4776199767 -- _filtered #yiv4776199767 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv4776199767 {font-family:Tahoma;panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;} _filtered #yiv4776199767 {}#yiv4776199767 #yiv4776199767 p.yiv4776199767MsoNormal, #yiv4776199767 li.yiv4776199767MsoNormal, #yiv4776199767 div.yiv4776199767MsoNormal {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv4776199767 a:link, #yiv4776199767 span.yiv4776199767MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv4776199767 a:visited, #yiv4776199767 span.yiv4776199767MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv4776199767 p {margin-right:0cm;margin-left:0cm;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv4776199767 p.yiv4776199767MsoAcetate, #yiv4776199767 li.yiv4776199767MsoAcetate, #yiv4776199767 div.yiv4776199767MsoAcetate {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:8.0pt;}#yiv4776199767 span.yiv4776199767EmailStyle18 {color:#1F497D;}#yiv4776199767 span.yiv4776199767BalloonTextChar {}#yiv4776199767 .yiv4776199767MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;} _filtered #yiv4776199767 {margin:72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt 72.0pt;}#yiv4776199767 div.yiv4776199767WordSection1 {}#yiv4776199767 Hi Hank, Is the other end of the rod compensated?? i.e. if the rod is say ?? diameter then 50 lbs is eaten up at 113 psi approx. 250 ft depth.? If it is 5/8? diam then you get to over 350 ft.? Actuators with the shaft out both ends are of course perfectly balanced.? Hugh ? From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Monday, 23 October 2017 5:32 AM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator ? Hi All, Here is a picture of my first electric liner actuator that is fully submersible. ?The actuator can lift 50lbs ?at 1 inch per second approximately. ?The actuator cost me 50 dollars Canadian to make. ?This one has a 4 inch stroke and is well suited for the second sage on the manipulator. ? ?I can either air compensate ?or oil compensate the actuator. ?I can also put 160 psi inside permanently and use with no compensation to an undetermined depth. ? Hank ? ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: hank pronk To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 22, 2017, 10:24:59 AM MDT Subject: Fw: actuator ? ? ? From: xxx xxxxx Sent: October 22, 2017 10:23 AM To: Hendrik Subject: actuator ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 22073 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 20:05:19 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 17:05:19 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Throttle control Message-ID: <20171022170519.30FA9789@m0117460.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 20:23:49 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 13:23:49 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Throttle control In-Reply-To: <20171022170519.30FA9789@m0117460.ppops.net> References: <20171022170519.30FA9789@m0117460.ppops.net> Message-ID: Brian, I assume those pots are wired to a motor controller! Most of them are 10k. If it is, just buy a 10k double gang pot & stick it in a small project box. Then you have reduced that control mechanism down to a couple of square inches at the price of a few dollars. You can then mount it or hold it anywhere you like. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 23/10/2017, at 1:05 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Alan, A lot of my travel will be on the surface, this is golf cart tek so I'm really not to the point where I'm computer controlling the sub. My steering is left and right by turning port and starboard motor pods in tandem with a steering wheel ( cable system). I do have the ability to reverse either motor independently so I could potentially make a very tight turn. But this sub is different because it's so long, it will not have the dexterity of a kittereage. It will be interesting to see how tight of a turn I can make . The sub is 28' long. I'm standing while driving the sub ( eight viewports at eye level) so this actuator will be in a vertical position where my right hand will be turning it down by my hip. Steering wheel is at chest level. Maybe later I will do some advanced control. > > Brian > > > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles > To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion > Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Throttle control > Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 12:25:42 +1300 > > Brian, > should mention that the joy sticks come with or without return > to centre option. So if you don't go with the return to centre option > you can take your hands off & leave it in a fixed throttle position. > Alan > > Sent from my iPad > > On 23/10/2017, at 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi All, > Here is a pic of my new throttle actuator . This is so I can control both motors at the same time and also allows me to dial up whatever rpm I want . Once I have the desired rpm I can take my hand off the dial knob and it will keep that rpm. I used 1/2" acme screw and little tabs to push the actuators. > > Brian > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 21:07:19 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 01:07:19 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: actuator Message-ID: Haven't taken them apart yet. Been focused on replacing all the motors and adding speed controllers. Get Outlook for Android -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 21:07:39 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 18:07:39 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Throttle control Message-ID: <20171022180739.30FFCE5C@m0117567.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 22 21:47:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2017 18:47:14 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Throttle control Message-ID: <20171022184714.30FB1363@m0117565.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 23 20:59:48 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 00:59:48 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set References: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063@mail.yahoo.com> Hi All,I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my manipulator build. ?I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well under way. ?The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously. ?So I need a gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or less ?to drive the main gear. ?The gear set will be driven by a second rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member.Any leads would be great.Hank -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 23 21:59:16 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 14:59:16 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063@mail.yahoo.com> References: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <185646349.3043996.1508806788063@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <85FB4A28-FD8E-4B30-ADA5-052599467743@yahoo.com> Hank, depends what size, & how many teeth. There are some in the robot shop http://www.robotshop.com/en/gears-belts-pulleys-tracks-sprockets-chains.html There are a few smaller gears on hobby king https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears You could buy some rod & make your own! I have just got home with a length of ptfe rod to make some tiny washers to go under 3mm screws holding my emitters down. Expensive stuff at NZ $57- a metre for 10mm rod. Alan Sent from my iPad > On 24/10/2017, at 1:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my manipulator build. I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well under way. The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously. So I need a gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or less to drive the main gear. The gear set will be driven by a second rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 23 23:05:41 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2017 23:05:41 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063@mail.yahoo.com> References: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <185646349.3043996.1508806788063@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, these folks probably have it. http://www.bostongear.com Best, Alec On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build. I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is > well under way. The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a > shaft to open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also > free wheels on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously. > So I need a gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 > inches or less to drive the main gear. The gear set will be driven by a > second rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 24 08:02:37 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 12:02:37 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: References: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <185646349.3043996.1508806788063@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1576679070.3285786.1508846557027@mail.yahoo.com> Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal. ?I am looking for plastic to keep the weight down. ?I need to take a trip to the dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears.Hank On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, these folks probably have it. http://www.bostongear.com Best,Alec On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi All,I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or less ?to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member.Any leads would be great.Hank ______________________________ _________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 24 08:26:05 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 13:26:05 +0100 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <1576679070.3285786.1508846557027@mail.yahoo.com> References: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <185646349.3043996.1508806788063@mail.yahoo.com> <1576679070.3285786.1508846557027@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Have a look at hobbyking. They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal. I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down. I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build. I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way. The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously. So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less to drive the main gear. The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 24 17:29:08 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 16:29:08 -0500 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] =?utf-8?q?J_Boxes?= Message-ID: <20171024212908.29167.qmail@server268.com> Does anyone know of any vendors that sell underwater junction boxes for submarines or ROVs? From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 24 17:29:32 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 21:29:32 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: References: <185646349.3043996.1508806788063.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <185646349.3043996.1508806788063@mail.yahoo.com> <1576679070.3285786.1508846557027@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2111203861.3704885.1508880572828@mail.yahoo.com> Thanks' James will doHank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 6:26:22 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Have a look at hobbyking.? They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal.? I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down.? I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less? to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 24 19:08:12 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 16:08:12 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <20171024160812.30F5FDCB@m0117164.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 24 21:53:31 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (irox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 18:53:31 -0700 (GMT-07:00) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <359168187.15980.1508896411773@wamui-bison.atl.sa.earthlink.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 24 21:57:08 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 14:57:08 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] J Boxes In-Reply-To: <20171024212908.29167.qmail@server268.com> References: <20171024212908.29167.qmail@server268.com> Message-ID: <73967690-2729-4B71-B8A6-AF79E1B679E5@yahoo.com> Hi, ( not sure who I'm talking to) if you google subsea junction box (or similar) & do an image search a lot of different types come up. Most of them look really expensive though. Do you want to plug in a commercial connector, or can you just pot wires permanently inside a tube or enclosure? Cheers Alan Sent from my iPad > On 25/10/2017, at 10:29 AM, via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Does anyone know of any vendors that sell underwater junction boxes for submarines or ROVs? > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 24 22:01:21 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (irox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 19:01:21 -0700 (GMT-07:00) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <614469937.16048.1508896881260@wamui-bison.atl.sa.earthlink.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 25 07:25:38 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 11:25:38 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <359168187.15980.1508896411773@wamui-bison.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <359168187.15980.1508896411773@wamui-bison.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <861631959.4024945.1508930739010@mail.yahoo.com> Hi Ian,I am stuck on plastic for weight, but I am probably over thinking that. ?It is, after all, such a tiny part. ?I never thought of Amazon, I will check that out. ?Thank you for the offer to print them, I had no idea that such a fine part could be printed.?Hank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 7:53:44 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv6497321919 #yiv6497321919 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv6497321919 Could you 3D print them?? Or mill them to your needs? I'm guess that if you're picking plastic strength is too a big of a concern.? But do you have an idea of the strength requirements?? Type of plastic?What type of center do you need?Could even do this in herronbone teeth.I could potentially print you up some gears and mailing them to you. There is always Lego Technic gears as well:https://www.brickowl.com/catalog/lego-parts/technic/gear Cheers,?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 24, 2017 4:08 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hank,? What about aluminum ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 21:29:32 +0000 (UTC) Thanks' James will doHank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 6:26:22 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Have a look at hobbyking.? They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal.? I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down.? I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less? to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 25 10:54:48 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 07:54:48 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] CO2 monitor Message-ID: <20171025075448.30FCB968@m0117566.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 25 11:00:07 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 17:00:07 +0200 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] CO2 monitor In-Reply-To: <20171025075448.30FCB968@m0117566.ppops.net> References: <20171025075448.30FCB968@m0117566.ppops.net> Message-ID: <00b801d34da1$f270d2b0$d7527810$@nl> Brian, Have another type Extech CO2 monitor in use for about 2 years now. Works fine . the type you mention looks even better. BR. Emile Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: woensdag 25 oktober 2017 16:55 Aan: PSubs Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] CO2 monitor Does anyone have experience with this CO2 monitor? https://www.instrumart.com/products/35464/extech-co210-co2-monitor-data-logger Brian -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 25 13:51:24 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (irox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 10:51:24 -0700 (GMT-07:00) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <204238821.3930.1508953884237@wamui-abby.atl.sa.earthlink.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 25 14:36:31 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 18:36:31 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <204238821.3930.1508953884237@wamui-abby.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <204238821.3930.1508953884237@wamui-abby.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <766833344.4320736.1508956591208@mail.yahoo.com> Ian,Thank you, if you want to print some then I can just keep building and allow for the size. The shaft for the big gear is 5\8 and the shaft for the small gear is 1\4 inch. ?I do not have a weight budget, just keeping at light as I can. ?The nice thing with plastic is the low density. ? In a perfect world the the large gear would be 3 inch dia and the small gear would be 1 inch.The thickness can be 1\2 inch giving it some extra strength. ?I can drill out the centre with my lathe. ?Thank youHank? On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:39 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv0670973675 #yiv0670973675 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv0670973675 Hi Hank, how much of a weight budget do you have for this item? You mentioned a 0.5inch and 2.5inch gear early, this would give a shaft to shaft distance of 1.5", is that what you need? I did a quick design (spent about 2 minutes on it) for a herringbone gear set matching that, with a 0.25" shaft size (and a set screw provision). What gearing ratio range are you hoping for? Do you care about the thickness? I'm happy to finish the design and print it as an academic exercise, and mail it to you.? No pressure to use it.? I would print it PLA which might not be strong enough.? But if it was working for you, it could be printed in ABS or? Nylon. Cheers, ? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 4:25 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hi Ian,I am stuck on plastic for weight, but I am probably over thinking that. ?It is, after all, such a tiny part. ?I never thought of Amazon, I will check that out. ?Thank you for the offer to print them, I had no idea that such a fine part could be printed.?Hank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 7:53:44 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv0670973675 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv0670973675 Could you 3D print them?? Or mill them to your needs? I'm guess that if you're picking plastic strength is too a big of a concern.? But do you have an idea of the strength requirements?? Type of plastic?What type of center do you need?Could even do this in herronbone teeth.I could potentially print you up some gears and mailing them to you. There is always Lego Technic gears as well:https://www.brickowl.com/catalog/lego-parts/technic/gear Cheers,?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 24, 2017 4:08 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hank,? What about aluminum ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 21:29:32 +0000 (UTC) Thanks' James will doHank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 6:26:22 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Have a look at hobbyking.? They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal.? I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down.? I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less? to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 25 14:38:03 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 18:38:03 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] CO2 monitor In-Reply-To: <00b801d34da1$f270d2b0$d7527810$@nl> References: <20171025075448.30FCB968@m0117566.ppops.net> <00b801d34da1$f270d2b0$d7527810$@nl> Message-ID: <93222453.4326665.1508956683069@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,?That is the monitor that I use and it has worked perfect so far.I think there is a flat model that can be panel mounted from the same company. ?Hank On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 9:00:11 AM MDT, emile via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3019172234 #yiv3019172234 -- _filtered #yiv3019172234 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv3019172234 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv3019172234 {font-family:Tahoma;panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}#yiv3019172234 #yiv3019172234 p.yiv3019172234MsoNormal, #yiv3019172234 li.yiv3019172234MsoNormal, #yiv3019172234 div.yiv3019172234MsoNormal {margin:0cm;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv3019172234 a:link, #yiv3019172234 span.yiv3019172234MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv3019172234 a:visited, #yiv3019172234 span.yiv3019172234MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv3019172234 span.yiv3019172234E-mailStijl17 {color:#1F497D;}#yiv3019172234 .yiv3019172234MsoChpDefault {} _filtered #yiv3019172234 {margin:70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt 70.85pt;}#yiv3019172234 div.yiv3019172234WordSection1 {}#yiv3019172234 Brian, ? Have another type Extech CO2 monitor in use for about 2 years now. Works fine . the type you mention looks even better. ? BR. Emile ? Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Verzonden: woensdag 25 oktober 2017 16:55 Aan: PSubs Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] CO2 monitor ? Does anyone have experience with this CO2 monitor? ? https://www.instrumart.com/products/35464/extech-co210-co2-monitor-data-logger ? ? Brian _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Wed Oct 25 22:16:31 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Wed, 25 Oct 2017 19:16:31 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] CO2 monitor Message-ID: <20171025191631.30FBF3A6@m0117460.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 01:51:31 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (irox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 01:51:31 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <1073548562.14301.1508997091232@wamui-cheeto.atl.sa.earthlink.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screenshot_2017-10-25_21-24-36.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 76666 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 08:10:51 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 12:10:51 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <1073548562.14301.1508997091232@wamui-cheeto.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <1073548562.14301.1508997091232@wamui-cheeto.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <1016936386.4777673.1509019851803@mail.yahoo.com> Ian,That is amazing! Thank youHank On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:48 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv7681015566 #yiv7681015566 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv7681015566 Hi Hank, So,the 3" gear would weigh ~60g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% in fill for speed, meaning it has an install structure, but with voids, weighing ~30g)the 1" gear would weigh ~15g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% as well, weighing ~5g) Top and bottom will be at least 1mm thick, side walls will be 0.8mm thick.? I made the gears 0.5" thick, but here is a collar for the set screw which adds a bit of bulk/thickness too.? If that's a problem it's easy to explore other designs. I'll print them tonight and can mail them tomorrow if you like.? Email me your mailing address at iroxix.netcom.com. Cheers!? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 2:36 PM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Ian,Thank you, if you want to print some then I can just keep building and allow for the size. The shaft for the big gear is 5\8 and the shaft for the small gear is 1\4 inch. ?I do not have a weight budget, just keeping at light as I can. ?The nice thing with plastic is the low density. ? In a perfect world the the large gear would be 3 inch dia and the small gear would be 1 inch.The thickness can be 1\2 inch giving it some extra strength. ?I can drill out the centre with my lathe. ?Thank youHank? On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:39 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv7681015566 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv7681015566 Hi Hank, how much of a weight budget do you have for this item? You mentioned a 0.5inch and 2.5inch gear early, this would give a shaft to shaft distance of 1.5", is that what you need? I did a quick design (spent about 2 minutes on it) for a herringbone gear set matching that, with a 0.25" shaft size (and a set screw provision). What gearing ratio range are you hoping for? Do you care about the thickness? I'm happy to finish the design and print it as an academic exercise, and mail it to you.? No pressure to use it.? I would print it PLA which might not be strong enough.? But if it was working for you, it could be printed in ABS or? Nylon. Cheers, ? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 4:25 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hi Ian,I am stuck on plastic for weight, but I am probably over thinking that. ?It is, after all, such a tiny part. ?I never thought of Amazon, I will check that out. ?Thank you for the offer to print them, I had no idea that such a fine part could be printed.?Hank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 7:53:44 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv7681015566 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv7681015566 Could you 3D print them?? Or mill them to your needs? I'm guess that if you're picking plastic strength is too a big of a concern.? But do you have an idea of the strength requirements?? Type of plastic?What type of center do you need?Could even do this in herronbone teeth.I could potentially print you up some gears and mailing them to you. There is always Lego Technic gears as well:https://www.brickowl.com/catalog/lego-parts/technic/gear Cheers,?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 24, 2017 4:08 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hank,? What about aluminum ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 21:29:32 +0000 (UTC) Thanks' James will doHank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 6:26:22 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Have a look at hobbyking.? They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal.? I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down.? I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less? to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 09:56:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 13:56:14 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <1073548562.14301.1508997091232@wamui-cheeto.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <1073548562.14301.1508997091232@wamui-cheeto.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <1524918155.4850699.1509026174210@mail.yahoo.com> Ian,Good you included a picture, the large gear is not secured to the shaft. ?The shaft turns freely through ?the gear. ?The gear is bolted to the hand, if you print the gear with small holes (1\4 inch) instead of large, I can use those holes to mount it, maybe the holes should be beefed up a bit. ?Thanks againHank On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:48 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv0835368937 #yiv0835368937 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv0835368937 Hi Hank, So,the 3" gear would weigh ~60g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% in fill for speed, meaning it has an install structure, but with voids, weighing ~30g)the 1" gear would weigh ~15g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% as well, weighing ~5g) Top and bottom will be at least 1mm thick, side walls will be 0.8mm thick.? I made the gears 0.5" thick, but here is a collar for the set screw which adds a bit of bulk/thickness too.? If that's a problem it's easy to explore other designs. I'll print them tonight and can mail them tomorrow if you like.? Email me your mailing address at iroxix.netcom.com. Cheers!? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 2:36 PM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Ian,Thank you, if you want to print some then I can just keep building and allow for the size. The shaft for the big gear is 5\8 and the shaft for the small gear is 1\4 inch. ?I do not have a weight budget, just keeping at light as I can. ?The nice thing with plastic is the low density. ? In a perfect world the the large gear would be 3 inch dia and the small gear would be 1 inch.The thickness can be 1\2 inch giving it some extra strength. ?I can drill out the centre with my lathe. ?Thank youHank? On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:39 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv0835368937 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv0835368937 Hi Hank, how much of a weight budget do you have for this item? You mentioned a 0.5inch and 2.5inch gear early, this would give a shaft to shaft distance of 1.5", is that what you need? I did a quick design (spent about 2 minutes on it) for a herringbone gear set matching that, with a 0.25" shaft size (and a set screw provision). What gearing ratio range are you hoping for? Do you care about the thickness? I'm happy to finish the design and print it as an academic exercise, and mail it to you.? No pressure to use it.? I would print it PLA which might not be strong enough.? But if it was working for you, it could be printed in ABS or? Nylon. Cheers, ? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 4:25 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hi Ian,I am stuck on plastic for weight, but I am probably over thinking that. ?It is, after all, such a tiny part. ?I never thought of Amazon, I will check that out. ?Thank you for the offer to print them, I had no idea that such a fine part could be printed.?Hank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 7:53:44 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv0835368937 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv0835368937 Could you 3D print them?? Or mill them to your needs? I'm guess that if you're picking plastic strength is too a big of a concern.? But do you have an idea of the strength requirements?? Type of plastic?What type of center do you need?Could even do this in herronbone teeth.I could potentially print you up some gears and mailing them to you. There is always Lego Technic gears as well:https://www.brickowl.com/catalog/lego-parts/technic/gear Cheers,?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 24, 2017 4:08 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hank,? What about aluminum ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 21:29:32 +0000 (UTC) Thanks' James will doHank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 6:26:22 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Have a look at hobbyking.? They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal.? I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down.? I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less? to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 11:41:26 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (irox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 08:41:26 -0700 (GMT-07:00) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <1750627932.5411.1509032487094@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 13:25:52 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (irox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 10:25:52 -0700 (GMT-07:00) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <92655181.8351.1509038752588@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screenshot_2017-10-26_10-16-27.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 74994 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 13:53:54 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 17:53:54 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <92655181.8351.1509038752588@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <92655181.8351.1509038752588@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <1945025148.5030800.1509040434217@mail.yahoo.com> Hi Ian,?I just measured the space I have and if you can make it so there are four bolt holes 1.75 inches apart when measured strait across from each other. ?ThanksHank On Thursday, October 26, 2017, 11:26:15 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3817902828 #yiv3817902828 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3817902828 Hi Hank, see attached imagine.? This one will weigh 44g at 100% in fill (27g at 20% in fill). I find 3D printer is great from the point of view you can just design something and have a plastic version in your hand a few hours later. Let me know if there are any other changes you'd like (I can put more 0.25" holes towards the rim, things like that). Cheers!? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: irox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 26, 2017 8:41 AM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set #yiv3817902828 #yiv3817902828 ZZZ-- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3817902828 Hi Hank, sure, I can do that.? Do you have a preference for a particular bolt pattern? The big holes where an attempt at weight saving.? Perhaps i can alternate big/small. Cheers!?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 26, 2017 6:56 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Ian,Good you included a picture, the large gear is not secured to the shaft. ?The shaft turns freely through ?the gear. ?The gear is bolted to the hand, if you print the gear with small holes (1\4 inch) instead of large, I can use those holes to mount it, maybe the holes should be beefed up a bit. ?Thanks againHank On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:48 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3817902828 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3817902828 Hi Hank, So,the 3" gear would weigh ~60g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% in fill for speed, meaning it has an install structure, but with voids, weighing ~30g)the 1" gear would weigh ~15g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% as well, weighing ~5g) Top and bottom will be at least 1mm thick, side walls will be 0.8mm thick.? I made the gears 0.5" thick, but here is a collar for the set screw which adds a bit of bulk/thickness too.? If that's a problem it's easy to explore other designs. I'll print them tonight and can mail them tomorrow if you like.? Email me your mailing address at iroxix.netcom.com. Cheers!? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 2:36 PM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Ian,Thank you, if you want to print some then I can just keep building and allow for the size. The shaft for the big gear is 5\8 and the shaft for the small gear is 1\4 inch. ?I do not have a weight budget, just keeping at light as I can. ?The nice thing with plastic is the low density. ? In a perfect world the the large gear would be 3 inch dia and the small gear would be 1 inch.The thickness can be 1\2 inch giving it some extra strength. ?I can drill out the centre with my lathe. ?Thank youHank? On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:39 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3817902828 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3817902828 Hi Hank, how much of a weight budget do you have for this item? You mentioned a 0.5inch and 2.5inch gear early, this would give a shaft to shaft distance of 1.5", is that what you need? I did a quick design (spent about 2 minutes on it) for a herringbone gear set matching that, with a 0.25" shaft size (and a set screw provision). What gearing ratio range are you hoping for? Do you care about the thickness? I'm happy to finish the design and print it as an academic exercise, and mail it to you.? No pressure to use it.? I would print it PLA which might not be strong enough.? But if it was working for you, it could be printed in ABS or? Nylon. Cheers, ? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 4:25 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hi Ian,I am stuck on plastic for weight, but I am probably over thinking that. ?It is, after all, such a tiny part. ?I never thought of Amazon, I will check that out. ?Thank you for the offer to print them, I had no idea that such a fine part could be printed.?Hank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 7:53:44 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3817902828 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3817902828 Could you 3D print them?? Or mill them to your needs? I'm guess that if you're picking plastic strength is too a big of a concern.? But do you have an idea of the strength requirements?? Type of plastic?What type of center do you need?Could even do this in herronbone teeth.I could potentially print you up some gears and mailing them to you. There is always Lego Technic gears as well:https://www.brickowl.com/catalog/lego-parts/technic/gear Cheers,?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 24, 2017 4:08 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hank,? What about aluminum ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 21:29:32 +0000 (UTC) Thanks' James will doHank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 6:26:22 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Have a look at hobbyking.? They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal.? I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down.? I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less? to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 14:51:24 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (irox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 14:51:24 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <1658181748.10825.1509043885017@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screenshot_2017-10-26_11-47-54.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 54013 bytes Desc: not available URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 17:37:03 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 21:37:03 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <1658181748.10825.1509043885017@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <1658181748.10825.1509043885017@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <987055153.5177976.1509053823185@mail.yahoo.com> Ian,Sweet, that is perfect! ?What do you do with the printer normally?Hank On Thursday, October 26, 2017, 12:51:40 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, done.? At this point the gear generation is coded up (using somebody else's gear generation library), so it's just a matter of adjusting a couple of parameters. See attached imagine. Thanks,? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 26, 2017 1:53 PM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hi Ian,?I just measured the space I have and if you can make it so there are four bolt holes 1.75 inches apart when measured strait across from each other. ?ThanksHank On Thursday, October 26, 2017, 11:26:15 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, see attached imagine.? This one will weigh 44g at 100% in fill (27g at 20% in fill). I find 3D printer is great from the point of view you can just design something and have a plastic version in your hand a few hours later. Let me know if there are any other changes you'd like (I can put more 0.25" holes towards the rim, things like that). Cheers!? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: irox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 26, 2017 8:41 AM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set #yiv3369662693 ZZZ-- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, sure, I can do that.? Do you have a preference for a particular bolt pattern? The big holes where an attempt at weight saving.? Perhaps i can alternate big/small. Cheers!?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 26, 2017 6:56 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Ian,Good you included a picture, the large gear is not secured to the shaft. ?The shaft turns freely through ?the gear. ?The gear is bolted to the hand, if you print the gear with small holes (1\4 inch) instead of large, I can use those holes to mount it, maybe the holes should be beefed up a bit. ?Thanks againHank On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:48 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, So,the 3" gear would weigh ~60g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% in fill for speed, meaning it has an install structure, but with voids, weighing ~30g)the 1" gear would weigh ~15g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% as well, weighing ~5g) Top and bottom will be at least 1mm thick, side walls will be 0.8mm thick.? I made the gears 0.5" thick, but here is a collar for the set screw which adds a bit of bulk/thickness too.? If that's a problem it's easy to explore other designs. I'll print them tonight and can mail them tomorrow if you like.? Email me your mailing address at iroxix.netcom.com. Cheers!? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 2:36 PM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Ian,Thank you, if you want to print some then I can just keep building and allow for the size. The shaft for the big gear is 5\8 and the shaft for the small gear is 1\4 inch. ?I do not have a weight budget, just keeping at light as I can. ?The nice thing with plastic is the low density. ? In a perfect world the the large gear would be 3 inch dia and the small gear would be 1 inch.The thickness can be 1\2 inch giving it some extra strength. ?I can drill out the centre with my lathe. ?Thank youHank? On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:39 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, how much of a weight budget do you have for this item? You mentioned a 0.5inch and 2.5inch gear early, this would give a shaft to shaft distance of 1.5", is that what you need? I did a quick design (spent about 2 minutes on it) for a herringbone gear set matching that, with a 0.25" shaft size (and a set screw provision). What gearing ratio range are you hoping for? Do you care about the thickness? I'm happy to finish the design and print it as an academic exercise, and mail it to you.? No pressure to use it.? I would print it PLA which might not be strong enough.? But if it was working for you, it could be printed in ABS or? Nylon. Cheers, ? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 4:25 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hi Ian,I am stuck on plastic for weight, but I am probably over thinking that. ?It is, after all, such a tiny part. ?I never thought of Amazon, I will check that out. ?Thank you for the offer to print them, I had no idea that such a fine part could be printed.?Hank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 7:53:44 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Could you 3D print them?? Or mill them to your needs? I'm guess that if you're picking plastic strength is too a big of a concern.? But do you have an idea of the strength requirements?? Type of plastic?What type of center do you need?Could even do this in herronbone teeth.I could potentially print you up some gears and mailing them to you. There is always Lego Technic gears as well:https://www.brickowl.com/catalog/lego-parts/technic/gear Cheers,?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 24, 2017 4:08 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hank,? What about aluminum ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 21:29:32 +0000 (UTC) Thanks' James will doHank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 6:26:22 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Have a look at hobbyking.? They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal.? I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down.? I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less? to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Thu Oct 26 17:37:03 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2017 21:37:03 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set In-Reply-To: <1658181748.10825.1509043885017@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> References: <1658181748.10825.1509043885017@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Message-ID: <987055153.5177976.1509053823185@mail.yahoo.com> Ian,Sweet, that is perfect! ?What do you do with the printer normally?Hank On Thursday, October 26, 2017, 12:51:40 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, done.? At this point the gear generation is coded up (using somebody else's gear generation library), so it's just a matter of adjusting a couple of parameters. See attached imagine. Thanks,? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 26, 2017 1:53 PM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hi Ian,?I just measured the space I have and if you can make it so there are four bolt holes 1.75 inches apart when measured strait across from each other. ?ThanksHank On Thursday, October 26, 2017, 11:26:15 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, see attached imagine.? This one will weigh 44g at 100% in fill (27g at 20% in fill). I find 3D printer is great from the point of view you can just design something and have a plastic version in your hand a few hours later. Let me know if there are any other changes you'd like (I can put more 0.25" holes towards the rim, things like that). Cheers!? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: irox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 26, 2017 8:41 AM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set #yiv3369662693 ZZZ-- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, sure, I can do that.? Do you have a preference for a particular bolt pattern? The big holes where an attempt at weight saving.? Perhaps i can alternate big/small. Cheers!?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 26, 2017 6:56 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Ian,Good you included a picture, the large gear is not secured to the shaft. ?The shaft turns freely through ?the gear. ?The gear is bolted to the hand, if you print the gear with small holes (1\4 inch) instead of large, I can use those holes to mount it, maybe the holes should be beefed up a bit. ?Thanks againHank On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:48 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, So,the 3" gear would weigh ~60g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% in fill for speed, meaning it has an install structure, but with voids, weighing ~30g)the 1" gear would weigh ~15g printed at 100% in fill (I'll print it at 20% as well, weighing ~5g) Top and bottom will be at least 1mm thick, side walls will be 0.8mm thick.? I made the gears 0.5" thick, but here is a collar for the set screw which adds a bit of bulk/thickness too.? If that's a problem it's easy to explore other designs. I'll print them tonight and can mail them tomorrow if you like.? Email me your mailing address at iroxix.netcom.com. Cheers!? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 2:36 PM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Ian,Thank you, if you want to print some then I can just keep building and allow for the size. The shaft for the big gear is 5\8 and the shaft for the small gear is 1\4 inch. ?I do not have a weight budget, just keeping at light as I can. ?The nice thing with plastic is the low density. ? In a perfect world the the large gear would be 3 inch dia and the small gear would be 1 inch.The thickness can be 1\2 inch giving it some extra strength. ?I can drill out the centre with my lathe. ?Thank youHank? On Wednesday, October 25, 2017, 11:51:39 AM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Hi Hank, how much of a weight budget do you have for this item? You mentioned a 0.5inch and 2.5inch gear early, this would give a shaft to shaft distance of 1.5", is that what you need? I did a quick design (spent about 2 minutes on it) for a herringbone gear set matching that, with a 0.25" shaft size (and a set screw provision). What gearing ratio range are you hoping for? Do you care about the thickness? I'm happy to finish the design and print it as an academic exercise, and mail it to you.? No pressure to use it.? I would print it PLA which might not be strong enough.? But if it was working for you, it could be printed in ABS or? Nylon. Cheers, ? Ian. -----Original Message----- From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 25, 2017 4:25 AM To: irox via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hi Ian,I am stuck on plastic for weight, but I am probably over thinking that. ?It is, after all, such a tiny part. ?I never thought of Amazon, I will check that out. ?Thank you for the offer to print them, I had no idea that such a fine part could be printed.?Hank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 7:53:44 PM MDT, irox via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv3369662693 -- DIV {margin:0px;}#yiv3369662693 Could you 3D print them?? Or mill them to your needs? I'm guess that if you're picking plastic strength is too a big of a concern.? But do you have an idea of the strength requirements?? Type of plastic?What type of center do you need?Could even do this in herronbone teeth.I could potentially print you up some gears and mailing them to you. There is always Lego Technic gears as well:https://www.brickowl.com/catalog/lego-parts/technic/gear Cheers,?Ian. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Oct 24, 2017 4:08 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Hank,? What about aluminum ??Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles To: James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 21:29:32 +0000 (UTC) Thanks' James will doHank On Tuesday, October 24, 2017, 6:26:22 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Have a look at hobbyking.? They are usually pretty good. https://hobbyking.com/en_us/catalogsearch/result/?erp_category=&q=gears On 24 October 2017 at 13:02, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Thanks guys, but these people have tons of gears, but they are metal.? I am > looking for plastic to keep the weight down.? I need to take a trip to the > dump and look for a fax machine or something that has gears. > Hank > > On Monday, October 23, 2017, 9:05:59 PM MDT, Alec Smyth via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, if what you're looking for is not an animal but has teeth nonetheless, > these folks probably have it. > > http://www.bostongear.com > > > Best, > Alec > > On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 8:59 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi All, > I need ideas where I can find a plastic gear set for the wrist on my > manipulator build.? I have the rotary actuator built and the gripper is well > under way.? The way it works is, the rotary actuator shaft turns a shaft to > open and close the fingers on the gripper (hand) The hand also free wheels > on the same shaft so it can rotate 360 degrees continuously.? So I need a > gear about 2 .5 inches in diameter and a matching gear about .5 inches or > less? to drive the main gear.? The gear set will be driven by a second > rotary actuator with a drive shaft enclosed in the arm member. > Any leads would be great. > Hank > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 27 02:21:22 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (irox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2017 02:21:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] gear set Message-ID: <592174129.21589.1509085282165@wamui-kitty.atl.sa.earthlink.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Fri Oct 27 20:53:32 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 00:53:32 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] California meet References: <1487264505.5879789.1509152012007.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1487264505.5879789.1509152012007@mail.yahoo.com> Tim,Did you get to California for the eclipse and check out the dive site for a potential west coast meet?Hank -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 28 16:27:36 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 10:27:36 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries Message-ID: I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries. I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong current. I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time. If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. Comments appreciated. Rick -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 28 19:00:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 16:00:14 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries Message-ID: <20171028160014.30F77031@m0117457.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sat Oct 28 21:25:06 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (RICK Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 15:25:06 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: <20171028160014.30F77031@m0117457.ppops.net> References: <20171028160014.30F77031@m0117457.ppops.net> Message-ID: <59f52df4.0751650a.477d6.bbdd@mx.google.com> Brian, Yes I?ll have three 12V batteries per bank. I?ll have to check with a battery manufacturer to see what the biggest reserve amp hour battery that is made in a lead acid. I guess I might have to run in the ?both? position if I can?t find a lead acid that will go much higher. Rick Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2017 1:01 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries Rick,??? Are you running 3 - 12volt? batteries for each bank ??? The amp hour calculation is pretty straight forward , sounds like you would have less than one hour of juice running everything full on. ? Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles To: psubs chat room Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 10:27:36 -1000 I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries.? I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity.? My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong current.? I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time.?? If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. Comments appreciated.? Rick _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 05:33:56 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 09:33:56 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1731762070.6320398.1509269636067@mail.yahoo.com> Rick, have you looked at golf cart 12v batteries? ?They are built for your application. ?Here is a 12v golf cart group 27 agm battery on eBay. ?I looked at a wire size chart and your #2 cable seems to be okay, the chart was a bit confusing with all the wierd colour indicators ;-)I use the heaviest cable I can, Gamma has #4 cables, to be fair though, I had the cable, it is welding ground cable. ?To save money I made my own cable ends also. ?With 6 volt batteries I need a lot of cable ends. ?I take soft copper tubing, in my case the cable is almost 1\2 inch so 1\2 inch copper tubing and I cut 1 inch or so lengths and slip over the bare cable, then hammer it flat and drill a hole. ?It works so well, I do the same for all the cables in Gamma. ?The last dive I did, I used temporary 12v motors and I wired the system up with the recommended size. ?I always go double the size but in this case it was temporary so I was not worried. ?About 1\2 mile from shore I felt the cables and they were uncomfortably ?warm in my opinion. ?I was determined to continue and only half way to my target, so I water cooled the wires where they met the penetrators. ?The cable ends were also a bit light (not home made) ?so I was worried I might over heat the penetrators. ?I took paper towel and soaked it and then stuffed that around and under the cable ends. ?I put water on the towel periodically to keep the penetrators cool. ?I made the dive and made it back okay. ?The moral of the story is go BIG with wires and cable ends.From my experience, I have to say that you will defiantly use all the horsepower you have more often that you think. ?In fact you will wish you had more, or maybe that is just me ;-)Hank On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 3:07:48 AM MDT, xxx xxxxx wrote: Golfcart 12V AGM Dry Cell VMAX MB96 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 06:04:13 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 10:04:13 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: <59f52df4.0751650a.477d6.bbdd@mx.google.com> References: <20171028160014.30F77031@m0117457.ppops.net> <59f52df4.0751650a.477d6.bbdd@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <1723900805.6307504.1509271453647@mail.yahoo.com> Brian,You mentioned that have to stick with lead acid, due to design. ?I am confused? ?why can't you use AGM? ?Hank On Saturday, October 28, 2017, 7:25:30 PM MDT, RICK Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv8282345825 #yiv8282345825 -- _filtered #yiv8282345825 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv8282345825 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}#yiv8282345825 #yiv8282345825 p.yiv8282345825MsoNormal, #yiv8282345825 li.yiv8282345825MsoNormal, #yiv8282345825 div.yiv8282345825MsoNormal {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:11.0pt;}#yiv8282345825 a:link, #yiv8282345825 span.yiv8282345825MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv8282345825 a:visited, #yiv8282345825 span.yiv8282345825MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:#954F72;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv8282345825 .yiv8282345825MsoChpDefault {} _filtered #yiv8282345825 {margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}#yiv8282345825 div.yiv8282345825WordSection1 {}#yiv8282345825 Brian, ? Yes I?ll have three 12V batteries per bank.? I?ll have to check with a battery manufacturer to see what the biggest reserve amp hour battery that is made in a lead acid. I guess I might have to run in the ?both? position if I can?t find a lead acid that will go much higher. Rick ? ? ? Sent from Mail for Windows 10 ? From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2017 1:01 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries ? Rick,??? Are you running 3 - 12volt? batteries for each bank ??? The amp hour calculation is pretty straight forward , sounds like you would have less than one hour of juice running everything full on. ? Brian --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: From: Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles To: psubs chat room Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 10:27:36 -1000 I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries.? I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity.? My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong current.? I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time.?? If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. Comments appreciated.? Rick _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 06:21:16 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 06:21:16 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Rick, what is the length of the wire run? Sizing a cable appropriately involves keeping the overall voltage drop in the circuit to 2.5% - 3% of the nominal source value, maximum, and of course, lower is better. This is dependent on length, so for a longer run you need a bigger cable, etc. There are calculators available for this purpose. One of my favourites is an Android app called "ElectroDroid". There are also online tools. Sean Sent from ProtonMail mobile -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 28, 2017, 13:27, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries. > I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. > My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong current. > I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time. > If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? > I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. > Comments appreciated. > Rick -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 16:28:02 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 10:28:02 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <1731762070.6320398.1509269636067@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1731762070.6320398.1509269636067@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, I thought that golf cart batteries were only 6V? If you can get them in 12V and they still fit in my battery trays and had more reserve amps then that would be the way to go. Did you include a web address for that battery as I don't see one. I have tons of welding lead around but the reason I am not using that is because I was told to use tinned copper wire like for boats as it resists damage from moisture ingress from the ends. I like your idea about the home made copper ends! Rick On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 11:33 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Rick, have you looked at golf cart 12v batteries? They are built for your > application. Here is a 12v golf cart group 27 agm battery on eBay. > I looked at a wire size chart and your #2 cable seems to be okay, the > chart was a bit confusing with all the wierd colour indicators ;-) > I use the heaviest cable I can, Gamma has #4 cables, to be fair though, I > had the cable, it is welding ground cable. To save money I made my own > cable ends also. With 6 volt batteries I need a lot of cable ends. I take > soft copper tubing, in my case the cable is almost 1\2 inch so 1\2 inch > copper tubing and I cut 1 inch or so lengths and slip over the bare cable, > then hammer it flat and drill a hole. It works so well, I do the same for > all the cables in Gamma. > The last dive I did, I used temporary 12v motors and I wired the system up > with the recommended size. I always go double the size but in this case it > was temporary so I was not worried. About 1\2 mile from shore I felt the > cables and they were uncomfortably warm in my opinion. I was determined > to continue and only half way to my target, so I water cooled the wires > where they met the penetrators. The cable ends were also a bit light (not > home made) so I was worried I might over heat the penetrators. I took > paper towel and soaked it and then stuffed that around and under the cable > ends. I put water on the towel periodically to keep the penetrators cool. > I made the dive and made it back okay. The moral of the story is go BIG > with wires and cable ends. > From my experience, I have to say that you will defiantly use all the > horsepower you have more often that you think. In fact you will wish you > had more, or maybe that is just me ;-) > Hank > On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 3:07:48 AM MDT, xxx xxxxx > wrote: > > > Golfcart 12V AGM Dry Cell VMAX MB96 > > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 17:10:48 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 11:10:48 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sean, I have about 8' from battery to selector switch and then about 10' from switch to pos buss so around 18'. On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 12:21 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Rick, what is the length of the wire run? Sizing a cable appropriately > involves keeping the overall voltage drop in the circuit to 2.5% - 3% of > the nominal source value, maximum, and of course, lower is better. This is > dependent on length, so for a longer run you need a bigger cable, etc. > There are calculators available for this purpose. One of my favourites is > an Android app called "ElectroDroid". There are also online tools. > > Sean > > > Sent from ProtonMail mobile > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > On Oct 28, 2017, 13:27, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > > I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes > into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that > was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that > they recommend group 27 marine batteries. > I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are > 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. > My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time > and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three > thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more > than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like > if I am bucking a strong current. > I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I > can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 > amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at > minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably > never all be on at the same time. > If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank > that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast > and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first > question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as > long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have > to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 > battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? > I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both > banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. > Comments appreciated. > Rick > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 17:17:42 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 11:17:42 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: <1723900805.6307504.1509271453647@mail.yahoo.com> References: <20171028160014.30F77031@m0117457.ppops.net> <59f52df4.0751650a.477d6.bbdd@mx.google.com> <1723900805.6307504.1509271453647@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank, That was me and have to stick with a certain battery size as it's a K-350 and the pods will only allow a certain size battery in them plus I have all ready built the trays for the batteries. I could certainly use AGM batteries if they were the same size as the led acid ones. Do AGM batteries have more amp holding capacity than the led acid? Rick On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 12:04 AM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Brian, > You mentioned that have to stick with lead acid, due to design. I am > confused? why can't you use AGM? > Hank > > On Saturday, October 28, 2017, 7:25:30 PM MDT, RICK Patton via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Brian, > > > > Yes I?ll have three 12V batteries per bank. I?ll have to check with a > battery manufacturer to see what the biggest reserve amp hour battery that > is made in a lead acid. I guess I might have to run in the ?both? position > if I can?t find a lead acid that will go much higher. > > Rick > > > > > > > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > > > *From: *Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles > > *Sent: *Saturday, October 28, 2017 1:01 PM > *To: *Personal Submersibles General Discussion > > *Subject: *Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries > > > > Rick, Are you running 3 - 12volt batteries for each bank ? The amp > hour calculation is pretty straight forward , sounds like you would have > less than one hour of juice running everything full on. > > > > Brian > > --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote: > > From: Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles org> > To: psubs chat room > Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries > Date: Sat, 28 Oct 2017 10:27:36 -1000 > > I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes > into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that > was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that > they recommend group 27 marine batteries. > > I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are > 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. > > My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time > and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three > thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more > than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like > if I am bucking a strong current. > > I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I > can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 > amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at > minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably > never all be on at the same time. > > If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank > that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast > and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first > question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as > long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have > to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 > battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? > > I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both > banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. > > Comments appreciated. > > Rick > > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles > mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ > listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 17:22:03 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 17:22:03 -0400 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: So, 36 VDC, 155 A, copper wire, length 5.5 m. Wire size 2 AWG gives 898.434 mV (2.5%), Voltage at end of circuit 35.102 V, power loss 139.257 W. 2 AWG would be your minimum, with efficiency improving as you get larger from there. Sean -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 29, 2017, 14:10, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Sean, > I have about 8' from battery to selector switch and then about 10' from switch to pos buss so around 18'. > > On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 12:21 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > >> Rick, what is the length of the wire run? Sizing a cable appropriately involves keeping the overall voltage drop in the circuit to 2.5% - 3% of the nominal source value, maximum, and of course, lower is better. This is dependent on length, so for a longer run you need a bigger cable, etc. There are calculators available for this purpose. One of my favourites is an Android app called "ElectroDroid". There are also online tools. >> >> Sean >> >> Sent from ProtonMail mobile >> >> -------- Original Message -------- >> >> On Oct 28, 2017, 13:27, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >>> I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries. >>> I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. >>> My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong current. >>> I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time. >>> If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? >>> I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. >>> Comments appreciated. >>> Rick >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 18:20:09 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 22:20:09 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: References: <1731762070.6320398.1509269636067@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1041041632.6532646.1509315609726@mail.yahoo.com> Rick,I think your right about the tinned wire, but who cares ?if you have to replace it in ten years ;-) ?I will send you the battery info.Hank On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 2:28:21 PM MDT, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,I thought that golf cart batteries were only 6V? If you can get them in 12V and they still fit in my battery trays and had more reserve amps then that would be the way to go. Did you include a web address for that battery as I don't see one. I have tons of welding lead around but the reason I am not using that is because I was told to use tinned copper wire like for boats as it resists damage from moisture ingress from the ends. I like your idea about the home made copper ends!Rick On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 11:33 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Rick, have you looked at golf cart 12v batteries?? They are built for your application.? Here is a 12v golf cart group 27 agm battery on eBay. ?I looked at a wire size chart and your #2 cable seems to be okay, the chart was a bit confusing with all the wierd colour indicators ;-)I use the heaviest cable I can, Gamma has #4 cables, to be fair though, I had the cable, it is welding ground cable.? To save money I made my own cable ends also.? With 6 volt batteries I need a lot of cable ends.? I take soft copper tubing, in my case the cable is almost 1\2 inch so 1\2 inch copper tubing and I cut 1 inch or so lengths and slip over the bare cable, then hammer it flat and drill a hole.? It works so well, I do the same for all the cables in Gamma. ?The last dive I did, I used temporary 12v motors and I wired the system up with the recommended size.? I always go double the size but in this case it was temporary so I was not worried.? About 1\2 mile from shore I felt the cables and they were uncomfortably ?warm in my opinion.? I was determined to continue and only half way to my target, so I water cooled the wires where they met the penetrators.? The cable ends were also a bit light (not home made) ?so I was worried I might over heat the penetrators.? I took paper towel and soaked it and then stuffed that around and under the cable ends.? I put water on the towel periodically to keep the penetrators cool.? I made the dive and made it back okay.? The moral of the story is go BIG with wires and cable ends.From my experience, I have to say that you will defiantly use all the horsepower you have more often that you think.? In fact you will wish you had more, or maybe that is just me ;-)Hank On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 3:07:48 AM MDT, xxx xxxxx wrote: Golfcart 12V AGM Dry Cell VMAX MB96 ______________________________ _________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 18:24:27 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 22:24:27 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1238979163.6539341.1509315867217@mail.yahoo.com> Hi RickHere is one of the 12v golf cart battery options on eBay. ?Lots to chose from, I have had good luck with the 6v version of this battery.Hank ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: xxx xxxxx To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017, 4:21:42 PM MDTSubject: VMAX MB127 12V 100Ah Golfcart AGM Deep Cycle Group 27 SLA Battery https://www.ebay.com/itm/VMAX-MB127-12V-100Ah-Golfcart-AGM-Deep-Cycle-Group-27-SLA-Battery/271121536888?hash=item3f201a5778:g:WG0AAOSwVctY5TrT -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 18:42:41 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 22:42:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: References: <1731762070.6320398.1509269636067@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <32683410.6545536.1509316961587@mail.yahoo.com> Rick,The thing about welding cable is, it is so darn nice to work with. ? The thing about wire size is, you can either make thrust or heat. ?Big cable more thrust, small cable more heat.Hank On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 2:28:21 PM MDT, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hank,I thought that golf cart batteries were only 6V? If you can get them in 12V and they still fit in my battery trays and had more reserve amps then that would be the way to go. Did you include a web address for that battery as I don't see one. I have tons of welding lead around but the reason I am not using that is because I was told to use tinned copper wire like for boats as it resists damage from moisture ingress from the ends. I like your idea about the home made copper ends!Rick On Sat, Oct 28, 2017 at 11:33 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Rick, have you looked at golf cart 12v batteries?? They are built for your application.? Here is a 12v golf cart group 27 agm battery on eBay. ?I looked at a wire size chart and your #2 cable seems to be okay, the chart was a bit confusing with all the wierd colour indicators ;-)I use the heaviest cable I can, Gamma has #4 cables, to be fair though, I had the cable, it is welding ground cable.? To save money I made my own cable ends also.? With 6 volt batteries I need a lot of cable ends.? I take soft copper tubing, in my case the cable is almost 1\2 inch so 1\2 inch copper tubing and I cut 1 inch or so lengths and slip over the bare cable, then hammer it flat and drill a hole.? It works so well, I do the same for all the cables in Gamma. ?The last dive I did, I used temporary 12v motors and I wired the system up with the recommended size.? I always go double the size but in this case it was temporary so I was not worried.? About 1\2 mile from shore I felt the cables and they were uncomfortably ?warm in my opinion.? I was determined to continue and only half way to my target, so I water cooled the wires where they met the penetrators.? The cable ends were also a bit light (not home made) ?so I was worried I might over heat the penetrators.? I took paper towel and soaked it and then stuffed that around and under the cable ends.? I put water on the towel periodically to keep the penetrators cool.? I made the dive and made it back okay.? The moral of the story is go BIG with wires and cable ends.From my experience, I have to say that you will defiantly use all the horsepower you have more often that you think.? In fact you will wish you had more, or maybe that is just me ;-)Hank On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 3:07:48 AM MDT, xxx xxxxx wrote: Golfcart 12V AGM Dry Cell VMAX MB96 ______________________________ _________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 20:49:28 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 17:49:28 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) Message-ID: <20171029174928.30F94E3F@m0117565.ppops.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Sun Oct 29 23:12:07 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 20:12:07 -0700 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] California meet In-Reply-To: 8FSEeYIb8QS288FSFeuXtf References: <1487264505.5879789.1509152012007.ref@mail.yahoo.com> 8FSEeYIb8QS288FSFeuXtf Message-ID: <000001d3512c$dfa3c820$9eeb5860$@telus.net> Hi Hank, Nope, we decided to relax in eastern Oregon after the eclipse rather than go further south and west to Redding. We may try checking it out in the spring, but there wasn't much interest from the group for a west coast convention. It seems most psubers are in the east. The eclipse was spectacular. We were right on centre line with perfectly clear skies. Took a few photos through the telescope. Very cool. Tim From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Friday, October 27, 2017 5:54 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] California meet Tim, Did you get to California for the eclipse and check out the dive site for a potential west coast meet? Hank -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 30 00:41:52 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (RICK Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 18:41:52 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <59f6ad91.8b40620a.b40cc.6003@mx.google.com> Thanks Sean Rick Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017 11:22 AM To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries So, 36 VDC, 155 A, copper wire, length 5.5 m. Wire size 2 AWG gives 898.434 mV (2.5%), Voltage at end of circuit 35.102 V, power loss 139.257 W. 2 AWG would be your minimum, with efficiency improving as you get larger from there. Sean -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 29, 2017, 14:10, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: Sean, I have about 8' from battery to selector switch and then about 10' from switch to pos buss so around 18'. On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 12:21 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Rick, what is the length of the wire run? Sizing a cable appropriately involves keeping the overall voltage drop in the circuit to 2.5% - 3% of the nominal source value, maximum, and of course, lower is better. This is dependent on length, so for a longer run you need a bigger cable, etc. There are calculators available for this purpose. One of my favourites is an Android app called "ElectroDroid". There are also online tools. Sean Sent from ProtonMail mobile -------- Original Message -------- On Oct 28, 2017, 13:27, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries.? I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity.? My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong current.? I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time.?? If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. Comments appreciated.? Rick _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 30 01:11:50 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (RICK Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Sun, 29 Oct 2017 19:11:50 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <1238979163.6539341.1509315867217@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1238979163.6539341.1509315867217@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <59f6b497.0c8b620a.29798.65d7@mx.google.com> Hank, Link came threw. I looked a number of 12v batteries for golf carts but they all seemed to be no more than 100 amps and much more costly than the 125 amp lead acid ones that I have. Was there a different reason that you recommended them? Rick Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017 12:29 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) Hi Rick Here is one of the 12v golf cart battery options on eBay. ?Lots to chose from, I have had good luck with the 6v version of this battery. Hank ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: xxx xxxxx To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017, 4:21:42 PM MDT Subject: VMAX MB127 12V 100Ah Golfcart AGM Deep Cycle Group 27 SLA Battery https://www.ebay.com/itm/VMAX-MB127-12V-100Ah-Golfcart-AGM-Deep-Cycle-Group-27-SLA-Battery/271121536888?hash=item3f201a5778:g:WG0AAOSwVctY5TrT -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 30 02:12:19 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 19:12:19 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> Rick, I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? Cheers Alan Sent from my iPad > On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries. > I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. > My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong current. > I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time. > If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? > I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. > Comments appreciated. > Rick > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 30 07:02:21 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 11:02:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <59f6b497.0c8b620a.29798.65d7@mx.google.com> References: <1238979163.6539341.1509315867217@mail.yahoo.com> <59f6b497.0c8b620a.29798.65d7@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <1876820751.6734110.1509361341493@mail.yahoo.com> Rick,I thought your goal was to find a group 27 battery that can handle the discharge rate, more than amp hr rating. ? I agree they are expensive, and I wonder if they are as robust as a good old fashion lead acid. ?I would not get to hung up on amp hrs, If you have 6 12v batteries at 100ah, I think that is plenty of juice. ?Gamma has 900ah at 12v and I have never run out of juice. ?I need the 900ah because of my long surface transits. ? If you are towing your sub to the dive site, 600ah will be plenty for recreational diving. ? The type of dive you do will make the difference. ?If you are diving on a wreck site, your power consumption will be very low if you have the sub well ballasted. ?If you have the sub trimmed perfectly, your vertical thrusters will work very little to move you around. ? Your right about your motors, they will not be working hard often. ?Maybe other K350 owners can comment on how their ?batteries stand up. ?I am comparing to Gamma witch has less thrust power than K350 with 3 101'sHank? On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 11:12:08 PM MDT, RICK Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: #yiv7595398270 #yiv7595398270 -- _filtered #yiv7595398270 {font-family:Helvetica;panose-1:2 11 5 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;} _filtered #yiv7595398270 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv7595398270 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}#yiv7595398270 #yiv7595398270 p.yiv7595398270MsoNormal, #yiv7595398270 li.yiv7595398270MsoNormal, #yiv7595398270 div.yiv7595398270MsoNormal {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:11.0pt;}#yiv7595398270 a:link, #yiv7595398270 span.yiv7595398270MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv7595398270 a:visited, #yiv7595398270 span.yiv7595398270MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:#954F72;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv7595398270 p.yiv7595398270ydp55f6b6aeyiv2623057001, #yiv7595398270 li.yiv7595398270ydp55f6b6aeyiv2623057001, #yiv7595398270 div.yiv7595398270ydp55f6b6aeyiv2623057001 {margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;font-size:11.0pt;}#yiv7595398270 .yiv7595398270MsoChpDefault {} _filtered #yiv7595398270 {margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}#yiv7595398270 div.yiv7595398270WordSection1 {}#yiv7595398270 Hank, Link came threw. I looked a number of 12v batteries for golf carts but they all seemed to be no more than 100 amps and much more costly than the 125 amp lead acid ones that I have. Was there a different reason that you recommended them? Rick ? Sent from Mail for Windows 10 ? From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017 12:29 PM To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) ? Hi Rick Here is one of the 12v golf cart battery options on eBay. ?Lots to chose from, I have had good luck with the 6v version of this battery. Hank ? ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: xxx xxxxx To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017, 4:21:42 PM MDT Subject: ? VMAX MB127 12V 100Ah Golfcart AGM Deep Cycle Group 27 SLA Battery ? https://www.ebay.com/itm/VMAX-MB127-12V-100Ah-Golfcart-AGM-Deep-Cycle-Group-27-SLA-Battery/271121536888?hash=item3f201a5778:g:WG0AAOSwVctY5TrT ? _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 30 10:20:43 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 14:20:43 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Alan Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 for the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems. DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster off one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running Minn-Kotas. I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas in his. Rick On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Rick, > I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two > battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? > What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters > off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. > If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each > battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. > I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? > Cheers Alan > > > > > > Sent from my iPad > > > On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > > > I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes > into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that > was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that > they recommend group 27 marine batteries. > > I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are > 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. > > My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a > time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three > thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more > than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like > if I am bucking a strong current. > > I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though > I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a > 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters > at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will > probably never all be on at the same time. > > If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a > bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather > fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first > question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as > long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have > to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 > battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? > > I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both > banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. > > Comments appreciated. > > Rick > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 30 10:32:52 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 14:32:52 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <1876820751.6734110.1509361341493@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1238979163.6539341.1509315867217@mail.yahoo.com> <59f6b497.0c8b620a.29798.65d7@mx.google.com> <1876820751.6734110.1509361341493@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hank My thrusters are 36v with a 46 amp max draw. From my limited understanding of batteries, I thought that tying 3 each 12v 100 amp batteries together gave you the 36 volts but you still only had 100 amps.?not 300 amps? So I am after a 12 v battery with the most reserve amps I can find. Rick On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:07 AM hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Rick, > I thought your goal was to find a group 27 battery that can handle the > discharge rate, more than amp hr rating. I agree they are expensive, and > I wonder if they are as robust as a good old fashion lead acid. I would > not get to hung up on amp hrs, If you have 6 12v batteries at 100ah, I > think that is plenty of juice. Gamma has 900ah at 12v and I have never run > out of juice. I need the 900ah because of my long surface transits. If > you are towing your sub to the dive site, 600ah will be plenty for > recreational diving. The type of dive you do will make the difference. > If you are diving on a wreck site, your power consumption will be very low > if you have the sub well ballasted. If you have the sub trimmed perfectly, > your vertical thrusters will work very little to move you around. Your > right about your motors, they will not be working hard often. > Maybe other K350 owners can comment on how their batteries stand up. I > am comparing to Gamma witch has less thrust power than K350 with 3 101's > Hank > > On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 11:12:08 PM MDT, RICK Patton via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hank, > > Link came threw. I looked a number of 12v batteries for golf carts but > they all seemed to be no more than 100 amps and much more costly than the > 125 amp lead acid ones that I have. Was there a different reason that you > recommended them? > > Rick > > > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > > > *From: *hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > > *Sent: *Sunday, October 29, 2017 12:29 PM > *To: *Personal Submersibles General Discussion > > *Subject: *[PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) > > > > Hi Rick > > Here is one of the 12v golf cart battery options on eBay. Lots to chose > from, I have had good luck with the 6v version of this battery. > > Hank > > > > ----- Forwarded Message ----- > > *From:* xxx xxxxx > > *To:* hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca > > *Sent:* Sunday, October 29, 2017, 4:21:42 PM MDT > > *Subject:* > > > > VMAX MB127 12V 100Ah Golfcart AGM Deep Cycle Group 27 SLA Battery > > > > > https://www.ebay.com/itm/VMAX-MB127-12V-100Ah-Golfcart-AGM-Deep-Cycle-Group-27-SLA-Battery/271121536888?hash=item3f201a5778:g:WG0AAOSwVctY5TrT > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 30 11:56:43 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 04:56:43 +1300 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: References: <1238979163.6539341.1509315867217@mail.yahoo.com> <59f6b497.0c8b620a.29798.65d7@mx.google.com> <1876820751.6734110.1509361341493@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6F65E315-8832-44F7-A13A-C3004B41A997@yahoo.com> Rick, for the given space that you have you are not going to get any more amp hours. I.e. if you have a 12V 50ah battery, a 12V 100ah battery is liable to be twice the volume. I would be looking at what was the biggest size traction battery I could fit in the available space. You could wire up your "house battery" in parallel with your other 3 batteries in the pod to give extra amp hours, then use a buck converter off your 36V to give 12V for house supply. You may be able to find 3 batteries that fit the space you have for 4. Be careful of the amp hour rating. Most batteries are rated on a discharge over a 20hr period whereas we have a higher rate of discharge, & this drops the amp hour rating dramatically. And then the more you discharge the batteries the quicker you destroy them, I think 50% is the maximum recommended discharge. So your 100Ahr battery may be 30Ahr (guessing) I am emailing half asleep so check my facts. I have agm batteries & they have slightly less capacity than normal lead acid batteries, but don't spill or give off as much gas. Of course there are lithium iron batteries! Cheers Alan Sent from my iPad > On 31/10/2017, at 3:32 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > Hank > My thrusters are 36v with a 46 amp max draw. From my limited understanding of batteries, I thought that tying 3 each 12v 100 amp batteries together gave you the 36 volts but you still only had 100 amps.?not 300 amps? So I am after a 12 v battery with the most reserve amps I can find. > Rick > >> On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:07 AM hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> Rick, >> I thought your goal was to find a group 27 battery that can handle the discharge rate, more than amp hr rating. I agree they are expensive, and I wonder if they are as robust as a good old fashion lead acid. I would not get to hung up on amp hrs, If you have 6 12v batteries at 100ah, I think that is plenty of juice. Gamma has 900ah at 12v and I have never run out of juice.. I need the 900ah because of my long surface transits. If you are towing your sub to the dive site, 600ah will be plenty for recreational diving. The type of dive you do will make the difference. If you are diving on a wreck site, your power consumption will be very low if you have the sub well ballasted. If you have the sub trimmed perfectly, your vertical thrusters will work very little to move you around. Your right about your motors, they will not be working hard often. >> Maybe other K350 owners can comment on how their batteries stand up. I am comparing to Gamma witch has less thrust power than K350 with 3 101's >> Hank >> >> On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 11:12:08 PM MDT, RICK Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> >> Hank, >> >> Link came threw. I looked a number of 12v batteries for golf carts but they all seemed to be no more than 100 amps and much more costly than the 125 amp lead acid ones that I have. Was there a different reason that you recommended them? >> >> Rick >> >> >> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >> >> >> >> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles >> Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017 12:29 PM >> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) >> >> >> >> Hi Rick >> >> Here is one of the 12v golf cart battery options on eBay. Lots to chose from, I have had good luck with the 6v version of this battery. >> >> Hank >> >> >> >> ----- Forwarded Message ----- >> >> From: xxx xxxxx >> >> To: hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca >> >> Sent: Sunday, October 29, 2017, 4:21:42 PM MDT >> >> Subject: >> >> >> >> VMAX MB127 12V 100Ah Golfcart AGM Deep Cycle Group 27 SLA Battery >> >> https://www.ebay.com/itm/VMAX-MB127-12V-100Ah-Golfcart-AGM-Deep-Cycle-Group-27-SLA-Battery/271121536888?hash=item3f201a5778:g:WG0AAOSwVctY5TrT >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Mon Oct 30 13:42:23 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Mon, 30 Oct 2017 17:42:23 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <6F65E315-8832-44F7-A13A-C3004B41A997@yahoo.com> References: <1238979163.6539341.1509315867217@mail.yahoo.com> <59f6b497.0c8b620a.29798.65d7@mx.google.com> <1876820751.6734110.1509361341493@mail.yahoo.com> <6F65E315-8832-44F7-A13A-C3004B41A997@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks Alan Looks like I will have to run my 36v needs in the "Both " position drawing off of both sides at once so I can achieve my needs without harming the batteries. Rick On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 5:58 AM Alan via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Rick, > for the given space that you have you are not going to get any more > amp hours. I.e. if you have a 12V 50ah battery, a 12V 100ah battery is > liable to be twice the volume. I would be looking at what was the biggest > size traction battery I could fit in the available space.. > You could wire up your "house battery" in parallel with your other 3 > batteries > in the pod to give extra amp hours, then use a buck converter off your 36V > to give 12V for house supply. You may be able to find 3 batteries that fit > the space you have for 4. > Be careful of the amp hour rating. Most batteries are rated on a discharge > over a 20hr period whereas we have a higher rate of discharge, & this > drops > the amp hour rating dramatically. And then the more you discharge the > batteries > the quicker you destroy them, I think 50% is the maximum recommended > discharge. So your 100Ahr battery may be 30Ahr (guessing) I am emailing > half > asleep so check my facts. > I have agm batteries & they have slightly less capacity than normal lead > acid > batteries, but don't spill or give off as much gas. > Of course there are lithium iron batteries! > Cheers Alan > > > Sent from my iPad > > On 31/10/2017, at 3:32 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > > Hank > My thrusters are 36v with a 46 amp max draw. From my limited understanding > of batteries, I thought that tying 3 each 12v 100 amp batteries together > gave you the 36 volts but you still only had 100 amps.?not 300 amps? So I > am after a 12 v battery with the most reserve amps I can find. > Rick > > On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 1:07 AM hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> Rick, >> I thought your goal was to find a group 27 battery that can handle the >> discharge rate, more than amp hr rating. I agree they are expensive, and >> I wonder if they are as robust as a good old fashion lead acid. I would >> not get to hung up on amp hrs, If you have 6 12v batteries at 100ah, I >> think that is plenty of juice. Gamma has 900ah at 12v and I have never run >> out of juice. I need the 900ah because of my long surface transits. If >> you are towing your sub to the dive site, 600ah will be plenty for >> recreational diving. The type of dive you do will make the difference. >> If you are diving on a wreck site, your power consumption will be very low >> if you have the sub well ballasted. If you have the sub trimmed perfectly, >> your vertical thrusters will work very little to move you around. Your >> right about your motors, they will not be working hard often. >> Maybe other K350 owners can comment on how their batteries stand up. I >> am comparing to Gamma witch has less thrust power than K350 with 3 101's >> Hank >> >> On Sunday, October 29, 2017, 11:12:08 PM MDT, RICK Patton via >> Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> >> Hank, >> >> Link came threw. I looked a number of 12v batteries for golf carts but >> they all seemed to be no more than 100 amps and much more costly than the >> 125 amp lead acid ones that I have. Was there a different reason that you >> recommended them? >> >> Rick >> >> >> >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> >> >> >> *From: *hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles >> >> *Sent: *Sunday, October 29, 2017 12:29 PM >> *To: *Personal Submersibles General Discussion >> >> *Subject: *[PSUBS-MAILIST] (no subject) >> >> >> >> Hi Rick >> >> Here is one of the 12v golf cart battery options on eBay. Lots to chose >> from, I have had good luck with the 6v version of this battery. >> >> Hank >> >> >> >> ----- Forwarded Message ----- >> >> *From:* xxx xxxxx >> >> *To:* hanker_20032000 at yahoo.ca >> >> *Sent:* Sunday, October 29, 2017, 4:21:42 PM MDT >> >> *Subject:* >> >> >> >> VMAX MB127 12V 100Ah Golfcart AGM Deep Cycle Group 27 SLA Battery >> >> >> >> >> https://www.ebay.com/itm/VMAX-MB127-12V-100Ah-Golfcart-AGM-Deep-Cycle-Group-27-SLA-Battery/271121536888?hash=item3f201a5778:g:WG0AAOSwVctY5TrT >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 31 05:10:05 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 09:10:05 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi rick, I'm here. What do you want to know? I'm using minn Kota rip tide 80's at 24v. 2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of batteries in series with both pairs connected to the main terminals. I have a standard heavy switch so I can use each bank separately or both together. I used heavy tinned marine cable. Can't remember the thickness. I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it seems fine. Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had those on the sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to have just on/off relays. Much better. Regards, James On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > Alan > Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 for > the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems. > DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster off > one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running Minn-Kotas. > I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas in > his. > Rick > > On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org > > wrote: > >> Rick, >> I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two >> battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? >> What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters >> off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. >> If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each >> battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. >> I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? >> Cheers Alan >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> > On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org >> > wrote: >> > >> > I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes >> into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that >> was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that >> they recommend group 27 marine batteries. >> > I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they >> are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. >> > My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a >> time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three >> thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more >> than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like >> if I am bucking a strong current. >> > I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and >> though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be >> about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the >> thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights >> will probably never all be on at the same time. >> > If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a >> bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather >> fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first >> question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as >> long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have >> to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 >> battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? >> > I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both >> banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. >> > Comments appreciated. >> > Rick >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> >> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 31 06:25:14 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 10:25:14 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <988495230.8450609.1509445514417@mail.yahoo.com> Hi James,What type of relays are you using?Hank On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 3:10:27 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi rick,I'm here.? What do you want to know?? I'm using minn Kota rip tide 80's at 24v. ?2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of batteries in series with both pairs connected to the main terminals.? I have a standard heavy switch so I can use each bank separately or both together.? I used heavy tinned marine cable.? Can't remember the thickness. I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it seems fine. ? Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had those on the sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to have just on/off?relays.? Much better. Regards,James On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: AlanYes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 for the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems.DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster off one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running Minn-Kotas.?I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas in his.Rick? On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Rick, I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? Cheers Alan Sent from my iPad > On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that they recommend group 27 marine batteries. > I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. > My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like if I am bucking a strong current. > I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably never all be on at the same time. > If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? > I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. > Comments appreciated. > Rick > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles ______________________________ _________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 31 07:14:32 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 11:14:32 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: <988495230.8450609.1509445514417@mail.yahoo.com> References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> <988495230.8450609.1509445514417@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Hank, I cant remember off the top of my head now. I just had a quick search and I cant find them. They are just standard high current 24v pots of some sort. I seem to remember they were similar to yours. Or some that you had used. James On 31 October 2017 at 10:25, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Hi James, > What type of relays are you using? > Hank > > > On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 3:10:27 AM MDT, James Frankland via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hi rick, > I'm here. What do you want to know? I'm using minn Kota rip tide 80's at > 24v. 2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of batteries in series > with both pairs connected to the main terminals. I have a standard heavy > switch so I can use each bank separately or both together. I used heavy > tinned marine cable. Can't remember the thickness. > > I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it seems fine. > > Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had those on the > sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to have just on/off relays. > Much better. > > Regards, > James > > On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Alan > Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 for > the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems. > DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster off > one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running Minn-Kotas. > I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas in > his. > Rick > > On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Rick, > I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two > battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? > What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters > off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. > If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each > battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. > I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? > Cheers Alan > > > > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles >> wrote: >> >> I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes >> into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that >> was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that >> they recommend group 27 marine batteries. >> I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are >> 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. >> My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time >> and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three >> thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more >> than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like >> if I am bucking a strong current. >> I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I >> can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 >> amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at >> minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably >> never all be on at the same time. >> If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank >> that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast >> and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first >> question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as >> long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have >> to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery >> that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? >> I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both >> banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. >> Comments appreciated. >> Rick >> ______________________________ _________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 31 07:55:03 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 11:55:03 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> <988495230.8450609.1509445514417@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <391133079.8493607.1509450903936@mail.yahoo.com> Hi James,I am using continues duty relays and it takes 4 relays per motor. ?On my vertical thrusters I am using reversing relays (single relay) ?but they are not continues duty, witch is okay. ?I want to simplify by using reversing relays (continuous duty) on the main motors. ?I thought maybe you already have that and could recommend what works.Hank On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 5:14:50 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Hank, I cant remember off the top of my head now.? I just had a quick search and I cant find them.? They are just standard high current 24v pots of some sort. I seem to remember they were similar to yours.? Or some that you had used. James On 31 October 2017 at 10:25, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Hi James, > What type of relays are you using? > Hank > > > On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 3:10:27 AM MDT, James Frankland via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hi rick, > I'm here.? What do you want to know?? I'm using minn Kota rip tide 80's at > 24v.? 2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of batteries in series > with both pairs connected to the main terminals.? I have a standard heavy > switch so I can use each bank separately or both together.? I used heavy > tinned marine cable.? Can't remember the thickness. > > I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it seems fine. > > Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had those on the > sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to have just on/off relays. > Much better. > > Regards, > James > > On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Alan > Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 for > the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems. > DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster off > one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running Minn-Kotas. > I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas in > his. > Rick > > On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Rick, > I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two > battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? > What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters > off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. > If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each > battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. > I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? > Cheers Alan > > > > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles >> wrote: >> >> I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes >> into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that >> was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that >> they recommend group 27 marine batteries. >> I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are >> 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. >> My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time >> and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three >> thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more >> than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like >> if I am bucking a strong current. >> I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I >> can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 >> amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at >> minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably >> never all be on at the same time. >> If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank >> that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast >> and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first >> question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as >> long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have >> to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery >> that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? >> I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both >> banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. >> Comments appreciated. >> Rick >> ______________________________ _________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 31 09:39:12 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 13:39:12 +0000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: <391133079.8493607.1509450903936@mail.yahoo.com> References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> <988495230.8450609.1509445514417@mail.yahoo.com> <391133079.8493607.1509450903936@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I have continuous duty ones at a suitable current rating. Cant remember off hand. But I don't have the reversing because I can rotate the side motors for reverse. So I just have 1 relay per motor. Super simple. Also have the standard minn kota controller on the rear thruster. which allows reverse and speed control. All 3 items all fit into one box with a cooling fan for good measure. Sorry, cant recommend anything other than the simple setup I have. On 31 October 2017 at 11:55, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Hi James, > I am using continues duty relays and it takes 4 relays per motor. On my > vertical thrusters I am using reversing relays (single relay) but they are > not continues duty, witch is okay. I want to simplify by using reversing > relays (continuous duty) on the main motors. I thought maybe you already > have that and could recommend what works. > Hank > > On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 5:14:50 AM MDT, James Frankland via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hi Hank, > > I cant remember off the top of my head now. I just had a quick search > and I cant find them. They are just standard high current 24v pots of > some sort. > > I seem to remember they were similar to yours. Or some that you had used. > > James > > On 31 October 2017 at 10:25, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: >> Hi James, >> What type of relays are you using? >> Hank >> >> >> On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 3:10:27 AM MDT, James Frankland via >> Personal_Submersibles wrote: >> >> >> Hi rick, >> I'm here. What do you want to know? I'm using minn Kota rip tide 80's at >> 24v. 2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of batteries in >> series >> with both pairs connected to the main terminals. I have a standard heavy >> switch so I can use each bank separately or both together. I used heavy >> tinned marine cable. Can't remember the thickness. >> >> I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it seems fine. >> >> Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had those on the >> sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to have just on/off relays. >> Much better. >> >> Regards, >> James >> >> On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles >> wrote: >> >> Alan >> Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 for >> the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems. >> DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster off >> one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running Minn-Kotas. >> I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas in >> his. >> Rick >> >> On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles >> wrote: >> >> Rick, >> I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two >> battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? >> What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters >> off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. >> If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each >> battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. >> I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? >> Cheers Alan >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles >>> wrote: >>> >>> I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes >>> into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that >>> was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota >>> that >>> they recommend group 27 marine batteries. >>> I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are >>> 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. >>> My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time >>> and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three >>> thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for >>> more >>> than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario >>> like >>> if I am bucking a strong current. >>> I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though >>> I >>> can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a >>> 16.6 >>> amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at >>> minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will >>> probably >>> never all be on at the same time. >>> If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a >>> bank >>> that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather >>> fast >>> and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first >>> question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar >>> as >>> long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I >>> have >>> to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 >>> battery >>> that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? >>> I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both >>> banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. >>> Comments appreciated. >>> Rick >>> ______________________________ _________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > >> >> >> ______________________________ _________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >> > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 31 09:51:30 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 13:51:30 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: <391133079.8493607.1509450903936@mail.yahoo.com> References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> <988495230.8450609.1509445514417@mail.yahoo.com> <391133079.8493607.1509450903936@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1227445171.8563430.1509457890608@mail.yahoo.com> Right, I forgot you can rotate the motors. ?Hank On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 6:00:16 AM MDT, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi James,I am using continues duty relays and it takes 4 relays per motor. ?On my vertical thrusters I am using reversing relays (single relay) ?but they are not continues duty, witch is okay. ?I want to simplify by using reversing relays (continuous duty) on the main motors. ?I thought maybe you already have that and could recommend what works.Hank On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 5:14:50 AM MDT, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: Hi Hank, I cant remember off the top of my head now.? I just had a quick search and I cant find them.? They are just standard high current 24v pots of some sort. I seem to remember they were similar to yours.? Or some that you had used. James On 31 October 2017 at 10:25, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Hi James, > What type of relays are you using? > Hank > > > On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 3:10:27 AM MDT, James Frankland via > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > Hi rick, > I'm here.? What do you want to know?? I'm using minn Kota rip tide 80's at > 24v.? 2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of batteries in series > with both pairs connected to the main terminals.? I have a standard heavy > switch so I can use each bank separately or both together.? I used heavy > tinned marine cable.? Can't remember the thickness. > > I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it seems fine. > > Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had those on the > sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to have just on/off relays. > Much better. > > Regards, > James > > On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Alan > Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 for > the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems. > DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster off > one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running Minn-Kotas. > I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas in > his. > Rick > > On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Rick, > I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two > battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? > What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters > off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. > If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each > battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. > I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? > Cheers Alan > > > > > > Sent from my iPad > >> On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles >> wrote: >> >> I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes >> into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if that >> was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota that >> they recommend group 27 marine batteries. >> I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they are >> 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. >> My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a time >> and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three >> thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more >> than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like >> if I am bucking a strong current. >> I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and though I >> can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a 16.6 >> amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at >> minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will probably >> never all be on at the same time. >> If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a bank >> that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather fast >> and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first >> question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as >> long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have >> to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 battery >> that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? >> I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both >> banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. >> Comments appreciated. >> Rick >> ______________________________ _________________ >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > ______________________________ _________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 31 14:06:16 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 08:06:16 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi James Thanks for responding. I thought you were running the rip tide 101,s @ 36V. Did you rig the Minn-Kota rheostat to a foot pedal on your steering yoke so your hands were free and if so, how did you do it? Rick On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 11:10 PM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles wrote: > Hi rick, > I'm here. What do you want to know? I'm using minn Kota rip tide 80's at > 24v. 2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of batteries in > series with both pairs connected to the main terminals. I have a standard > heavy switch so I can use each bank separately or both together. I used > heavy tinned marine cable. Can't remember the thickness. > > I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it seems fine. > > > Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had those on the > sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to have just on/off relays. > Much better. > > Regards, > James > > On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > >> Alan >> Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 >> for the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems. >> DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster off >> one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running Minn-Kotas. >> I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas >> in his. >> Rick >> >> On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles < >> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >> >>> Rick, >>> I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two >>> battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? >>> What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters >>> off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in parallel. >>> If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each >>> battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. >>> I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? >>> Cheers Alan >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> >>> > On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles < >>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: >>> > >>> > I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power >>> comes into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if >>> that was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota >>> that they recommend group 27 marine batteries. >>> > I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they >>> are 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. >>> > My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a >>> time and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three >>> thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for more >>> than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario like >>> if I am bucking a strong current. >>> > I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and >>> though I can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be >>> about a 16.6 amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the >>> thrusters at minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights >>> will probably never all be on at the same time. >>> > If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a >>> bank that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather >>> fast and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first >>> question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus bar as >>> long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I have >>> to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 >>> battery that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? >>> > I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both >>> banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. >>> > Comments appreciated. >>> > Rick >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles >>> >> > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From personal_submersibles at psubs.org Tue Oct 31 17:55:29 2017 From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles) Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2017 11:55:29 -1000 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] batteries In-Reply-To: References: <9310DE0B-D779-4508-AF71-284815F5B8CF@yahoo.com> <988495230.8450609.1509445514417@mail.yahoo.com> <391133079.8493607.1509450903936@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: James, I didn't realize that the Minn-Kota controllers had a reverse setting? Rick On Tue, Oct 31, 2017 at 3:39 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles < personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: > I have continuous duty ones at a suitable current rating. Cant > remember off hand. But I don't have the reversing because I can > rotate the side motors for reverse. So I just have 1 relay per motor. > Super simple. > > Also have the standard minn kota controller on the rear thruster. > which allows reverse and speed control. All 3 items all fit into one > box with a cooling fan for good measure. > > Sorry, cant recommend anything other than the simple setup I have. > > > On 31 October 2017 at 11:55, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > wrote: > > Hi James, > > I am using continues duty relays and it takes 4 relays per motor. On my > > vertical thrusters I am using reversing relays (single relay) but they > are > > not continues duty, witch is okay. I want to simplify by using reversing > > relays (continuous duty) on the main motors. I thought maybe you already > > have that and could recommend what works. > > Hank > > > > On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 5:14:50 AM MDT, James Frankland via > > Personal_Submersibles wrote: > > > > > > Hi Hank, > > > > I cant remember off the top of my head now. I just had a quick search > > and I cant find them. They are just standard high current 24v pots of > > some sort. > > > > I seem to remember they were similar to yours. Or some that you had > used. > > > > James > > > > On 31 October 2017 at 10:25, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles > > wrote: > >> Hi James, > >> What type of relays are you using? > >> Hank > >> > >> > >> On Tuesday, October 31, 2017, 3:10:27 AM MDT, James Frankland via > >> Personal_Submersibles wrote: > >> > >> > >> Hi rick, > >> I'm here. What do you want to know? I'm using minn Kota rip tide 80's > at > >> 24v. 2x banks of 4 agm's. These are wired in 2 pairs of batteries in > >> series > >> with both pairs connected to the main terminals. I have a standard > heavy > >> switch so I can use each bank separately or both together. I used heavy > >> tinned marine cable. Can't remember the thickness. > >> > >> I find my motors a little underpowered, but other than that it seems > fine. > >> > >> Aft thruster has the minn Kota controller, I originally had those on the > >> sides but found it a pain, so I changed those to have just on/off > relays. > >> Much better. > >> > >> Regards, > >> James > >> > >> On Monday, 30 October 2017, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles > >> wrote: > >> > >> Alan > >> Yes there are 2 separate pods each containing 4 each 12v batteries , 3 > for > >> the 36v for thrusters & 1 for the onboard systems. > >> DAN H built his per plans and specs and is running his stern thruster > off > >> one side & and sides off the other side but he is not running > Minn-Kotas. > >> I am hopping James Franklin will chime in as he is using the Minn-Kotas > in > >> his. > >> Rick > >> > >> On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 8:13 PM Alan via Personal_Submersibles > >> wrote: > >> > >> Rick, > >> I am not familiar with the k350 battery set up, but are there two > >> battery pods with 3 x 12V batteries in each pod? > >> What are the other k350 owners doing? Do they run the 3 thrusters > >> off the 2 battery pods similtaneously i.e. connect both pods in > parallel. > >> If you did this then you would only be drawing half the amps off each > >> battery pod, than you would be if you were using one. > >> I wonder what traction batteries mobility scooters use? > >> Cheers Alan > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> Sent from my iPad > >> > >>> On 29/10/2017, at 9:27 AM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>> I am trying to size my wire for the 36v side from where the power comes > >>> into the sub to selector switch to hot buss bar and was wondering if > that > >>> was something that someone could answer. Also I was told by Minn-Kota > >>> that > >>> they recommend group 27 marine batteries. > >>> I have a couple of deep cycle (marine batteries) on my boat and they > are > >>> 550 cca and 125 amps reserve capacity. > >>> My plan is to run all three Minn-kota thrusters off of one side at a > time > >>> and their max draw is 46 amps max so there is 138 amps if all three > >>> thrusters are wide open. I doubt I would ever have all three maxed for > >>> more > >>> than short spurts but want to be repaired for the worst case scenario > >>> like > >>> if I am bucking a strong current. > >>> I also will be running 6 outside LED lights off the same bank and > though > >>> I > >>> can dim them and selectively use them, all on at max would be about a > >>> 16.6 > >>> amp draw as well. Now most of the time I will be using the thrusters at > >>> minimal draw and not all 3 at the same time and the 6 lights will > >>> probably > >>> never all be on at the same time. > >>> If everything was wide open, I would be pulling about 155 amps from a > >>> bank > >>> that has a reserve capacity of 125 so it would deplete the bank rather > >>> fast > >>> and may even damage the batteries due to a quick drain? So,,, first > >>> question...would 2 OTT wire be sufficient from battery source to bus > bar > >>> as > >>> long as I am not running full tilt on everythig and second... since I > >>> have > >>> to stick with a lead acid system due to design, can I get a group 27 > >>> battery > >>> that can deliver much more than the 125 amps I have on my boat? > >>> I also have the option of putting the battery selector switch on both > >>> banks if I have to but would rather deplete one bank at a time if can. > >>> Comments appreciated. > >>> Rick > >>> ______________________________ _________________ > >>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > >>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > > > >> > >> > >> ______________________________ _________________ > >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org > >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list > >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > >> > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > > > _______________________________________________ > Personal_Submersibles mailing list > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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