From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 04:44:00 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2016 08:44:00 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Radius Ball Turner
In-Reply-To: <20160930180638.5A2A6F06@m0086238.ppops.net>
References: <20160930180638.5A2A6F06@m0086238.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1221030316.2556716.1475311440963@mail.yahoo.com>

Clever idea Brian.Is this for the manipulator?Alan


      From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: PSubs <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Saturday, October 1, 2016 2:06 PM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Radius Ball Turner
   
I've begun the process of making one of these:?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwGLL7cMdHk?Mine will be a bit beefier since my lathe is bigger, so the base and?turning unit will be bigger.? ??Brian????
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 08:09:49 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2016 12:09:49 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Radius Ball Turner
In-Reply-To: <20160930180638.5A2A6F06@m0086238.ppops.net>
References: <20160930180638.5A2A6F06@m0086238.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1944064544.3612608.1475323789538@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,That is cool !?Hank 

    On Friday, September 30, 2016 7:06 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 I've begun the process of making one of these:?https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwGLL7cMdHk?Mine will be a bit beefier since my lathe is bigger, so the base and?turning unit will be bigger.? ??Brian????
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 10:08:14 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2016 07:08:14 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Radius Ball Turner
Message-ID: <20161001070814.5A28E06C@m0087795.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 15:32:33 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2016 19:32:33 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi AllCheck out this brushless 124lb trolling motor. ?What do you think? ?it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure. ?maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub. ?I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank. ?The current set up is to slow. ? I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine. ?Hank

     On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 15:41:04 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2016 19:41:04 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1296589316.3663598.1475350864516@mail.yahoo.com>

Holy cow Batman, they come in 160 lb thrust alsoHank 

    On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:35 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi AllCheck out this brushless 124lb trolling motor. ?What do you think? ?it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure. ?maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub. ?I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank. ?The current set up is to slow. ? I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine. ?Hank

     On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr


   
_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 16:45:45 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2016 13:45:45 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
Message-ID: <20161001134545.5A2A7665@m0086238.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 20:48:29 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 00:48:29 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <1296589316.3663598.1475350864516@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1296589316.3663598.1475350864516@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1572596318.3813227.1475369309562@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,The motor would still be under pressure oil filled. ?I have no idea what is in there so not sure if it even matters. ? ?Turns out there is an even bigger one than the 160 lb?Hank 

    On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:45 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Holy cow Batman, they come in 160 lb thrust alsoHank 

    On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:35 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi AllCheck out this brushless 124lb trolling motor. ?What do you think? ?it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure. ?maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub. ?I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank. ?The current set up is to slow. ? I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine. ?Hank

     On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr


   
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 22:47:26 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2016 19:47:26 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: qV0ybc5lFfdZcqV10b8mbe
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1296589316.3663598.1475350864516@mail.yahoo.com> qV0ybc5lFfdZcqV10b8mbe
Message-ID: <000b01d21c57$502ec2e0$f08c48a0$@telus.net>

How about encasing this motor and its controller in a hard pressure proof shell and connecting the prop shaft through a magnetic coupler?

Tim

 

From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Saturday, October 1, 2016 5:48 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor

 

Brian,

The motor would still be under pressure oil filled.  I have no idea what is in there so not sure if it even matters.    

Turns out there is an even bigger one than the 160 lb 

Hank

 

On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:45 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote:

 

Holy cow Batman, they come in 160 lb thrust also

Hank

 

On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:35 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote:

 

Hi All

Check out this brushless 124lb trolling motor.  What do you think?  it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure.  maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub.  I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank.  The current set up is to slow.   I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine.  

Hank

On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca <mailto:mp13 at live.ca> > wrote:

 

N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ <http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr> &vxp=mtr 

 

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org> 
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

 

_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org> 
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  1 23:01:40 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2016 20:01:40 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Radius Ball Turner
Message-ID: <20161001200140.5A29EBA7@m0087797.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 07:01:50 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 11:01:50 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <162623839.8222406.1475406110031@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi Hank,I have done endless Googling looking for brushless trolling motors &saw these two which seem a similar animalhttp://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=397
http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=406

I contacted the supplier as I was wanting to buy the first item, but there were things they?told me that didn't seem right, & the freight was very expensive,so I didn't bother.You still have the problem of their sub standard?seal. Would love to pull one apart.I am due to put my latest motor & housing in the pool tomorrow.I did some tests running it with & without oil & it's looking good.If it runs well?in the pool?I will build?my final housing (hopefully) witha mechanical seal.?Cheers Alan



      From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Sunday, October 2, 2016 8:32 AM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
   
Hi AllCheck out this brushless 124lb trolling motor. ?What do you think? ?it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure. ?maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub. ?I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank. ?The current set up is to slow. ? I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine. ?Hank

     On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr


   
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 11:23:39 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 15:23:39 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <162623839.8222406.1475406110031@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
 <162623839.8222406.1475406110031@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1206358034.3946361.1475421819224@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,You say they have a substandard seal, what does that mean. ?Surely they hold the water out. ?Would the seal configuration determine wether it is air or oil compensated. ?The part I like is the power ratings, forget thrust because that is all crap. ?But the amps, watts and volts, you could assume to be true. ? ?Maybe if the seal is poor, it could be upgraded.Hank 

    On Sunday, October 2, 2016 5:02 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi Hank,I have done endless Googling looking for brushless trolling motors &saw these two which seem a similar animalhttp://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=397
http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=406

I contacted the supplier as I was wanting to buy the first item, but there were things they?told me that didn't seem right, & the freight was very expensive,so I didn't bother.You still have the problem of their sub standard?seal. Would love to pull one apart.I am due to put my latest motor & housing in the pool tomorrow.I did some tests running it with & without oil & it's looking good.If it runs well?in the pool?I will build?my final housing (hopefully) witha mechanical seal.?Cheers Alan



      From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Sunday, October 2, 2016 8:32 AM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
  
Hi AllCheck out this brushless 124lb trolling motor. ?What do you think? ?it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure. ?maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub. ?I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank. ?The current set up is to slow. ? I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine. ?Hank

     On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr


   
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 12:47:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 05:47:43 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <1206358034.3946361.1475421819224@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
 <162623839.8222406.1475406110031@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1206358034.3946361.1475421819224@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <C36D92E3-6DC4-4F35-9D58-8064AE6D1D4F@yahoo.com>

Hank,
I Assume the seals are just rubber rotary seals like the Minnkota.
I have a few Cheap Chinese trolling motors. These ones might be
of a better standard. 
I would love you to buy one so I can find out how they are constructed,
but it is a bit of a gamble. It may be that it is a great find & you can
modify the seals easily. 
Emile was running the Protruar 2 hp brushless geared thruster on his sub,
& said it was a bit noisy. I believe he has now replaced it.
I was drawing an extra 1 amp off 50V (50w) on full throttle with oil (10cst)
in the housing. So it's not too much of a loss on a 2000W motor.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 3/10/2016, at 4:23 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> You say they have a substandard seal, what does that mean.  Surely they hold the water out.  Would the seal configuration determine wether it is air or oil compensated.  The part I like is the power ratings, forget thrust because that is all crap.  But the amps, watts and volts, you could assume to be true.    Maybe if the seal is poor, it could be upgraded.
> Hankes might 
> 
> 
> On Sunday, October 2, 2016 5:02 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Hank,
> I have done endless Googling looking for brushless trolling motors &
> saw these two which seem a similar animal
> http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=397
> 
> http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=406
> 
> I contacted the supplier as I was wanting to buy the first item, but there were
> things they told me that didn't seem right, & the freight was very expensive,
> so I didn't bother.
> You still have the problem of their sub standard seal. Would love to pull one apart.
> I am due to put my latest motor & housing in the pool tomorrow.
> I did some tests running it with & without oil & it's looking good.
> If it runs well in the pool I will build my final housing (hopefully) with
> a mechanical seal. 
> Cheers Alan
> 
> 
> 
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
> Sent: Sunday, October 2, 2016 8:32 AM
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
> 
> Hi All
> Check out this brushless 124lb trolling motor.  What do you think?  it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure.  maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub.  I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank.  The current set up is to slow.   I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine.  
> Hank
> 
> On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
> 
> 
> N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
> 
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 13:22:06 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 17:22:06 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <C36D92E3-6DC4-4F35-9D58-8064AE6D1D4F@yahoo.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
 <162623839.8222406.1475406110031@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1206358034.3946361.1475421819224@mail.yahoo.com>
 <C36D92E3-6DC4-4F35-9D58-8064AE6D1D4F@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1725403645.3896818.1475428926999@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,I just need travelling motors, no reverse needed. ?Maybe I should experiment with?submersible well pumps. ?I can get 1 hp model for under 200 dollars. ?They are pretty much ready to go, the rpm is?troubling though at 3400. ?I am not sure how they would last running off an inverter also. ?Lots to consider.Hank 

    On Sunday, October 2, 2016 10:48 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,I Assume the seals are just rubber rotary seals like the Minnkota.I have a few Cheap Chinese trolling motors. These ones might beof a better standard.?I would love you to buy one so I can find out how they are constructed,but it is a bit of a gamble. It may be that it is a great find & you canmodify the seals easily.?Emile was running the Protruar 2 hp brushless geared thruster on his sub,& said it was a bit noisy. I believe he has now replaced it.I was drawing an extra 1 amp off 50V (50w) on full throttle with oil (10cst)in the housing. So it's not too much of a loss on a 2000W motor.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 3/10/2016, at 4:23 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,You say they have a substandard seal, what does that mean. ?Surely they hold the water out. ?Would the seal configuration determine wether it is air or oil compensated. ?The part I like is the power ratings, forget thrust because that is all crap. ?But the amps, watts and volts, you could assume to be true. ? ?Maybe if the seal is poor, it could be upgraded.Hankes might? 

    On Sunday, October 2, 2016 5:02 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi Hank,I have done endless Googling looking for brushless trolling motors &saw these two which seem a similar animalhttp://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=397
http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=406

I contacted the supplier as I was wanting to buy the first item, but there were things they?told me that didn't seem right, & the freight was very expensive,so I didn't bother.You still have the problem of their sub standard?seal. Would love to pull one apart.I am due to put my latest motor & housing in the pool tomorrow.I did some tests running it with & without oil & it's looking good.If it runs well?in the pool?I will build?my final housing (hopefully) witha mechanical seal.?Cheers Alan



      From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Sunday, October 2, 2016 8:32 AM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
  
Hi AllCheck out this brushless 124lb trolling motor. ?What do you think? ?it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure. ?maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub. ?I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank. ?The current set up is to slow. ? I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine. ?Hank

     On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr


   
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Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 14:28:50 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 11:28:50 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
Message-ID: <20161002112850.77BADE70@m0087792.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 14:36:46 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 11:36:46 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <20161002112850.77BADE70@m0087792.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1475433406.78007.YahooMailMobile@web125404.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

Tim,
Yes I would just use the oil filled motor with a matched prop
Hank
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 14:37:49 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 11:37:49 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <20161002112850.77BADE70@m0087792.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1475433469.89035.YahooMailMobile@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>

Oops I meant Brian
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 20:06:47 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 20:06:47 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
Message-ID: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>

Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I
can.

I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next
couple of years.

Looking forward to meeting you all.

-Eric
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 20:30:01 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 00:30:01 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <997858406.4148019.1475454601220@mail.yahoo.com>

Hello Eric,Welcome?aboard, where are you from?Hank 

    On Sunday, October 2, 2016 6:07 PM, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can.?
I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years.?
Looking forward to meeting you all.?
-Eric
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 22:10:46 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 22:10:46 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <997858406.4148019.1475454601220@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
 <997858406.4148019.1475454601220@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAOGJjnLe1BpmERxrw1wwy8ODGCUSSv920sf7TLjMPuF-9PWyCg@mail.gmail.com>

Welcome to PSUBS Eric! If you're serious about building a submersible,
you've definitely found a valuable resource here. I'm fairly new myself,
but some of these guys have been at it a while and can really help you get
your project off the ground. Good luck! ~ Douglas S.

On Sun, Oct 2, 2016 at 8:30 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hello Eric,
> Welcome aboard, where are you from?
> Hank
>
>
> On Sunday, October 2, 2016 6:07 PM, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I
> can.
>
> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next
> couple of years.
>
> Looking forward to meeting you all.
>
> -Eric
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  2 23:59:58 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Scott Waters via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2016 22:59:58 -0500
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
Message-ID: <i7spujm3moknqrvem6ejdq9f.1475467198305@email.android.com>


    
Hi Eric! Welcome to the group! Myself and basically anyone on the group are more than happy to assist with any questionsThank you,Scott Waters


Sent from my U.S. Cellular? Smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
Date: 10/02/2016  7:06 PM  (GMT-06:00) 
To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org 
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy. 

Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can.?
I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years.?
Looking forward to meeting you all.?
-Eric
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 00:30:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 21:30:38 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
Message-ID: <20161002213038.5A2E59C9@m0087798.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 03:17:36 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 20:17:36 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B9BDB731-DD48-4665-9153-7F00610CDD68@yahoo.com>

Welcome along Eric.
I am 1 of 2 Psubbers from New Zealand. 
There is a great pool of knowledge within the group.
To get you up to speed, most people would agree that
reading the book Manned Submersibles is a good start.
There should be a link to a free on line version, on the
Psub site; however a lot of the guys have bought their
own copies.
Cheers Alan.

Sent from my iPad

> On 3/10/2016, at 1:06 pm, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can. 
> 
> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years. e 
> 
> Looking forward to meeting you all. 
> 
> -Eric
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 04:07:18 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 21:07:18 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
Message-ID: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>

Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
above average.
The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
on a bigger prop.
Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
another housing with a mechanical seal.
Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
some reason. Couldn't change them. 
 http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
Alan

Sent from my iPad

From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 04:28:44 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 08:28:44 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,That is great! well done.. ?What type of mechanical seal will you use? ?Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal? ?Hank? 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
above average.
The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
on a bigger prop.
Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
another housing with a mechanical seal.
Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
some reason. Couldn't change them. 
 http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
Alan

Sent from my iPad
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 05:39:56 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:39:56 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
 <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <329BBED7-1D56-46F5-965C-18F966E508FB@yahoo.com>

Hi Hank, thanks.
yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some advice
on an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).
Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new 
compensating oil I bought. 
I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the 
motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.
I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clamped
to one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I have
a plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimental
purposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fitting
when I mount it on the sub.
Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> That is great! well done..  What type of mechanical seal will you use?  Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal?  
> Hank 
> 
> 
> On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
> above average.
> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
> on a bigger prop.
> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
> another housing with a mechanical seal.
> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
> some reason. Couldn't change them. 
> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 06:40:42 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (MerlinSub@t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 12:40:42 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <B9BDB731-DD48-4665-9153-7F00610CDD68@yahoo.com>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
 <B9BDB731-DD48-4665-9153-7F00610CDD68@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1475491242662.1460834.38846587730757b00dcfada1172994bb1407de2f@spica.telekom.de>

New Zealand. I have hearded from it. Its on the other side of the plate - Right? 
If I build a submarine which can dive very deep I can be there in a hour or so - right? 

Eric were do come from? Maay intruduce yourself. 

vbr Carsten 



-----Original-Nachricht-----
Betreff: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
Datum: 2016-10-03T09:20:28+0200
Von: "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
An: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>

Welcome along Eric.
I am 1 of 2 Psubbers from New Zealand. 
There is a great pool of knowledge within the group.
To get you up to speed, most people would agree that
reading the book Manned Submersibles is a good start.
There should be a link to a free on line version, on the
Psub site; however a lot of the guys have bought their
own copies.
Cheers Alan.

Sent from my iPad

> On 3/10/2016, at 1:06 pm, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can. 
> 
> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years. e 
> 
> Looking forward to meeting you all. 
> 
> -Eric
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
?


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 07:37:32 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 11:37:32 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <329BBED7-1D56-46F5-965C-18F966E508FB@yahoo.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
 <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>
 <329BBED7-1D56-46F5-965C-18F966E508FB@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1210202622.4211053.1475494652696@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting. ?The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator. ?I know you?already though of this. ?I think the DW's work like that.If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal. ?Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi Hank, thanks.yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some adviceon an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new?compensating oil I bought.?I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the?motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clampedto one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I havea plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimentalpurposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fittingwhen I mount it on the sub.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,That is great! well done.. ?What type of mechanical seal will you use? ?Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal? ?Hank? 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
above average.
The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
on a bigger prop.
Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
another housing with a mechanical seal.
Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
some reason. Couldn't change them. 
 http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
Alan

Sent from my iPad
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 10:40:23 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Private via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 10:40:23 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <F4900120-3339-4A5F-B9BB-0D746F16CA75@gmail.com>

Oh neat, I love it when people take the trouble to develop new solutions like that. Well done!

Alec

> On Oct 3, 2016, at 4:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
> above average.
> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
> on a bigger prop.
> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
> another housing with a mechanical seal.
> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
> some reason. Couldn't change them. 
> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 12:23:23 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 17:23:23 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <1475433469.89035.YahooMailMobile@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
References: <20161002112850.77BADE70@m0087792.ppops.net>
 <1475433469.89035.YahooMailMobile@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UBOOdkEGC2YJZMmciiuye64O0chnKaR_Wsry=TTCV7tPg@mail.gmail.com>

looks a good find Hank.  How do you know the controller is in the motor?

"equivalent to 5hp"   right.  But the other specs sounds good.  24v works
for me...

Be interesting to see what they are like if you get one.  Id like to
upgrade my aft motor.  This could be the ticket...

regards
James

On 2 October 2016 at 19:37, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Oops I meant Brian
>
> ------------------------------
> * From: * Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>;
> * To: * Personal Submersibles General Discussion <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>;
> * Subject: * Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
> * Sent: * Sun, Oct 2, 2016 6:28:50 PM
>
> Hank,    Those well pumps are multi-stage pumps with all these diffusers (
> I think that's what they call them) It's possible that the principle they
> work on depends on those.  But you still may be able to make it work just
> as a motor.
>
> Brian
>
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
> Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 17:22:06 +0000 (UTC)
>
> Alan,
> I just need travelling motors, no reverse needed.  Maybe I should
> experiment with submersible well pumps.  I can get 1 hp model for under 200
> dollars.  They are pretty much ready to go, the rpm is troubling though
> at 3400.  I am not sure how they would last running off an inverter also.
> Lots to consider.
> Hank
>
>
> On Sunday, October 2, 2016 10:48 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Hank,
> I Assume the seals are just rubber rotary seals like the Minnkota.
> I have a few Cheap Chinese trolling motors. These ones might be
> of a better standard.
> I would love you to buy one so I can find out how they are constructed,
> but it is a bit of a gamble. It may be that it is a great find & you can
> modify the seals easily.
> Emile was running the Protruar 2 hp brushless geared thruster on his sub,
> & said it was a bit noisy. I believe he has now replaced it.
> I was drawing an extra 1 amp off 50V (50w) on full throttle with oil
> (10cst)
> in the housing. So it's not too much of a loss on a 2000W motor.
> Alan
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 3/10/2016, at 4:23 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Alan,
> You say they have a substandard seal, what does that mean.  Surely they
> hold the water out.  Would the seal configuration determine wether it is
> air or oil compensated.  The part I like is the power ratings, forget
> thrust because that is all crap.  But the amps, watts and volts, you could
> assume to be true.    Maybe if the seal is poor, it could be upgraded.
> Hankes might
>
>
> On Sunday, October 2, 2016 5:02 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Hank,
> I have done endless Googling looking for brushless trolling motors &
> saw these two which seem a similar animal
> http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=397
>
> http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=406
>
> I contacted the supplier as I was wanting to buy the first item, but there
> were
> things they told me that didn't seem right, & the freight was very
> expensive,
> so I didn't bother.
> You still have the problem of their sub standard seal. Would love to pull
> one apart.
> I am due to put my latest motor & housing in the pool tomorrow.
> I did some tests running it with & without oil & it's looking good.
> If it runs well in the pool I will build my final housing (hopefully) with
> a mechanical seal.
> Cheers Alan
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org>
> *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> *Sent:* Sunday, October 2, 2016 8:32 AM
> *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
>
> Hi All
> Check out this brushless 124lb trolling motor.  What do you think?  it has
> a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure.  maybe
> the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub.  I want to add two
> motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank.
> The current set up is to slow.   I figure this is better than adding a
> diesel engine.
> Hank
>
> On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
>
>
> N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-
> Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=
> item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles
> mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/
> listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 15:04:36 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 08:04:36 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <1475491242662.1460834.38846587730757b00dcfada1172994bb1407de2f@spica.telekom.de>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
 <B9BDB731-DD48-4665-9153-7F00610CDD68@yahoo.com>
 <1475491242662.1460834.38846587730757b00dcfada1172994bb1407de2f@spica.telekom.de>
Message-ID: <ACBC96C2-2A1E-4706-848E-81775B43F704@yahoo.com>

Yes, just sail South Carsten & turn left at South Africa.
Look for the green place with all the sheep!
If you see Kangaroos, that's Australia.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 3/10/2016, at 11:40 pm, MerlinSub at t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> New Zealand. I have hearded from it. Its on the other side of the plate - Right? 
> If I build a submarine which can dive very deep I can be there in a hour or so - right? 
> 
> Eric were do come from? Maay intruduce yourself. 
> 
> vbr Carsten 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original-Nachricht-----
> Betreff: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
> Datum: 2016-10-03T09:20:28+0200
> Von: "Alan via Personal_Submersibles" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> An: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> 
> Welcome along Eric.
> I am 1 of 2 Psubbers from New Zealand. 
> There is a great pool of knowledge within the group.
> To get you up to speed, most people would agree that
> reading the book Manned Submersibles is a good start.
> There should be a link to a free on line version, on the
> Psub site; however a lot of the guys have bought their
> own copies.
> Cheers Alan.
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 3/10/2016, at 1:06 pm, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can. 
>> 
>> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years. e 
>> 
>> Looking forward to meeting you all. 
>> 
>> -Eric
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> ?
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 15:26:47 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 08:26:47 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <1210202622.4211053.1475494652696@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
 <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>
 <329BBED7-1D56-46F5-965C-18F966E508FB@yahoo.com>
 <1210202622.4211053.1475494652696@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <DF274C53-DA28-4B1D-B400-CB546810327D@yahoo.com>

Hank,
yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attaching
on to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & are
intending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I also
need an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.
I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.
I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea
& thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaft
the lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanical
seal would eliminate that precision process.
Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they have
done the research on seals & have the experience.
Cheers Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting.  The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator.  I know you already though of this.  I think the DW's work like that.
> If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal.  Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Hank, thanks.
> yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some advice
> on an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).
> Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new 
> compensating oil I bought. 
> I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the 
> motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.
> I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clamped
> to one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I have
> a plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimental
> purposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fitting
> when I mount it on the sub.
> Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,
>> That is great! well done..  What type of mechanical seal will you use?  Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal?  
>> Hank 
>> 
>> 
>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
>> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
>> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
>> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
>> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
>> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
>> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
>> above average.
>> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
>> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
>> on a bigger prop.
>> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
>> another housing with a mechanical seal.
>> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
>> some reason. Couldn't change them. 
>> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
>> Alan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 15:43:11 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 15:43:11 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <ACBC96C2-2A1E-4706-848E-81775B43F704@yahoo.com>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
 <B9BDB731-DD48-4665-9153-7F00610CDD68@yahoo.com>
 <1475491242662.1460834.38846587730757b00dcfada1172994bb1407de2f@spica.telekom.de>
 <ACBC96C2-2A1E-4706-848E-81775B43F704@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <831116e0-9c9b-a5c2-0ff9-1da46d196cd7@ohiohills.com>

On 10/3/2016 3:04 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote:
> Yes, just sail South Carsten & turn left at South Africa.
> Look for the green place with all the sheep!
> If you see Kangaroos, that's Australia.
... And they say coastal piloting is a forgotten art ....


Mike


---
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 16:27:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (MerlinSub@t-online.de via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:27:38 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <831116e0-9c9b-a5c2-0ff9-1da46d196cd7@ohiohills.com>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
 <B9BDB731-DD48-4665-9153-7F00610CDD68@yahoo.com>
 <1475491242662.1460834.38846587730757b00dcfada1172994bb1407de2f@spica.telekom.de>
 <ACBC96C2-2A1E-4706-848E-81775B43F704@yahoo.com>
 <831116e0-9c9b-a5c2-0ff9-1da46d196cd7@ohiohills.com>
Message-ID: <1475526458285.2984112.fe3263444cba691ca72cda5bfe256b9585cfa5c0@spica.telekom.de>

I was on that way last weekend, but seen black and white birds on ice. 
Must be cool this Australia..



-----Original-Nachricht-----
Betreff: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
Datum: 2016-10-03T21:46:29+0200
Von: "Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
An: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>

On 10/3/2016 3:04 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote:
> Yes, just sail South Carsten & turn left at South Africa.
> Look for the green place with all the sheep!
> If you see Kangaroos, that's Australia.
... And they say coastal piloting is a forgotten art ....


Mike


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?


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 17:50:29 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 10:50:29 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UBOOdkEGC2YJZMmciiuye64O0chnKaR_Wsry=TTCV7tPg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20161002112850.77BADE70@m0087792.ppops.net>
 <1475433469.89035.YahooMailMobile@web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UBOOdkEGC2YJZMmciiuye64O0chnKaR_Wsry=TTCV7tPg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <10D92C85-B727-4BF6-AC9D-2ED566A14173@yahoo.com>

Hi James,
am answering the question for Hank here, & adding some more comment.
On his original Ebay link, if you scroll through the images, there is a diagram
of the motor internals that says the controller is inside. I was wondering about
this & can't see any evidence to the contrary. All these brushless motor controllers
have large capacitors that could be susceptible to pressure in a compensated
motor if you went too deep.
It would be interesting to pressure test a similar capacitor to see where they fail.
The motor is an in-runner that has the coils on the outside & permanent magnet
part rotating. These have less torque than the out-runner motor, so I am dubious
of their performance statistics.  
Still the housings are hard to make & they look like they have done a good job.
Would love to pull one apart.
Alan
Sent from my iPad

> On 4/10/2016, at 5:23 am, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> looks a good find Hank.  How do you know the controller is in the motor?   
>  
> "equivalent to 5hp"   right.  But the other specs sounds good.  24v works for me...
>  
> Be interesting to see what they are like if you get one.  Id like to upgrade my aft motor.  This could be the ticket...
>  
> regards
> James
> 
>> On 2 October 2016 at 19:37, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Oops I meant Brian
>> 
>> From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>; 
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>; 
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor 
>> Sent: Sun, Oct 2, 2016 6:28:50 PM 
>> 
>> Hank,    Those well pumps are multi-stage pumps with all these diffusers ( I think that's what they call them) It's possible that the principle they work on depends on those.  But you still may be able to make it work just as a motor.
>>  
>> Brian
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
>> Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 17:22:06 +0000 (UTC)
>> 
>> Alan,
>> I just need travelling motors, no reverse needed.  Maybe I should experiment with submersible well pumps.  I can get 1 hp model for under 200 dollars.  They are pretty much ready to go, the rpm is troubling though at 3400.  I am not sure how they would last running off an inverter also.  Lots to consider.
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Sunday, October 2, 2016 10:48 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hank,
>> I Assume the seals are just rubber rotary seals like the Minnkota.
>> I have a few Cheap Chinese trolling motors. These ones might be
>> of a better standard. 
>> I would love you to buy one so I can find out how they are constructed,
>> but it is a bit of a gamble. It may be that it is a great find & you can
>> modify the seals easily. 
>> Emile was running the Protruar 2 hp brushless geared thruster on his sub,
>> & said it was a bit noisy. I believe he has now replaced it.
>> I was drawing an extra 1 amp off 50V (50w) on full throttle with oil (10cst)
>> in the housing. So it's not too much of a loss on a 2000W motor.
>> Alan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>> On 3/10/2016, at 4:23 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,
>> You say they have a substandard seal, what does that mean.  Surely they hold the water out.  Would the seal configuration determine wether it is air or oil compensated.  The part I like is the power ratings, forget thrust because that is all crap.  But the amps, watts and volts, you could assume to be true.    Maybe if the seal is poor, it could be upgraded.
>> Hankes might 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sunday, October 2, 2016 5:02 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hi Hank,
>> I have done endless Googling looking for brushless trolling motors &
>> saw these two which seem a similar animal
>> http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=397
>> 
>> http://www.sportrend.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=406
>> 
>> I contacted the supplier as I was wanting to buy the first item, but there were
>> things they told me that didn't seem right, & the freight was very expensive,
>> so I didn't bother.
>> You still have the problem of their sub standard seal. Would love to pull one apart.
>> I am due to put my latest motor & housing in the pool tomorrow.
>> I did some tests running it with & without oil & it's looking good.
>> If it runs well in the pool I will build my final housing (hopefully) with
>> a mechanical seal. 
>> Cheers Alan
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
>> Sent: Sunday, October 2, 2016 8:32 AM
>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
>> 
>> Hi All
>> Check out this brushless 124lb trolling motor.  What do you think?  it has a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure.  maybe the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub.  I want to add two motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank.  The current set up is to slow.   I figure this is better than adding a diesel engine.  
>> Hank
>> 
>> On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
>> 
>> http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 17:56:28 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 17:56:28 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B356FA2A-916B-46BE-A111-1E4C43EC6EA4@gmail.com>

Hi ! 

I am a new guy too from 3-4 month! Nice to meet you. Im from Qu?bec Canada . I'm planning to build k-250. 
Lot of questions soon! 

Philippe 

Envoy? de mon iPhone

> Le 2 oct. 2016 ? 20:06, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> a ?crit :
> 
> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can. 
> 
> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years. 
> 
> Looking forward to meeting you all. 
> 
> -Eric
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 18:44:10 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:44:10 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <DF274C53-DA28-4B1D-B400-CB546810327D@yahoo.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
 <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>
 <329BBED7-1D56-46F5-965C-18F966E508FB@yahoo.com>
 <1210202622.4211053.1475494652696@mail.yahoo.com>
 <DF274C53-DA28-4B1D-B400-CB546810327D@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1344406281.4810116.1475534650571@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,You are right, the mechanical seal is the easiest way to go. ?My Perry thrusters had simple spring loaded seals with a sealed cavity behind the mechanical seal. ? You will be oil?filled, so the seal will have the back up oil.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 1:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attachingon to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & areintending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I alsoneed an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea& thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaftthe lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanicalseal would eliminate that precision process.Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they havedone the research on seals & have the experience.Cheers Alan
Sent from my iPad
On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting. ?The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator. ?I know you?already though of this. ?I think the DW's work like that.If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal. ?Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi Hank, thanks.yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some adviceon an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new?compensating oil I bought.?I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the?motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clampedto one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I havea plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimentalpurposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fittingwhen I mount it on the sub.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,That is great! well done.. ?What type of mechanical seal will you use? ?Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal? ?Hank? 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
above average.
The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
on a bigger prop.
Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
another housing with a mechanical seal.
Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
some reason. Couldn't change them. 
 http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
Alan

Sent from my iPad
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


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Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 19:24:49 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 10:24:49 +1100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <1475526458285.2984112.fe3263444cba691ca72cda5bfe256b9585cfa5c0@spica.telekom.de>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
 <B9BDB731-DD48-4665-9153-7F00610CDD68@yahoo.com>
 <1475491242662.1460834.38846587730757b00dcfada1172994bb1407de2f@spica.telekom.de>
 <ACBC96C2-2A1E-4706-848E-81775B43F704@yahoo.com>
 <831116e0-9c9b-a5c2-0ff9-1da46d196cd7@ohiohills.com>
 <1475526458285.2984112.fe3263444cba691ca72cda5bfe256b9585cfa5c0@spica.telekom.de>
Message-ID: <CAAzgXiNwPkHfdKerzWGgukj5HmAV3SQNU4KR0_gLD5fyqa6Z8A@mail.gmail.com>

Perhaps the black and white birds were some of our magpies and the ice
was in a beer cooler ;).  I can report that the tiny amount of natural ice
that Australia sees is pretty much gone as we head into spring.

Cheers (and g'day?)
Steve - Melbourne, Australia

On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 7:27 AM, MerlinSub at t-online.de via
Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> I was on that way last weekend, but seen black and white birds on ice.
> Must be cool this Australia..
>
>
>
> -----Original-Nachricht-----
> Betreff: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
> Datum: 2016-10-03T21:46:29+0200
> Von: "Michael Holt via Personal_Submersibles" <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> An: "Personal Submersibles General Discussion" <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>
> On 10/3/2016 3:04 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles wrote:
> > Yes, just sail South Carsten & turn left at South Africa.
> > Look for the green place with all the sheep!
> > If you see Kangaroos, that's Australia.
> ... And they say coastal piloting is a forgotten art ....
>
>
> Mike
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> ?
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 19:56:13 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 19:56:13 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <DF274C53-DA28-4B1D-B400-CB546810327D@yahoo.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
 <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>
 <329BBED7-1D56-46F5-965C-18F966E508FB@yahoo.com>
 <1210202622.4211053.1475494652696@mail.yahoo.com>
 <DF274C53-DA28-4B1D-B400-CB546810327D@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CABECYQ7y2V-k_ZsNaFXo15d0q2o-E3HM9Vaqs_zY_nfjWuUXcQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Alan,

Parker sells some little metal sleeves that stretch onto the shaft and are
ground to the ideal finish for lip seals. It's a really easy way to meet
the surface finish requirement, and they're super cheap too.


Best,

Alec

On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 3:26 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hank,
> yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear
> tube attaching
> on to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system &
> are
> intending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I
> also
> need an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double
> for this.
> I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.
> I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea
> & thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the
> shaft
> the lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a
> mechanical
> seal would eliminate that precision process.
> Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they have
> done the research on seals & have the experience.
> Cheers Alan
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Alan,
> You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave
> the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a
> penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting.  The clear tube
> can be oil filled and act as your compensator.  I know you already though
> of this.  I think the DW's work like that.
> If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal.  Just go with a higher
> pressure rated lip seal.
> Hank
>
>
> On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Hank, thanks.
> yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some
> advice
> on an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina
> S2 Bl 10).
> Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new
> compensating oil I bought.
> I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out
> of the
> motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a
> manifold.
> I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is
> hose clamped
> to one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On
> the T I have
> a plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is
> okay for experimental
> purposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull
> fitting
> when I mount it on the sub.
> Alan
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Alan,
> That is great! well done..  What type of mechanical seal will you use?
> Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal?
> Hank
>
>
> On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no
> kort nozzle.
> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with
> the thruster
> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his
> Minnkota 101.
> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file
> on
> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is
> slightly
> above average.
> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps
> continuosly,
> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by
> putting
> on a bigger prop.
> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then
> build
> another housing with a mechanical seal.
> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down
> for
> some reason. Couldn't change them.
> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
> Alan
>
> Sent from my iPad
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 20:00:48 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 20:00:48 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
In-Reply-To: <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102179098C38A85EB2586B7DDFC00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <898986577.3919807.1475350353335@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CABECYQ48VVjx87NZg4FmgFrwbbYzqTgC9kxXxqbz9B8RFVn5Dg@mail.gmail.com>

Emile was using a Chinese brushless trolling motor and as I recall the
issue was that it took a long time to wind up or down from max rpms, which
were much higher than in brushed motors. As a result, although it was fine
for surface runs it wasn't very handy for submerged maneuvering. It would
be interesting to find out whether this one has the same issue.


Best,

Alec

On Sat, Oct 1, 2016 at 3:32 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hi All
> Check out this brushless 124lb trolling motor.  What do you think?  it has
> a controller inside the motor, not sure that can handle pressure.  maybe
> the controller can be removed and kept inside the sub.  I want to add two
> motors or more for long distance travel with an independent battery bank.
> The current set up is to slow.   I figure this is better than adding a
> diesel engine.
> Hank
>
> On Saturday, October 1, 2016 1:28 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
>
>
> N200-24V 120LB Brushless Electric Boat Trolling Motor Saltwater 42? shaft
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/N200-24V-120LB-Brushless-Electric-
> Boat-Trolling-Motor-Saltwater-42-shaft-/122118856640?hash=
> item1c6ed9dfc0:g:uukAAOSwubRXIINJ&vxp=mtr
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 20:53:03 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 13:53:03 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <B356FA2A-916B-46BE-A111-1E4C43EC6EA4@gmail.com>
References: <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@mail.gmail.com>
 <B356FA2A-916B-46BE-A111-1E4C43EC6EA4@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2DB8E767-69ED-47E5-A168-33473CC9FEB1@yahoo.com>

Welcome along Philipe.
There is a lot of experience in the group with K250s.
There are a few across the border, & it would be great if you
could climb on board one before you started, if you haven't
already.
All the best.
Alan
 


Sent from my iPad

> On 4/10/2016, at 10:56 am, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi ! 
> 
> I am a new guy too from 3-4 month! Nice to meet you. Im from Qu?bec Canada . I'm planning to build k-250. 
> Lot of questions soon! 
> 
> Philippe 
> 
> Envoy? de mon iPhone
> 
>> Le 2 oct. 2016 ? 20:06, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> a ?crit :
>> 
>> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can. 
>> 
>> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years. 
>> 
>> Looking forward to meeting you all. 
>> 
>> -Eric
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 21:07:29 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:07:29 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <CABECYQ7y2V-k_ZsNaFXo15d0q2o-E3HM9Vaqs_zY_nfjWuUXcQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
 <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>
 <329BBED7-1D56-46F5-965C-18F966E508FB@yahoo.com>
 <1210202622.4211053.1475494652696@mail.yahoo.com>
 <DF274C53-DA28-4B1D-B400-CB546810327D@yahoo.com>
 <CABECYQ7y2V-k_ZsNaFXo15d0q2o-E3HM9Vaqs_zY_nfjWuUXcQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <47846E92-96C7-45ED-9066-7AE50306DD07@yahoo.com>

Thanks Alec,
didn't know that product existed. I found this video on an skf sleeve
that is a good demonstration of how they are fitted.
Be good to hear from Emile about his Protruar thruster. I don't know why 
it wasn't working well under the water, as he doesn't go that deep on
his tourist dives.
Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 4/10/2016, at 12:56 pm, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Alan,
> 
> Parker sells some little metal sleeves that stretch onto the shaft and are ground to the ideal finish for lip seals. It's a really easy way to meet the surface finish requirement, and they're super cheap too. 
> 
> 
> Best,
> 
> Alec
> 
>> On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 3:26 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Hank,
>> yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attaching
>> on to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & are
>> intending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I also
>> need an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.
>> I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.
>> I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea
>> & thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaft
>> the lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanical
>> seal would eliminate that precision process.
>> Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they have
>> done the research on seals & have the experience.
>> Cheers Alan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Alan,
>>> You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting.  The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator.  I know you already though of this.  I think the DW's work like that.
>>> If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal.  Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.
>>> Hank
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi Hank, thanks.
>>> yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some advice
>>> on an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).
>>> Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new 
>>> compensating oil I bought. 
>>> I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the 
>>> motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.
>>> I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clamped
>>> to one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I have
>>> a plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimental
>>> purposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fitting
>>> when I mount it on the sub.
>>> Alan
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>>> On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Alan,
>>>> That is great! well done..  What type of mechanical seal will you use?  Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal?  
>>>> Hank 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
>>>> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
>>>> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
>>>> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
>>>> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
>>>> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
>>>> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
>>>> above average.
>>>> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
>>>> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
>>>> on a bigger prop.
>>>> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
>>>> another housing with a mechanical seal.
>>>> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
>>>> some reason. Couldn't change them. 
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
>>>> Alan
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 21:23:01 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Private via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 21:23:01 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <47846E92-96C7-45ED-9066-7AE50306DD07@yahoo.com>
References: <66D354E6-BCB4-49C4-9035-667DD084FE36@yahoo.com>
 <2025310114.505264.1475483324727@mail.yahoo.com>
 <329BBED7-1D56-46F5-965C-18F966E508FB@yahoo.com>
 <1210202622.4211053.1475494652696@mail.yahoo.com>
 <DF274C53-DA28-4B1D-B400-CB546810327D@yahoo.com>
 <CABECYQ7y2V-k_ZsNaFXo15d0q2o-E3HM9Vaqs_zY_nfjWuUXcQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <47846E92-96C7-45ED-9066-7AE50306DD07@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <2CC8E166-44D6-42D2-BC90-C26D2CF677D3@gmail.com>

It's not that they don't work underwater, it's just that if spinning up or down takes too long it's sub-optimal from a piloting perspective.

> On Oct 3, 2016, at 9:07 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Thanks Alec,
> didn't know that product existed. I found this video on an skf sleeve
> that is a good demonstration of how they are fitted.
> Be good to hear from Emile about his Protruar thruster. I don't know why 
> it wasn't working well under the water, as he doesn't go that deep on
> his tourist dives.
> Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 4/10/2016, at 12:56 pm, Alec Smyth via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Alan,
>> 
>> Parker sells some little metal sleeves that stretch onto the shaft and are ground to the ideal finish for lip seals. It's a really easy way to meet the surface finish requirement, and they're super cheap too. 
>> 
>> 
>> Best,
>> 
>> Alec
>> 
>>> On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 3:26 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> Hank,
>>> yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attaching
>>> on to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & are
>>> intending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I also
>>> need an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.
>>> I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.
>>> I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea
>>> & thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaft
>>> the lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanical
>>> seal would eliminate that precision process.
>>> Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they have
>>> done the research on seals & have the experience.
>>> Cheers Alan
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>>> On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Alan,
>>>> You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting.  The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator.  I know you already though of this.  I think the DW's work like that.
>>>> If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal.  Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.
>>>> Hank
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Hi Hank, thanks.
>>>> yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some advice
>>>> on an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).
>>>> Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new 
>>>> compensating oil I bought. 
>>>> I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the 
>>>> motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.
>>>> I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clamped
>>>> to one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I have
>>>> a plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimental
>>>> purposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fitting
>>>> when I mount it on the sub.
>>>> Alan
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>> 
>>>>> On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Alan,
>>>>> That is great! well done..  What type of mechanical seal will you use?  Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal?  
>>>>> Hank 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
>>>>> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
>>>>> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
>>>>> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
>>>>> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
>>>>> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
>>>>> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
>>>>> above average.
>>>>> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
>>>>> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
>>>>> on a bigger prop.
>>>>> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
>>>>> another housing with a mechanical seal.
>>>>> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
>>>>> some reason. Couldn't change them. 
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
>>>>> Alan
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct  3 21:38:19 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 18:38:19 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
Message-ID: <20161003183819.77BB48D6@m0087792.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct  4 01:12:22 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 01:12:22 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
Message-ID: <6276c.547e1834.45249435@aol.com>

Good evening, Philippe,
Glad to know you are there.  Did you happen to make it to New York  when 
several of the guys were diving in July of this year?  I heartily  endorse 
Alan's suggestion of climbing through a K250 and a K350 as well  before you 
decide what to build.  There is a lot of difference in the  passenger position.
 
Eric,
Sorry I didn't get to add my welcome earlier.  Where are you  located?
Jim
 
 
In a message dated 10/3/2016 7:53:34 P.M. Central Daylight Time,  
personal_submersibles at psubs.org writes:

Welcome  along Philipe.
There is a lot of experience in the group with  K250s.
There are a few across the border, & it would be great if  you
could climb on board one before you started, if you  haven't
already.
All the best.
Alan



Sent from my  iPad

> On 4/10/2016, at 10:56 am, Philippe Robert via  Personal_Submersibles 
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>  
> Hi ! 
> 
> I am a new guy too from 3-4 month! Nice to  meet you. Im from Qu?bec 
Canada . I'm planning to build k-250. 
> Lot of  questions soon! 
> 
> Philippe 
> 
> Envoy? de mon  iPhone
> 
>> Le 2 oct. 2016 ? 20:06, Bear Nyhof via  Personal_Submersibles 
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> a ?crit  :
>> 
>> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to  learning as much as I 
can. 
>> 
>> I hope I get the  opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next 
couple of years.  
>> 
>> Looking forward to meeting you all. 
>>  
>> -Eric
>>  _______________________________________________
>>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>  
> _______________________________________________
>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles  mailing  list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct  4 04:03:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:03:43 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <20161003183819.77BB48D6@m0087792.ppops.net>
References: <20161003183819.77BB48D6@m0087792.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <CB80C8CE-D050-4940-A5E9-3A4FD57CB528@yahoo.com>

I am not sure Brian.
I am thinking that a balanced mechanical seal would be necessary if I went
with a mechanical seal. Even though the motor is compensated it would
have more pressure pushing the faces together at depth. 
Every ROV  & submarine thruster seems to have a different seal.
I might try & contact this submersible pump manufacturer & see what they use.
https://www.flowserve.com/sites/default/files/2016-07/fpd-1362-ea4.pdf
They have been in the business of manufacturing submersible pumps for 50
years.
Their headquarters are in Hamburg. Carsten, if you know them I am wanting advice
for a mechanical seal for a pressure compensated thruster with a 10mm shaft 
rotating at 1500 rpm when under load.
Thanks
Regards Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 4/10/2016, at 2:38 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> I thought the ceramic seals were the way to go on those motors.
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
> Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:44:10 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Alan,
> You are right, the mechanical seal is the easiest way to go.  My Perry thrusters had simple spring loaded seals with a sealed cavity behind the mechanical seal.   You will be oil filled, so the seal will have the back up oil.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Monday, October 3, 2016 1:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hank,
> yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attaching
> on to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & are
> intending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I also
> need an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.
> I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.
> I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea
> & thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaft
> the lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanical
> seal would eliminate that precision process.
> Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they have
> done the research on seals & have the experience.
> Cheers Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting.  The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator.  I know you already though of this.  I think the DW's work like that.
> If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal.  Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Hank, thanks.
> yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some advice
> on an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).
> Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new 
> compensating oil I bought. 
> I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the 
> motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.
> I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clamped
> to one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I have
> a plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimental
> purposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fitting
> when I mount it on the sub.
> Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> That is great! well done..  What type of mechanical seal will you use?  Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal?  
> Hank 
> 
> 
> On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
> above average.
> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
> on a bigger prop.
> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
> another housing with a mechanical seal.
> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
> some reason. Couldn't change them. 
> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct  4 08:16:47 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 12:16:47 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <CB80C8CE-D050-4940-A5E9-3A4FD57CB528@yahoo.com>
References: <20161003183819.77BB48D6@m0087792.ppops.net>
 <CB80C8CE-D050-4940-A5E9-3A4FD57CB528@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <693414109.5170981.1475583407189@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,There is a picture of the mechanical seal ?if you scroll down on the site you provided us. ?It looks like a typical ceramic spring seal, same as what was in my Perry thrusters. ?I think the K subs used the same thing.It might be a trick finding a 10 mm though.Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 2:04 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 I am not sure Brian.I am thinking that a balanced mechanical seal would be necessary if I wentwith a mechanical seal. Even though the motor is compensated it wouldhave more pressure pushing the faces together at depth.?Every ROV ?& submarine thruster seems to have a different seal.I might try & contact this submersible pump manufacturer & see what they use.https://www.flowserve.com/sites/default/files/2016-07/fpd-1362-ea4.pdfThey have been in the business of manufacturing submersible pumps for 50years.Their headquarters are in Hamburg. Carsten, if you know them I am wanting advicefor a mechanical seal for a pressure compensated thruster with a 10mm shaft?rotating at 1500 rpm when under load.ThanksRegards Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 4/10/2016, at 2:38 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


I thought the ceramic seals were the way to go on those motors.?Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:44:10 +0000 (UTC)

Alan,You are right, the mechanical seal is the easiest way to go. ?My Perry thrusters had simple spring loaded seals with a sealed cavity behind the mechanical seal. ? You will be oil?filled, so the seal will have the back up oil.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 1:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attachingon to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & areintending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I alsoneed an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea& thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaftthe lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanicalseal would eliminate that precision process.Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they havedone the research on seals & have the experience.Cheers Alan
Sent from my iPad
On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting. ?The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator. ?I know you?already though of this. ?I think the DW's work like that.If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal. ?Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi Hank, thanks.yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some adviceon an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new?compensating oil I bought.?I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the?motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clampedto one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I havea plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimentalpurposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fittingwhen I mount it on the sub.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,That is great! well done.. ?What type of mechanical seal will you use? ?Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal? ?Hank? 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
above average.
The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
on a bigger prop.
Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
another housing with a mechanical seal.
Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
some reason. Couldn't change them. 
 http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
Alan

Sent from my iPad
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http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


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   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct  4 09:02:55 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 02:02:55 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <693414109.5170981.1475583407189@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161003183819.77BB48D6@m0087792.ppops.net>
 <CB80C8CE-D050-4940-A5E9-3A4FD57CB528@yahoo.com>
 <693414109.5170981.1475583407189@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <0E42A514-CFE6-445C-BB8A-9FDBEF34C62B@yahoo.com>

Hank,
I did a bit more Googling on their site, & apart from more complicated systems
for large pumps, they use a balanced mechanical seal for submersible fluid
compensated pumps. I have sent an email off to a local agent, so I could come 
up with a more specific answer.
Surely they will have one for a 10mm shaft??
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 5/10/2016, at 1:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> There is a picture of the mechanical seal  if you scroll down on the site you provided us.  It looks like a typical ceramic spring seal, same as what was in my Perry thrusters.  I think the K subs used the same thing.
> It might be a trick finding a 10 mm though.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 2:04 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> I am not sure Brian.
> I am thinking that a balanced mechanical seal would be necessary if I went
> with a mechanical seal. Even though the motor is compensated it would
> have more pressure pushing the faces together at depth. 
> Every ROV  & submarine thruster seems to have a different seal.
> I might try & contact this submersible pump manufacturer & see what they use.
> https://www.flowserve.com/sites/default/files/2016-07/fpd-1362-ea4.pdf
> They have been in the business of manufacturing submersible pumps for 50
> years.
> Their headquarters are in Hamburg. Carsten, if you know them I am wanting advice
> for a mechanical seal for a pressure compensated thruster with a 10mm shaft 
> rotating at 1500 rpm when under load.
> Thanks
> Regards Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 4/10/2016, at 2:38 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> I thought the ceramic seals were the way to go on those motors.
>>  
>> Brian
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
>> Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:44:10 +0000 (UTC)
>> 
>> Alan,
>> You are right, the mechanical seal is the easiest way to go.  My Perry thrusters had simple spring loaded seals with a sealed cavity behind the mechanical seal.   You will be oil filled, so the seal will have the back up oil.
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 1:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hank,
>> yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attaching
>> on to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & are
>> intending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I also
>> need an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.
>> I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.
>> I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea
>> & thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaft
>> the lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanical
>> seal would eliminate that precision process.
>> Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they have
>> done the research on seals & have the experience.
>> Cheers Alan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>> On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,
>> You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting.  The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator.  I know you already though of this.  I think the DW's work like that.
>> If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal.  Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hi Hank, thanks.
>> yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some advice
>> on an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).
>> Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new 
>> compensating oil I bought. 
>> I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the 
>> motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.
>> I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clamped
>> to one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I have
>> a plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimental
>> purposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fitting
>> when I mount it on the sub.
>> Alan
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>> On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,
>> That is great! well done..  What type of mechanical seal will you use?  Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal?  
>> Hank 
>> 
>> 
>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
>> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
>> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
>> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
>> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
>> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
>> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
>> above average.
>> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
>> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
>> on a bigger prop.
>> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
>> another housing with a mechanical seal.
>> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
>> some reason. Couldn't change them. 
>> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
>> Alan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct  4 17:12:06 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 14:12:06 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <6276c.547e1834.45249435@aol.com>
References: <6276c.547e1834.45249435@aol.com>
Message-ID: <CAPsmMeD8=kecgpjWKqGK17rAu3iuEBAkjs3LW5mAyrKod4fOPw@mail.gmail.com>

thank you, I already buy the drawing of K-250. I have some questions and
I'd love to go see a person who possesses a k-250 near me. I am at 45
minutes from the border of New Hamphire and Vermont. I have not
participated in the psubs club events yet.

Philippe

2016-10-03 22:12 GMT-07:00 via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org>:

> Good evening, Philippe,
> Glad to know you are there.  Did you happen to make it to New York when
> several of the guys were diving in July of this year?  I heartily
> endorse Alan's suggestion of climbing through a K250 and a K350 as well
> before you decide what to build.  There is a lot of difference in the
> passenger position.
>
> Eric,
> Sorry I didn't get to add my welcome earlier.  Where are you located?
> Jim
>
> In a message dated 10/3/2016 7:53:34 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org writes:
>
> Welcome along Philipe.
> There is a lot of experience in the group with K250s.
> There are a few across the border, & it would be great if you
> could climb on board one before you started, if you haven't
> already.
> All the best.
> Alan
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On 4/10/2016, at 10:56 am, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >
> > Hi !
> >
> > I am a new guy too from 3-4 month! Nice to meet you. Im from Qu?bec
> Canada . I'm planning to build k-250.
> > Lot of questions soon!
> >
> > Philippe
> >
> > Envoy? de mon iPhone
> >
> >> Le 2 oct. 2016 ? 20:06, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> a ?crit :
> >>
> >> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I
> can.
> >>
> >> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next
> couple of years.
> >>
> >> Looking forward to meeting you all.
> >>
> >> -Eric
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct  4 21:10:15 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:10:15 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <CAPsmMeD8=kecgpjWKqGK17rAu3iuEBAkjs3LW5mAyrKod4fOPw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <6276c.547e1834.45249435@aol.com>
 <CAPsmMeD8=kecgpjWKqGK17rAu3iuEBAkjs3LW5mAyrKod4fOPw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAOGJjnKQSgj0jESAx9qHF_a5o=kwLMmf_8y+=03W9WNGXO9x_A@mail.gmail.com>

Philippe, if there is any chance that you could hike it down to zip 33036
between Oct. 17 ? 22 you can have a chance to dive a fully functional (and
highly modified) K-250 submersible. Any other time, you can come by and
check Snoopy out at zip 16301. ~ Douglas S.

On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 5:12 PM, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

>
> thank you, I already buy the drawing of K-250. I have some questions and
> I'd love to go see a person who possesses a k-250 near me. I am at 45
> minutes from the border of New Hamphire and Vermont. I have not
> participated in the psubs club events yet.
>
> Philippe
>
> 2016-10-03 22:12 GMT-07:00 via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>:
>
>> Good evening, Philippe,
>> Glad to know you are there.  Did you happen to make it to New York when
>> several of the guys were diving in July of this year?  I heartily
>> endorse Alan's suggestion of climbing through a K250 and a K350 as well
>> before you decide what to build.  There is a lot of difference in the
>> passenger position.
>>
>> Eric,
>> Sorry I didn't get to add my welcome earlier.  Where are you located?
>> Jim
>>
>> In a message dated 10/3/2016 7:53:34 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org writes:
>>
>> Welcome along Philipe.
>> There is a lot of experience in the group with K250s.
>> There are a few across the border, & it would be great if you
>> could climb on board one before you started, if you haven't
>> already.
>> All the best.
>> Alan
>>
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> > On 4/10/2016, at 10:56 am, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> >
>> > Hi !
>> >
>> > I am a new guy too from 3-4 month! Nice to meet you. Im from Qu?bec
>> Canada . I'm planning to build k-250.
>> > Lot of questions soon!
>> >
>> > Philippe
>> >
>> > Envoy? de mon iPhone
>> >
>> >> Le 2 oct. 2016 ? 20:06, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> a ?crit :
>> >>
>> >> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as
>> I can.
>> >>
>> >> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next
>> couple of years.
>> >>
>> >> Looking forward to meeting you all.
>> >>
>> >> -Eric
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct  4 23:25:09 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 16:25:09 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <0E42A514-CFE6-445C-BB8A-9FDBEF34C62B@yahoo.com>
References: <20161003183819.77BB48D6@m0087792.ppops.net>
 <CB80C8CE-D050-4940-A5E9-3A4FD57CB528@yahoo.com>
 <693414109.5170981.1475583407189@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0E42A514-CFE6-445C-BB8A-9FDBEF34C62B@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <23C7A477-E0DC-490C-9F0F-BD851926CE28@yahoo.com>

Banging my head against a wall as usual.
No the local seal expert doesn't have a balanced seal that fits a 10mm shaft.
Nearest is 18mm. This will cost around N.Z. $200-. The motor only cost $60-.
The standard unbalanced mechanical seal ($60-) he doesn't recommend for
the pressure at 500ft, even though the thruster is oil compensated.
I may stick with my 2 lip seals.
The upside is It made me think about attaching an 18mm stainless shaft over
the motors 10mm shaft, which may be an easier option than replacing the shaft
right through the motor.  
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 5/10/2016, at 2:02 am, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hank,
> I did a bit more Googling on their site, & apart from more complicated systems
> for large pumps, they use a balanced mechanical seal for submersible fluid
> compensated pumps. I have sent an email off to a local agent, so I could come 
> up with a more specific answer.
> Surely they will have one for a 10mm shaft??
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 5/10/2016, at 1:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,
>> There is a picture of the mechanical seal  if you scroll down on the site you provided us.  It looks like a typical ceramic spring seal, same as what was in my Perry thrusters.  I think the K subs used the same thing.
>> It might be a trick finding a 10 mm though.
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 2:04 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> I am not sure Brian.
>> I am thinking that a balanced mechanical seal would be necessary if I went
>> with a mechanical seal. Even though the motor is compensated it would
>> have more pressure pushing the faces together at depth. 
>> Every ROV  & submarine thruster seems to have a different seal.
>> I might try & contact this submersible pump manufacturer & see what they use.
>> https://www.flowserve.com/sites/default/files/2016-07/fpd-1362-ea4.pdf
>> They have been in the business of manufacturing submersible pumps for 50
>> years.
>> Their headquarters are in Hamburg. Carsten, if you know them I am wanting advice
>> for a mechanical seal for a pressure compensated thruster with a 10mm shaft 
>> rotating at 1500 rpm when under load.
>> Thanks
>> Regards Alan
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On 4/10/2016, at 2:38 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I thought the ceramic seals were the way to go on those motors.
>>>  
>>> Brian
>>> 
>>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>>> 
>>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
>>> Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:44:10 +0000 (UTC)
>>> 
>>> Alan,
>>> You are right, the mechanical seal is the easiest way to go.  My Perry thrusters had simple spring loaded seals with a sealed cavity behind the mechanical seal.   You will be oil filled, so the seal will have the back up oil.
>>> Hank
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 1:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hank,
>>> yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attaching
>>> on to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & are
>>> intending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I also
>>> need an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.
>>> I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.
>>> I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea
>>> & thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaft
>>> the lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanical
>>> seal would eliminate that precision process.
>>> Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they have
>>> done the research on seals & have the experience.
>>> Cheers Alan
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>> On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Alan,
>>> You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting.  The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator.  I know you already though of this.  I think the DW's work like that.
>>> If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal.  Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.
>>> Hank
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi Hank, thanks.
>>> yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some advice
>>> on an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).
>>> Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new 
>>> compensating oil I bought. 
>>> I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the 
>>> motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.
>>> I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clamped
>>> to one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I have
>>> a plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimental
>>> purposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fitting
>>> when I mount it on the sub.
>>> Alan
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>> On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Alan,
>>> That is great! well done..  What type of mechanical seal will you use?  Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal?  
>>> Hank 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
>>> This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
>>> sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
>>> I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
>>> oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
>>> The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
>>> performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
>>> above average.
>>> The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
>>> so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
>>> on a bigger prop.
>>> Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
>>> another housing with a mechanical seal.
>>> Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
>>> some reason. Couldn't change them. 
>>> http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
>>> Alan
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
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> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct  5 00:46:36 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2016 21:46:36 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Ball turning tool
Message-ID: <20161004214636.5A2AFEF6@m0087793.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct  5 01:45:56 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 18:45:56 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Ball turning tool
In-Reply-To: <20161004214636.5A2AFEF6@m0087793.ppops.net>
References: <20161004214636.5A2AFEF6@m0087793.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <48DAD7B8-1A66-4F70-9435-BFC48601D4B7@yahoo.com>

Well done Brian, looks good.
I will put in an order for a p?tanque set.
Alan 

Sent from my iPad

> On 5/10/2016, at 5:46 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi All,
>                I finished my ball turning tool for my lathe !   haven't tried it yet .  some pics:
>  
>  
>  
> Brian
> <IMG_1306.JPG>
> <IMG_1307.JPG>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct  5 07:47:31 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 11:47:31 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Ball turning tool
In-Reply-To: <48DAD7B8-1A66-4F70-9435-BFC48601D4B7@yahoo.com>
References: <20161004214636.5A2AFEF6@m0087793.ppops.net>
 <48DAD7B8-1A66-4F70-9435-BFC48601D4B7@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1349451546.5714790.1475668051289@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,Pretty nifty alright!Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 11:46 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Well done Brian, looks good.I will put in an order for a p?tanque set.Alan?

Sent from my iPad
On 5/10/2016, at 5:46 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Hi All,?????????????? I finished my ball turning tool for my lathe !?? haven't tried it yet .? some pics:???Brian

<IMG_1306.JPG>

<IMG_1307.JPG>

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http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct  5 07:54:40 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 11:54:40 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <23C7A477-E0DC-490C-9F0F-BD851926CE28@yahoo.com>
References: <20161003183819.77BB48D6@m0087792.ppops.net>
 <CB80C8CE-D050-4940-A5E9-3A4FD57CB528@yahoo.com>
 <693414109.5170981.1475583407189@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0E42A514-CFE6-445C-BB8A-9FDBEF34C62B@yahoo.com>
 <23C7A477-E0DC-490C-9F0F-BD851926CE28@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <2015889084.297092.1475668480087@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,Go to?eBay?and look up 10mm mechanical seals.. ?There are lots for 3 dollars. I am not sure what "balanced seal" means. ?I assume the fact that the two halves of the seal are spring loaded makes it balanced, kinda sorta. ?It is like my ?truck has a 6 speed transmission, 6th gear is the torque converter locking up,lol.
Trying to slip a larger shaft over and having it run true with such a small bore. ?I would not attempt that, unless you have a teeny tiny boring tool.Personally, I would use the speedy?sleeve Alec mentioned and use a higher pressure rated lip seal.
 

    On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 9:25 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Banging my head against a wall as usual.No the local seal expert doesn't have a balanced seal that fits a 10mm shaft.Nearest is 18mm. This will cost around N.Z. $200-. The motor only cost $60-.The standard unbalanced mechanical seal ($60-) he doesn't recommend forthe pressure at 500ft, even though the thruster is oil compensated.I may stick with my 2 lip seals.The upside is It made me think about attaching an 18mm stainless shaft overthe motors 10mm shaft, which may be an easier option than replacing the shaftright through the motor. ?Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 5/10/2016, at 2:02 am, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:



Hank,I did a bit more Googling on their site, & apart from more complicated systemsfor large pumps, they use a balanced mechanical seal for submersible fluidcompensated pumps. I have sent an email off to a local agent, so I could come?up with a more specific answer.Surely they will have one for a 10mm shaft??Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 5/10/2016, at 1:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,There is a picture of the mechanical seal ?if you scroll down on the site you provided us. ?It looks like a typical ceramic spring seal, same as what was in my Perry thrusters. ?I think the K subs used the same thing.It might be a trick finding a 10 mm though.Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 2:04 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 I am not sure Brian.I am thinking that a balanced mechanical seal would be necessary if I wentwith a mechanical seal. Even though the motor is compensated it wouldhave more pressure pushing the faces together at depth.?Every ROV ?& submarine thruster seems to have a different seal.I might try & contact this submersible pump manufacturer & see what they use.https://www.flowserve.com/sites/default/files/2016-07/fpd-1362-ea4.pdfThey have been in the business of manufacturing submersible pumps for 50years.Their headquarters are in Hamburg. Carsten, if you know them I am wanting advicefor a mechanical seal for a pressure compensated thruster with a 10mm shaft?rotating at 1500 rpm when under load.ThanksRegards Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 4/10/2016, at 2:38 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


I thought the ceramic seals were the way to go on those motors.?Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:44:10 +0000 (UTC)

Alan,You are right, the mechanical seal is the easiest way to go. ?My Perry thrusters had simple spring loaded seals with a sealed cavity behind the mechanical seal. ? You will be oil?filled, so the seal will have the back up oil.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 1:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attachingon to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & areintending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I alsoneed an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea& thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaftthe lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanicalseal would eliminate that precision process.Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they havedone the research on seals & have the experience.Cheers Alan
Sent from my iPad
On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting. ?The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator. ?I know you?already though of this. ?I think the DW's work like that.If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal. ?Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi Hank, thanks.yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some adviceon an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new?compensating oil I bought.?I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the?motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clampedto one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I havea plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimentalpurposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fittingwhen I mount it on the sub.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,That is great! well done.. ?What type of mechanical seal will you use? ?Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal? ?Hank? 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
above average.
The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
on a bigger prop.
Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
another housing with a mechanical seal.
Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
some reason. Couldn't change them. 
 http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
Alan

Sent from my iPad
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http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct  5 19:47:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2016 23:47:38 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
In-Reply-To: <2015889084.297092.1475668480087@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161003183819.77BB48D6@m0087792.ppops.net>
 <CB80C8CE-D050-4940-A5E9-3A4FD57CB528@yahoo.com>
 <693414109.5170981.1475583407189@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0E42A514-CFE6-445C-BB8A-9FDBEF34C62B@yahoo.com>
 <23C7A477-E0DC-490C-9F0F-BD851926CE28@yahoo.com>
 <2015889084.297092.1475668480087@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1524141345.5132057.1475711258777@mail.yahoo.com>

Hank,I am going to need to spend a couple of days reading all the literature I have & thinking this one through. The guy I contacted, who has supplied seals for Hugh's sub,is now suggesting this as an alternative.http://vulcan-eng.com/type-1724However he was talking about it taking the pressure at 500ft,which doesn't make sense seeing the thruster is oil compensated.?? The balanced seal design compensates for higher internal pressureson the seal, to reduce friction; but again if the housing is compensatedI can't see why a normal mechanical seal won't do.Thanks for the advice on slipping the larger shaft on. I was intendingto drill it in?the lathe?(10mm) & hopefully get a press fit using the right drill. The sleeve would only be an inch long, so there is the possibilityof making up a small boring tool.There is no flex on the join as the 18 mm section is supported nearbywith a bearing, & the 10mm section also goes through a bearing closeto the join.Alan



      From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Thursday, October 6, 2016 12:54 AM
 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
   
Alan,Go to?eBay?and look up 10mm mechanical seals.. ?There are lots for 3 dollars. I am not sure what "balanced seal" means. ?I assume the fact that the two halves of the seal are spring loaded makes it balanced, kinda sorta. ?It is like my ?truck has a 6 speed transmission, 6th gear is the torque converter locking up,lol.
Trying to slip a larger shaft over and having it run true with such a small bore. ?I would not attempt that, unless you have a teeny tiny boring tool.Personally, I would use the speedy?sleeve Alec mentioned and use a higher pressure rated lip seal.
 

    On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 9:25 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Banging my head against a wall as usual.No the local seal expert doesn't have a balanced seal that fits a 10mm shaft.Nearest is 18mm. This will cost around N.Z. $200-. The motor only cost $60-.The standard unbalanced mechanical seal ($60-) he doesn't recommend forthe pressure at 500ft, even though the thruster is oil compensated.I may stick with my 2 lip seals.The upside is It made me think about attaching an 18mm stainless shaft overthe motors 10mm shaft, which may be an easier option than replacing the shaftright through the motor. ?Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 5/10/2016, at 2:02 am, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:



Hank,I did a bit more Googling on their site, & apart from more complicated systemsfor large pumps, they use a balanced mechanical seal for submersible fluidcompensated pumps. I have sent an email off to a local agent, so I could come?up with a more specific answer.Surely they will have one for a 10mm shaft??Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 5/10/2016, at 1:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,There is a picture of the mechanical seal ?if you scroll down on the site you provided us. ?It looks like a typical ceramic spring seal, same as what was in my Perry thrusters. ?I think the K subs used the same thing.It might be a trick finding a 10 mm though.Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 4, 2016 2:04 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 I am not sure Brian.I am thinking that a balanced mechanical seal would be necessary if I wentwith a mechanical seal. Even though the motor is compensated it wouldhave more pressure pushing the faces together at depth.?Every ROV ?& submarine thruster seems to have a different seal.I might try & contact this submersible pump manufacturer & see what they use.https://www.flowserve.com/sites/default/files/2016-07/fpd-1362-ea4.pdfThey have been in the business of manufacturing submersible pumps for 50years.Their headquarters are in Hamburg. Carsten, if you know them I am wanting advicefor a mechanical seal for a pressure compensated thruster with a 10mm shaft?rotating at 1500 rpm when under load.ThanksRegards Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 4/10/2016, at 2:38 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


I thought the ceramic seals were the way to go on those motors.?Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Brushless Thruster
Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 22:44:10 +0000 (UTC)

Alan,You are right, the mechanical seal is the easiest way to go. ?My Perry thrusters had simple spring loaded seals with a sealed cavity behind the mechanical seal. ? You will be oil?filled, so the seal will have the back up oil.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 1:27 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,yes I like the idea of going straight to the penetrator with the clear tube attachingon to a barbed fitting. I want to put a 4psi overpressure in the system & areintending to do this with compressed air; so need to tee in an air line. I alsoneed an oil filling point, however the air connection point could double for this.I like the clear tube as it is a visual indication of the oil level.I have 2 lip seals at the moment. Hugh wasn't too impressed with that idea& thought I should go with a mechanical seal. From what I have read, the shaftthe lip seal runs on needs to be plunge ground to a certain finish, & a mechanicalseal would eliminate that precision process.Also I look at what other large manufacturers have done & figure they havedone the research on seals & have the experience.Cheers Alan
Sent from my iPad
On 4/10/2016, at 12:37 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,You can make up a pretty simple penetrator for the wires, or why not leave the wires the way they are in the clear tube and run the tube to a penetrator on the sub that is made from a barbed fitting. ?The clear tube can be oil filled and act as your compensator. ?I know you?already though of this. ?I think the DW's work like that.If you are oil filled, why the mechanical seal. ?Just go with a higher pressure rated lip seal.Hank 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 3:40 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi Hank, thanks.yes am intending on getting that type of seal, but I will try & get some adviceon an appropriate seal for the viscosity & type of oil I am using (Morlina S2 Bl 10).Must be a bit barmy because I was getting quite excited about the new?compensating oil I bought.?I haven't quite decided how I am going to terminate the wires coming out of the?motor. At present I have the wires running through a clear hose up to a manifold.I say manifold but it is a modified brass T plumbing fitting. The hose is hose clampedto one end & the wires are silicone sealed coming out the other end. On the T I havea plug that I can remove to fill the tube & thruster with oil. This is okay for experimentalpurposes but will need to add pressure to the system & a through hull fittingwhen I mount it on the sub.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 3/10/2016, at 9:28 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,That is great! well done.. ?What type of mechanical seal will you use? ?Are you planning a spring loaded pump seal? ?Hank? 

    On Monday, October 3, 2016 2:07 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just did a pool test of my latest brushless thruster.
This thruster uses a 60kv (revs per Volt) 6374 (dimensions in mm) brushless
sensored outrunner motor. The propeller was a 3 bladed 7&1/4" x 4" with no kort nozzle.
I was getting 30kg (66lb) thrust from 30 amps off 52 volts (1560W) with the thruster
oil filled. This seems comparable to what Cliff was getting from his Minnkota 101.
The difference is this is a much smaller unit. I have been keeping a file on
performance statistics of commercial thrusters & trolling motors & this is slightly 
above average.
The manufacturer told me not to run the motor more than 40 amps continuosly,
so I am being conservative with the 30 amp draw. I could bump it up by putting
on a bigger prop.
Next step is to use it as a boat motor & notch up 100 or so hours, then build
another housing with a mechanical seal.
Added a couple of photos to the project page, but they loaded upside down for
some reason. Couldn't change them. 
 http://www.psubs.org/projects/1235435392/brushlessthruster/
Alan

Sent from my iPad
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http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct  6 02:07:00 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Ovidiu Anghelidi via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2016 06:07:00 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Consulting
References: <6967004.42776.1475734020191.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6967004.42776.1475734020191@mail.yahoo.com>

Hello,
I have started the design of a personal small submersible after many months of study but there are still many issues that I need help with. I am looking for someone to provide consulting on items like: 
1. safety issues (how to implement the weight drop or ballast tanks drop in case of an emergency) 
2. required engine for a specific hull size3. how to link the propeller to engine4. how to connect the pipes5. where to put the valves 

The psubs web site is great. There is a ton of information in there. I also find the list of projects from members very helpful in regards to specifications. 

I need a couple of paid hours. We can chat over Skype. If interested please send me an email to raidvvan at yahoo.com? 

Thank you.
Best Regards,Ovidiu
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct  6 03:52:02 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2016 07:52:02 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Consulting
In-Reply-To: <6967004.42776.1475734020191@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <6967004.42776.1475734020191.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <6967004.42776.1475734020191@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <223060323.5251938.1475740322849@mail.yahoo.com>

Welcome Ovidiu.If you are living in Europe (your name is Romanian?) you may want to contact Emile in the Netherlands.http://www.airesearch.nl/index.htmHe has a low key tourist venture; so you can go in his 3 personsubmarine (for a price) & see everything first hand. He has builtseveral subs & is also the cheapest source of acrylic domes that I know of.He also makes a number of other submarine parts.?? Carsten, in Rostock, Germany?has a 70 ton sub & a very small1 person sub. He is a submarine certifier for Swiss Lloyds specializingin small submarines, so can cover all safety issues.It would be good to show them your plans if either of them are willingto look at them.If you don't have any luck with them, or you don't want to contact them,then let us know & we will try & answer your questions.All the best with the project.Alan




      From: Ovidiu Anghelidi via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: "personal_submersibles at psubs.org" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Thursday, October 6, 2016 7:07 PM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Consulting
   
Hello,
I have started the design of a personal small submersible after many months of study but there are still many issues that I need help with. I am looking for someone to provide consulting on items like: 
1. safety issues (how to implement the weight drop or ballast tanks drop in case of an emergency) 
2. required engine for a specific hull size3. how to link the propeller to engine4. how to connect the pipes5. where to put the valves 

The psubs web site is great. There is a ton of information in there. I also find the list of projects from members very helpful in regards to specifications. 

I need a couple of paid hours. We can chat over Skype. If interested please send me an email to raidvvan at yahoo.com? 

Thank you.
Best Regards,Ovidiu

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct  6 08:53:27 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 06 Oct 2016 07:53:27 -0500
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] =?utf-8?q?Consulting?=
In-Reply-To: <6967004.42776.1475734020191@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <6967004.42776.1475734020191.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <6967004.42776.1475734020191@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20161006125328.28239.qmail@server268.com>

Ovidiu,

I found the K-350 blue prints very helpful to answer a lot of questions like that. It may be worth the money to buy a set. I believe they are $350USD. When I was doing my first build a combination of blue prints, pictures of other peoples submarines, and seeing other submarines in person were the most helpful.

Thank you,
Scott Waters

>  -------Original Message-------
>  From: Ovidiu Anghelidi via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>  To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>  Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Consulting
>  Sent: Oct 06 '16 01:13
>  
>  Hello,
>  
>  I have started the design of a personal small submersible after many
>  months of study but there are still many issues that I need help with.
>  I am looking for someone to provide consulting on items like:
>  
>  1. safety issues (how to implement the weight drop or ballast tanks
>  drop in case of an emergency)
>  
>  2. required engine for a specific hull size
>  3. how to link the propeller to engine
>  4. how to connect the pipes
>  5. where to put the valves
>  
>  The psubs web site is great. There is a ton of information in there. I
>  also find the list of projects from members very helpful in regards to
>  specifications.
>  
>  I need a couple of paid hours. We can chat over Skype. If interested
>  please send me an email to raidvvan at yahoo.com
>  
>  Thank you.
>  
>  Best Regards,
>  Ovidiu
>  
>  -------------------------
>  _______________________________________________
>  Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>  Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>  http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>  

From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct  6 10:53:42 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2016 10:53:42 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <CAOGJjnKQSgj0jESAx9qHF_a5o=kwLMmf_8y+=03W9WNGXO9x_A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <6276c.547e1834.45249435@aol.com>
 <CAPsmMeD8=kecgpjWKqGK17rAu3iuEBAkjs3LW5mAyrKod4fOPw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAOGJjnKQSgj0jESAx9qHF_a5o=kwLMmf_8y+=03W9WNGXO9x_A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A18266B4-6C3A-48BB-9937-968758858A33@gmail.com>

Douglas, 

Yes! I can hike it down to islamorada FL. I can be there between 20 october 2016 pm to 22 october. So can you confim with me at phelop at gmail.com and verify that its not a dream? 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 4, 2016, at 9:10 PM, Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Philippe, if there is any chance that you could hike it down to zip 33036 between Oct. 17 ? 22 you can have a chance to dive a fully functional (and highly modified) K-250 submersible. Any other time, you can come by and check Snoopy out at zip 16301. ~ Douglas S. 
> 
>> On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 5:12 PM, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> thank you,
>> 
>> I already buy the drawing of K-250. I have some questions and I'd love to go see a person who possesses a k-250 near me. I am at 45 minutes from the border of New Hamphire and Vermont. I have not participated in the psubs club events yet.
>> 
>> Philippe
>> 
>> 2016-10-03 22:12 GMT-07:00 via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>:
>>> Good evening, Philippe,
>>> Glad to know you are there.  Did you happen to make it to New York when several of the guys were diving in July of this year?  I heartily endorse Alan's suggestion of climbing through a K250 and a K350 as well before you decide what to build.  There is a lot of difference in the passenger position.
>>>  
>>> Eric,
>>> Sorry I didn't get to add my welcome earlier.  Where are you located?
>>> Jim
>>>  
>>> In a message dated 10/3/2016 7:53:34 P.M. Central Daylight Time, personal_submersibles at psubs.org writes:
>>> Welcome along Philipe.
>>> There is a lot of experience in the group with K250s.
>>> There are a few across the border, & it would be great if you
>>> could climb on board one before you started, if you haven't
>>> already.
>>> All the best.
>>> Alan
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>> > On 4/10/2016, at 10:56 am, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> > 
>>> > Hi ! 
>>> > 
>>> > I am a new guy too from 3-4 month! Nice to meet you. Im from Qu?bec Canada . I'm planning to build k-250. 
>>> > Lot of questions soon! 
>>> > 
>>> > Philippe 
>>> > 
>>> > Envoy? de mon iPhone
>>> > 
>>> >> Le 2 oct. 2016 ? 20:06, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> a ?crit :
>>> >> 
>>> >> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can. 
>>> >> 
>>> >> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years. 
>>> >> 
>>> >> Looking forward to meeting you all. 
>>> >> 
>>> >> -Eric
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> > 
>>> > _______________________________________________
>>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct  6 11:56:19 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2016 08:56:19 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
Message-ID: <20161006085619.5A2A61D7@m0087793.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct  6 20:36:36 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2016 20:36:36 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <20161006085619.5A2A61D7@m0087793.ppops.net>
References: <20161006085619.5A2A61D7@m0087793.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <CAOGJjnJv+9iDn79fkV3fno0bBXfJQ=YbkRGDcJXEVOcjEfsRFw@mail.gmail.com>

Philippe, get out of town (literally!). If you could make it down that
would be awesome and you can have a chance to see how you feel about a
K-250. I'll email you later this evening at provided email address with
more details.

Brian, bad. ~ Doug

On Thu, Oct 6, 2016 at 11:56 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Doug,
>                 What's the Hurricane situation?
>
> Brian
>
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>
> From: Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
> Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2016 10:53:42 -0400
>
> Douglas,
>
> Yes! I can hike it down to islamorada FL. I can be there between 20
> october 2016 pm to 22 october. So can you confim with me at
> phelop at gmail.com and verify that its not a dream?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 4, 2016, at 9:10 PM, Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Philippe, if there is any chance that you could hike it down to zip 33036
> between Oct. 17 ? 22 you can have a chance to dive a fully functional (and
> highly modified) K-250 submersible. Any other time, you can come by and
> check Snoopy out at zip 16301. ~ Douglas S.
>
> On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 5:12 PM, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles
> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> thank you, I already buy the drawing of K-250. I have some questions and
> I'd love to go see a person who possesses a k-250 near me. I am at 45
> minutes from the border of New Hamphire and Vermont. I have not
> participated in the psubs club events yet.
>
> Philippe
>
> 2016-10-03 22:12 GMT-07:00 via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>:
>
> Good evening, Philippe,
> Glad to know you are there.  Did you happen to make it to New York when
> several of the guys were diving in July of this year?  I heartily
> endorse Alan's suggestion of climbing through a K250 and a K350 as well
> before you decide what to build.  There is a lot of difference in the
> passenger position.
>
> Eric,
> Sorry I didn't get to add my welcome earlier.  Where are you located?
> Jim
>
> In a message dated 10/3/2016 7:53:34 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org writes:
>
> Welcome along Philipe.
> There is a lot of experience in the group with K250s.
> There are a few across the border, & it would be great if you
> could climb on board one before you started, if you haven't
> already.
> All the best.
> Alan
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> > On 4/10/2016, at 10:56 am, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >
> > Hi !
> >
> > I am a new guy too from 3-4 month! Nice to meet you. Im from Qu?bec
> Canada . I'm planning to build k-250.
> > Lot of questions soon!
> >
> > Philippe
> >
> > Envoy? de mon iPhone
> >
> >> Le 2 oct. 2016 ? 20:06, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> a ?crit :
> >>
> >> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I
> can.
> >>
> >> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next
> couple of years.
> >>
> >> Looking forward to meeting you all.
> >>
> >> -Eric
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles
> mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> <http:///eonapps/ft/wm/page/compose?send_to=Personal_Submersibles%40psubs.org>
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct  6 20:59:39 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2016 20:59:39 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
In-Reply-To: <CAOGJjnJv+9iDn79fkV3fno0bBXfJQ=YbkRGDcJXEVOcjEfsRFw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20161006085619.5A2A61D7@m0087793.ppops.net>
 <CAOGJjnJv+9iDn79fkV3fno0bBXfJQ=YbkRGDcJXEVOcjEfsRFw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <02AA27DE-457A-4A29-AC04-36CB63E42A28@gmail.com>

Nice ! 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 6, 2016, at 8:36 PM, Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Philippe, get out of town (literally!). If you could make it down that would be awesome and you can have a chance to see how you feel about a K-250. I'll email you later this evening at provided email address with more details. 
> 
> Brian, bad. ~ Doug 
> 
>> On Thu, Oct 6, 2016 at 11:56 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Doug,
>>                 What's the Hurricane situation?
>>  
>> Brian
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
>> Date: Thu, 6 Oct 2016 10:53:42 -0400
>> 
>> Douglas, 
>> 
>> Yes! I can hike it down to islamorada FL. I can be there between 20 october 2016 pm to 22 october. So can you confim with me at phelop at gmail.com and verify that its not a dream? 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Oct 4, 2016, at 9:10 PM, Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Philippe, if there is any chance that you could hike it down to zip 33036 between Oct. 17 ? 22 you can have a chance to dive a fully functional (and highly modified) K-250 submersible. Any other time, you can come by and check Snoopy out at zip 16301. ~ Douglas S. 
>> 
>> On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 5:12 PM, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> thank you,
>> 
>> I already buy the drawing of K-250. I have some questions and I'd love to go see a person who possesses a k-250 near me. I am at 45 minutes from the border of New Hamphire and Vermont. I have not participated in the psubs club events yet.
>> 
>> Philippe
>> 
>> 2016-10-03 22:12 GMT-07:00 via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>:
>> Good evening, Philippe,
>> Glad to know you are there.  Did you happen to make it to New York when several of the guys were diving in July of this year?  I heartily endorse Alan's suggestion of climbing through a K250 and a K350 as well before you decide what to build.  There is a lot of difference in the passenger position.
>>  
>> Eric,
>> Sorry I didn't get to add my welcome earlier.  Where are you located?
>> Jim
>>  
>> In a message dated 10/3/2016 7:53:34 P.M. Central Daylight Time, personal_submersibles at psubs.org writes:
>> Welcome along Philipe.
>> There is a lot of experience in the group with K250s.
>> There are a few across the border, & it would be great if you
>> could climb on board one before you started, if you haven't
>> already.
>> All the best.
>> Alan
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>> > On 4/10/2016, at 10:56 am, Philippe Robert via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> > 
>> > Hi ! 
>> > 
>> > I am a new guy too from 3-4 month! Nice to meet you. Im from Qu?bec Canada . I'm planning to build k-250. 
>> > Lot of questions soon! 
>> > 
>> > Philippe 
>> > 
>> > Envoy? de mon iPhone
>> > 
>> >> Le 2 oct. 2016 ? 20:06, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> a ?crit :
>> >> 
>> >> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I can. 
>> >> 
>> >> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next couple of years. 
>> >> 
>> >> Looking forward to meeting you all. 
>> >> 
>> >> -Eric
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> >> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> >> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> > 
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct  7 05:22:14 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Ovidiu Anghelidi via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2016 09:22:14 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Consulting
References: <276935151.688729.1475832134593.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <276935151.688729.1475832134593@mail.yahoo.com>


Hello,

Alan: Thank you for the references. I will speak with Emile. He does have some parts I need. Maybe I'll speak with Carsten in the final phase of the design.

Scott: I will get the plans. 

Thanks a lot guys,
Ovidiu

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct  7 10:51:04 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 7 Oct 2016 10:51:04 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 40, Issue 6
In-Reply-To: <mailman.460.1475460625.850.personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
References: <mailman.460.1475460625.850.personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Message-ID: <CAKrdud5gK3_s0hsm_+R+Spz2VpN4BFNr_=krcVTEAywXwHZcoA@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks everyone, I am from Shipshewana, in northern Indiana USA.
Thanks for the kind welcome.

I am serious, but the time is not yet right so I figure I will learn
everything I can between now and whenever the financial ability comes for
the project. And I am willing to slowly work on a project over several
years as I am not new to building a vehicle that your life depends on. I
rebuilt/repaired/updated two racing airplanes over the past few years and
while it isn't as dangerous to have a failure in an airplane as a
submarine, a similar mentality is there. Either it is perfect, or it
doesn't fly.

But I sold the airplanes and now I am interested in submarines. The allure
of exploring the depths is something I have always wanted to do. So maybe
in a while I will get to. :)

-Eric

On Sun, Oct 2, 2016 at 10:10 PM, via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to
>         personal_submersibles at psubs.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>         personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>         personal_submersibles-owner at psubs.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Personal_Submersibles digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: Fw: motor (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
>    2. New guy. (Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles)
>    3. Re: New guy. (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
>    4. Re: New guy. (Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 11:37:49 -0700
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: personal_submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw: motor
> Message-ID:
>         <1475433469.89035.YahooMailMobile at web125401.mail.ne1.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Oops I meant Brian
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 20:06:47 -0400
> From: Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: personal_submersibles at psubs.org
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
> Message-ID:
>         <CAKrdud75ECayr_ewJGS6eZ-9B95i5fnxCSWPqxU8q4smPc=ppw@
> mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I
> can.
>
> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next
> couple of years.
>
> Looking forward to meeting you all.
>
> -Eric
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2016 00:30:01 +0000 (UTC)
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
> Message-ID: <997858406.4148019.1475454601220 at mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Hello Eric,Welcome?aboard, where are you from?Hank
>
>     On Sunday, October 2, 2016 6:07 PM, Bear Nyhof via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
>  Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I
> can.?
> I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next
> couple of years.?
> Looking forward to meeting you all.?
> -Eric
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2016 22:10:46 -0400
> From: Douglas Suhr via Personal_Submersibles
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] New guy.
> Message-ID:
>         <CAOGJjnLe1BpmERxrw1wwy8ODGCUSSv920sf7TLjMPuF-9PWyCg at mail.
> gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> Welcome to PSUBS Eric! If you're serious about building a submersible,
> you've definitely found a valuable resource here. I'm fairly new myself,
> but some of these guys have been at it a while and can really help you get
> your project off the ground. Good luck! ~ Douglas S.
>
> On Sun, Oct 2, 2016 at 8:30 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> > Hello Eric,
> > Welcome aboard, where are you from?
> > Hank
> >
> >
> > On Sunday, October 2, 2016 6:07 PM, Bear Nyhof via Personal_Submersibles
> <
> > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi everyone, I am new here and looking forward to learning as much as I
> > can.
> >
> > I hope I get the opportunity to build a submarine sometime in the next
> > couple of years.
> >
> > Looking forward to meeting you all.
> >
> > -Eric
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> >
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>
> ------------------------------
>
> Subject: Digest Footer
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> End of Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 40, Issue 6
> ****************************************************
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  8 07:04:28 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 8 Oct 2016 11:04:28 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi James,Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't remember if you mentioned an air motor. ? ?A simple air motor ? with a constant air feed could work. ?The motor and spool would have to be at the surface on or under the buoy. ?I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work. ?The motor would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the spindle for the spool. ?If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor, the line ?could be pulled out against that pressure. ?The pressure it build up( acting as a pump) ?would vent out the regulator. ?The sub could pull the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the line. ?I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded. ?A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.Hank?
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct  8 07:17:15 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 8 Oct 2016 11:17:15 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <DM3PR1201MB10215E8E4515385F7408B99FDFD90@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB10215E8E4515385F7408B99FDFD90@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <2027287312.475737.1475925435222@mail.yahoo.com>

Here is an air motor with potential, it is a radial piston motor. ?This motor should hold back air pressure without leaking.Hank

     On Saturday, October 8, 2016 5:13 AM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  javascript:; 



   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  9 22:30:06 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 9 Oct 2016 19:30:06 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] making progress
Message-ID: <20161009193006.5A2FA351@m0087796.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  9 23:46:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2016 03:46:38 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] making progress
In-Reply-To: <20161009193006.5A2FA351@m0087796.ppops.net>
References: <20161009193006.5A2FA351@m0087796.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1501243632.1075552.1476071198480@mail.yahoo.com>

Looks good Brian, nice tool.When I test, I always pull a vacuum to ensure there is no hatch leak and it ensures there are no other leaks. ?When I tested my escape pod there was nothing holding the hatch but vacuum. ??Hank 

    On Sunday, October 9, 2016 8:30 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi everybody,??????????????????????????? Finished making a cutting tool for making 1" concaved hemispheres into aluminum for the ultimate purpose of making aluminum molds for 1" lead balls?.??? Finally acquired enough lead to sink my boat now !!?? My plan is to weight it per my best guess for level from fore?to aft.? If I'm off and the nose is high or low I will shift weight or add weight in either the bow or astern.? Since I can flood the ballast tank from outside the boat I should be able to get the whole thing balanced before I actually am inside the pressure hull.?? My goal is to balance it out with just the top part of the conning tower exposed.? That would be with the ballast completely flooded, then I'll have a inside bladder that?I can use to add the few extra pounds to take me down.??Will probably secure the hatch additionally with a strap from the outside just in case some water wants to get in there before there is enough pressure on the hatch really seal it good.??Also am?ordering the additional axel for my trailer?so I can safely haul this beast.?See?hemisphere drill below: ,? decided to put a?Morse taper on the shaft that way I can create molds on the lathe using aluminum round stock.?Brian???
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct  9 23:58:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 9 Oct 2016 20:58:43 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] making progress
Message-ID: <20161009205843.5A2FA146@m0087796.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 10 05:23:34 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2016 09:23:34 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED driver
References: <1125863049.1161011.1476091414695.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1125863049.1161011.1476091414695@mail.yahoo.com>

 I have just ordered 6 of these to drive my LED's.I have a 48V system & have been looking for a long time for a step down module with constant current to drop from 48V (really 53V) to 32-36V to runmy high power LED's. It is a bit of an overkill, but I'd rather have that than somethingthat I am not pushing to the limit.I will let you know how it turns out, as it may be useful to others as a cheap off the shelf?driver for a homemade sub light. Minimum order of 5 at US $14- each.About 3"x 2&1/2" x 2&1/2".Wholesale 10~80v 5A 300W DC DC Power supply module step up and step down buck/boost constant current/constant voltage converter/inverter - Alibaba.com
  
|  
|   
|   
|   |    |

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  |
|  
|    |  
Wholesale 10~80v 5A 300W DC DC Power supply module step up and step down bu...
 Wholesale 10~80v 5A 300W DC DC Power supply module step up and step down buck/boost constant current/constant vo...  |   |

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 06:31:08 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 11:31:08 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Hank
Sorry for delay, been offline for a few days.
Havent thought of an air motor, might work.  Im not very familiar with
them.  But I have bought this fishing reel thing that I think will be ok.
It takes about 40 meters of line and auto winds.  plus its small.  However,
im not convinced it will stand up to sea water very well.  I think its 304
stainless.  Still, i'll give it a try.

Check out this that I just bought (minus the outboard cover of
course).....im super excited.  Hasnt been used for a while so needs a clean
up of course, but its got loads of tooling and accessories with it.


?

On 8 October 2016 at 12:04, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hi James,
> Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't
> remember if you mentioned an air motor.    A simple air motor   with a
> constant air feed could work.  The motor and spool would have to be at the
> surface on or under the buoy.  I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but
> if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work.  The motor
> would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the
> spindle for the spool.  If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor,
> the line  could be pulled out against that pressure.  The pressure it build
> up( acting as a pump)  would vent out the regulator.  The sub could pull
> the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the
> line.  I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded.
> A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.
> Hank
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 07:28:08 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Mark via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 07:28:08 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FFAC2B98-3A1E-41E6-84B8-1EF66DF737CD@nc.rr.com>

Hi James,

Nice lathe, I own the same one.  Could you send a picture and model of the automatic fishing reel?  I'm look to fabricated an automatic spool and if never occurred to me to use a fishing reel.

Regards,

Mark...

Sent from iPhone.

> On Oct 11, 2016, at 6:31 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Hank
> Sorry for delay, been offline for a few days.
> Havent thought of an air motor, might work.  Im not very familiar with them.  But I have bought this fishing reel thing that I think will be ok.  It takes about 40 meters of line and auto winds.  plus its small.  However, im not convinced it will stand up to sea water very well.  I think its 304 stainless.  Still, i'll give it a try.
>  
> Check out this that I just bought (minus the outboard cover of course).....im super excited.  Hasnt been used for a while so needs a clean up of course, but its got loads of tooling and accessories with it.
>  
> <IMG_0076.JPG>
> ?
> 
>> On 8 October 2016 at 12:04, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Hi James,
>> Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't remember if you mentioned an air motor.    A simple air motor   with a constant air feed could work.  The motor and spool would have to be at the surface on or under the buoy.  I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work.  The motor would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the spindle for the spool.  If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor, the line  could be pulled out against that pressure.  The pressure it build up( acting as a pump)  would vent out the regulator.  The sub could pull the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the line.  I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded.  A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.
>> Hank 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 08:35:03 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 13:35:03 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: <FFAC2B98-3A1E-41E6-84B8-1EF66DF737CD@nc.rr.com>
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <FFAC2B98-3A1E-41E6-84B8-1EF66DF737CD@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UDs54YMcbFJ_ujNwPqYTotikd=gzOCE7fZfsrWcAAA9fA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Mark,

Its this one.
http://www.pfluegerfishing.com/pflueger-reels-fly-reels/pflueger-automatic-fly-reel/1280270.html

You wind up the return spring with the black wheel that's almost the same
diameter as the body.  The lever thing is the trigger that starts it
winding in.  Also you can release the spring with the centre metal
wheel.   The trigger will need locking in place to auto return.

It seems to work ok (in the garden) but unsure of its use in water.  Also I
don't think it will last long in the sea even though its sort of
stainless.  Probably be ok in fresh water.

I think the best thing would be to just have a reel of some sort and a
through hull handle to wind it in.  But that's the problem for me, no
through hulls available.

Regards
James



On 11 October 2016 at 12:28, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hi James,
>
> Nice lathe, I own the same one.  Could you send a picture and model of the
> automatic fishing reel?  I'm look to fabricated an automatic spool and if
> never occurred to me to use a fishing reel.
>
> Regards,
>
> Mark...
>
> Sent from iPhone.
>
> On Oct 11, 2016, at 6:31 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Hi Hank
> Sorry for delay, been offline for a few days.
> Havent thought of an air motor, might work.  Im not very familiar with
> them.  But I have bought this fishing reel thing that I think will be ok.
> It takes about 40 meters of line and auto winds.  plus its small.  However,
> im not convinced it will stand up to sea water very well.  I think its 304
> stainless.  Still, i'll give it a try.
>
> Check out this that I just bought (minus the outboard cover of
> course).....im super excited.  Hasnt been used for a while so needs a clean
> up of course, but its got loads of tooling and accessories with it.
>
> <IMG_0076.JPG>
> ?
>
> On 8 October 2016 at 12:04, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>> Hi James,
>> Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't
>> remember if you mentioned an air motor.    A simple air motor   with a
>> constant air feed could work.  The motor and spool would have to be at the
>> surface on or under the buoy.  I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but
>> if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work.  The motor
>> would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the
>> spindle for the spool.  If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor,
>> the line  could be pulled out against that pressure.  The pressure it build
>> up( acting as a pump)  would vent out the regulator.  The sub could pull
>> the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the
>> line.  I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded.
>> A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.
>> Hank
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 09:48:02 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 07:48:02 -0600
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: spVRb2rjVBMcWspVTbaLPK
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 spVRb2rjVBMcWspVTbaLPK
Message-ID: <442a16c9-cf76-464b-8591-c860d9b90445@email.android.com>

This might be an ideal application for a small hydraulic motor, with a pressure relief valve set to return fluid to tank at a relatively low pressure. Left to run throughout the dive, it would take up any slack until encountering the buoyancy force from the buoy, at which point the motor would maintain torque on the spool and excess fluid would just dump over the relief valve. You could further conserve power by only enabling the system when changing depth.

Sean


On October 8, 2016 5:04:28 AM MDT, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>Hi James,Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface
>buoy, can't remember if you mentioned an air motor. ? ?A simple air
>motor ? with a constant air feed could work. ?The motor and spool would
>have to be at the surface on or under the buoy. ?I am not sure how
>tight an air motor is, but if the motor could hold back low air
>pressure, it could work. ?The motor would be direct drive to the spool,
>in fact the air motor could be the spindle for the spool. ?If a
>constant low air pressure is fed to the motor, the line ?could be
>pulled out against that pressure. ?The pressure it build up( acting as
>a pump) ?would vent out the regulator. ?The sub could pull the line
>down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the line.
>?I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded. ?A
>diaphragm based motor would be ideal.Hank?
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 11:59:27 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 04:59:27 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
Message-ID: <FAF0DAB1-4F78-48D3-8696-D492664D6906@yahoo.com>

Just ordered 15 bridgelux  80W 6000k LED emitters from the Chinese manufacturer
at US $6- each. Freight was $40-, so ends up about $8- each.
Digikey had the bridgelux vero 100W emitter we were looking at for $60- each.
They had 3 different formats  for the same emitter, so ordered 5 of each to try them out.
The driver / step down modules I ordered were $12-, so it's looking pretty economical
for an 8000 lumen underwater light.
Will start machining the housing in a few days when the LEDs arrive. Have a simple
oil filled design.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 12:28:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 09:28:38 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
Message-ID: <20161011092838.5A2E84A9@m0087797.ppops.net>

Hope those work out, I haven't even gotten to the lights yet.

Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 04:59:27 +1300

Just ordered 15 bridgelux  80W 6000k LED emitters from the Chinese manufacturer
at US $6- each. Freight was $40-, so ends up about $8- each.
Digikey had the bridgelux vero 100W emitter we were looking at for $60- each.
They had 3 different formats  for the same emitter, so ordered 5 of each to try them out.
The driver / step down modules I ordered were $12-, so it's looking pretty economical
for an 8000 lumen underwater light.
Will start machining the housing in a few days when the LEDs arrive. Have a simple
oil filled design.
Alan

Sent from my iPad
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles



From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 15:11:26 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Hugh Fulton via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 08:11:26 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <07f501d223f3$461e6d70$d25b4850$@gmail.com>

Hi James,

I have one the same Colchester Triumph 2000 . Just for doing odd jobs as we have a CNC also.   We just fitted a good quality 3 jaw chuck Pratt Burnard and it has made a huge difference. Now we tend to use it more!  Check out the existing one for run-out.  Looks as though you got it for a good price.  Cheers Hugh.  

 

From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Tuesday, 11 October 2016 11:31 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool

 

Hi Hank

Sorry for delay, been offline for a few days.

Havent thought of an air motor, might work.  Im not very familiar with them.  But I have bought this fishing reel thing that I think will be ok.  It takes about 40 meters of line and auto winds.  plus its small.  However, im not convinced it will stand up to sea water very well.  I think its 304 stainless.  Still, i'll give it a try.

 

Check out this that I just bought (minus the outboard cover of course).....im super excited.  Hasnt been used for a while so needs a clean up of course, but its got loads of tooling and accessories with it.

 


?

 

On 8 October 2016 at 12:04, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Hi James,

Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't remember if you mentioned an air motor.    A simple air motor   with a constant air feed could work.  The motor and spool would have to be at the surface on or under the buoy.  I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work.  The motor would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the spindle for the spool.  If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor, the line  could be pulled out against that pressure.  The pressure it build up( acting as a pump)  would vent out the regulator.  The sub could pull the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the line.  I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded.  A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.

Hank 


_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 15:30:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 08:30:38 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
In-Reply-To: <20161011092838.5A2E84A9@m0087797.ppops.net>
References: <20161011092838.5A2E84A9@m0087797.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <B7E4BBDC-56F9-485C-A8D2-7023EE4CE5D1@yahoo.com>

Thanks Brian,
Cliff & Ken are working on a more elaborate 1atm design.
So you will have 2 Psub prototypes to follow. Hugh also
did a 50W LED light.
I am running 48V, which is too high a voltage for the input
to Ken's driver; so have found a generic driver that covers
my voltage & done my own thing. However I have been
buying & playing round with these high powered LEDs for
a few years now. I tested one to 2000psi, so they are good
for an oil filled enclosure however the drivers aren't pressure
resistant & are going in the hull. 
Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 12/10/2016, at 5:28 am, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hope those work out, I haven't even gotten to the lights yet.
> 
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LED Lights
> Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 04:59:27 +1300
> 
> Just ordered 15 bridgelux  80W 6000k LED emitters from the Chinese manufacturer
> at US $6- each. Freight was $40-, so ends up about $8- each.
> Digikey had the bridgelux vero 100W emitter we were looking at for $60- each.
> They had 3 different formats  for the same emitter, so ordered 5 of each to try them out.
> The driver / step down modules I ordered were $12-, so it's looking pretty economical
> for an 8000 lumen underwater light.
> Will start machining the housing in a few days when the LEDs arrive. Have a simple
> oil filled design.
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 18:15:00 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2016 22:15:00 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <801129907.2126482.1476224101084@mail.yahoo.com>

James,Your going to pretty well set up!Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 4:31 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi HankSorry for delay, been offline for a few days.Havent thought of an air motor, might work.? Im not very familiar with them.? But I have bought this fishing reel thing that I think will be ok.? It takes about 40 meters of line and auto winds.? plus its small.? However, im not convinced it will stand up to sea water very well.? I think its 304 stainless.? Still, i'll give it a try.?Check out this that I just bought (minus the outboard cover of course).....im super excited.? Hasnt been used for a while so needs a clean up of course, but its got?loads of tooling and accessories with it.?
?
On 8 October 2016 at 12:04, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Hi James,Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't remember if you mentioned an air motor. ? ?A simple air motor ? with a constant air feed could work.? The motor and spool would have to be at the surface on or under the buoy.? I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work.? The motor would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the spindle for the spool.? If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor, the line ?could be pulled out against that pressure.? The pressure it build up( acting as a pump) ?would vent out the regulator.? The sub could pull the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the line.? I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded.? A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.Hank?
______________________________ _________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles




_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 19:43:00 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 12:43:00 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: <801129907.2126482.1476224101084@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <801129907.2126482.1476224101084@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BC067095-756E-483C-B6AF-B5F80479548C@yahoo.com>

Just had a look at a video of a similar automatic reel.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qyqhgCkgqyc
You would need to have the trigger disabled or removed so it just pulled on the line
continuously. I can remember using 4lb or less leader line when I fished. It probably has about 1lb or less winding power judging by the way the guy was stripping out line.
Be interesting to see how it works for you James. 
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 12/10/2016, at 11:15 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> James,
> Your going to pretty well set up!
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 4:31 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hi Hank
> Sorry for delay, been offline for a few days.
> Havent thought of an air motor, might work.  Im not very familiar with them.  But I have bought this fishing reel thing that I think will be ok.  It takes about 40 meters of line and auto winds.  plus its small.  However, im not convinced it will stand up to sea water very well.  I think its 304 stainless.  Still, i'll give it a try.
>  
> Check out this that I just bought (minus the outboard cover of course).....im super excited.  Hasnt been used for a while so needs a clean up of course, but its got loads of tooling and accessories with it.
>  
> <IMG_0076.JPG>
> ?
> 
> On 8 October 2016 at 12:04, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> Hi James,
> Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't remember if you mentioned an air motor.    A simple air motor   with a constant air feed could work.  The motor and spool would have to be at the surface on or under the buoy.  I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work.  The motor would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the spindle for the spool.  If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor, the line  could be pulled out against that pressure.  The pressure it build up( acting as a pump)  would vent out the regulator.  The sub could pull the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the line.  I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded.  A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.
> Hank 
> 
> ______________________________ _________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> <IMG_0076.JPG>
> <IMG_0076.JPG>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 21:24:04 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 01:24:04 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: <BC067095-756E-483C-B6AF-B5F80479548C@yahoo.com>
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <801129907.2126482.1476224101084@mail.yahoo.com>
 <BC067095-756E-483C-B6AF-B5F80479548C@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1188766980.2194514.1476235444363@mail.yahoo.com>

Sean,There may be an even?simpler way to implement a hydraulic pump\motor. ?Picture a pump with a spool on it and the pressure line goes to a truck air bag half full of ?oil. ?Then picture the return line going to another truck airbag ?1\4 full of oil. ?Now when the assembly sinks the motor is forced to turn from buoyancy of the buoy , and in turn it pumps oil from the half full bag to the 1\4 full bag. ?This increases the pressure in the 1\4 full bag as the pump continues pumping by displacing the air in the bag. ?Now you reached your depth, and are starting to surface, the bag with higher pressure is going to act on the motor causing it to turn and spool in the line. ?This would require a gear motor \pump and some serious calculating to determine ?the correct displacement of the pump and volume of air bags. ?It may be necessary to recharge the bags with air. ?On further thought it may be better to use a piston pump because the oil could pass through the gears while your searching around for the lost gold boulder in Crawford bay.Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 5:43 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just had a look at a video of a similar automatic reel.https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qyqhgCkgqycYou would need to have the trigger disabled or removed so it just pulled on the linecontinuously. I can remember using 4lb or less leader line when I fished. It probably has about 1lb or less winding power judging by the way the guy was stripping out line.Be interesting to see how it works for you James.?Alan
Sent from my iPad
On 12/10/2016, at 11:15 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


James,Your going to pretty well set up!Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 4:31 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi HankSorry for delay, been offline for a few days.Havent thought of an air motor, might work.? Im not very familiar with them.? But I have bought this fishing reel thing that I think will be ok.? It takes about 40 meters of line and auto winds.? plus its small.? However, im not convinced it will stand up to sea water very well.? I think its 304 stainless.? Still, i'll give it a try.?Check out this that I just bought (minus the outboard cover of course).....im super excited.? Hasnt been used for a while so needs a clean up of course, but its got?loads of tooling and accessories with it.?<IMG_0076.JPG>
?
On 8 October 2016 at 12:04, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Hi James,Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't remember if you mentioned an air motor. ? ?A simple air motor ? with a constant air feed could work.? The motor and spool would have to be at the surface on or under the buoy.? I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work.? The motor would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the spindle for the spool.? If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor, the line ?could be pulled out against that pressure.? The pressure it build up( acting as a pump) ?would vent out the regulator.? The sub could pull the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the line.? I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded.? A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.Hank?
______________________________ _________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 11 22:35:39 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 02:35:39 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] automatic spool
In-Reply-To: <1188766980.2194514.1476235444363@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1812993717.490819.1475924668087.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1812993717.490819.1475924668087@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UAmbLP+qCU9j5336am33TGGo8zXKnAvuN=4DxMn1qZM4Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <801129907.2126482.1476224101084@mail.yahoo.com>
 <BC067095-756E-483C-B6AF-B5F80479548C@yahoo.com>
 <1188766980.2194514.1476235444363@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <823280003.2137057.1476239739597@mail.yahoo.com>

Oh ya, you would have to pre charge the air bag that is on the wind it in side. ?But it is a bad idea anyways ?;-( ?the air in the bags will both compress and cause buoyancy changes. ?Too badHank 

    On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 7:28 PM, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Sean,There may be an even?simpler way to implement a hydraulic pump\motor. ?Picture a pump with a spool on it and the pressure line goes to a truck air bag half full of ?oil. ?Then picture the return line going to another truck airbag ?1\4 full of oil. ?Now when the assembly sinks the motor is forced to turn from buoyancy of the buoy , and in turn it pumps oil from the half full bag to the 1\4 full bag. ?This increases the pressure in the 1\4 full bag as the pump continues pumping by displacing the air in the bag. ?Now you reached your depth, and are starting to surface, the bag with higher pressure is going to act on the motor causing it to turn and spool in the line. ?This would require a gear motor \pump and some serious calculating to determine ?the correct displacement of the pump and volume of air bags. ?It may be necessary to recharge the bags with air. ?On further thought it may be better to use a piston pump because the oil could pass through the gears while your searching around for the lost gold boulder in Crawford bay.Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 5:43 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just had a look at a video of a similar automatic reel.https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=qyqhgCkgqycYou would need to have the trigger disabled or removed so it just pulled on the linecontinuously. I can remember using 4lb or less leader line when I fished. It probably has about 1lb or less winding power judging by the way the guy was stripping out line.Be interesting to see how it works for you James.?Alan
Sent from my iPad
On 12/10/2016, at 11:15 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


James,Your going to pretty well set up!Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 11, 2016 4:31 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi HankSorry for delay, been offline for a few days.Havent thought of an air motor, might work.? Im not very familiar with them.? But I have bought this fishing reel thing that I think will be ok.? It takes about 40 meters of line and auto winds.? plus its small.? However, im not convinced it will stand up to sea water very well.? I think its 304 stainless.? Still, i'll give it a try.?Check out this that I just bought (minus the outboard cover of course).....im super excited.? Hasnt been used for a while so needs a clean up of course, but its got?loads of tooling and accessories with it.?<IMG_0076.JPG>
?
On 8 October 2016 at 12:04, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Hi James,Been thinking about your automatic spool for towing a surface buoy, can't remember if you mentioned an air motor. ? ?A simple air motor ? with a constant air feed could work.? The motor and spool would have to be at the surface on or under the buoy.? I am not sure how tight an air motor is, but if the motor could hold back low air pressure, it could work.? The motor would be direct drive to the spool, in fact the air motor could be the spindle for the spool.? If a constant low air pressure is fed to the motor, the line ?could be pulled out against that pressure.? The pressure it build up( acting as a pump) ?would vent out the regulator.? The sub could pull the line down and when the sub surfaces, the air motor would wind in the line.? I doubt a vane motor would work unless the vanes are spring loaded.? A diaphragm based motor would be ideal.Hank?
______________________________ _________________
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<IMG_0076.JPG>

<IMG_0076.JPG>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 12 14:49:50 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Mark via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 14:49:50 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
Message-ID: <244CAB5A-54F8-4065-AAD0-32C6C5D708B7@nc.rr.com>

Good afternoon, Psubs team:

Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?  

Regards,

Mark...
910-638-5229

Sent from iPhone.


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 12 15:15:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 13:15:43 -0600
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: uOcGblLVmBMcWuOcHb072j
References: uOcGblLVmBMcWuOcHb072j
Message-ID: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>

That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.

What are you building?

Sean


On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>
>Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC
>connector?  
>
>Regards,
>
>Mark...
>910-638-5229
>
>Sent from iPhone.
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 12 15:44:26 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Mark via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 12 Oct 2016 15:44:26 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
Message-ID: <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>

Hi Sean,

I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.

If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.

Regards,

Mark Widman
910-638-5229

Sent from iPhone.

> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
> 
> What are you building?
> 
> Sean
> 
> 
>> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>> 
>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?  
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Mark...
>> 910-638-5229
>> 
>> Sent from iPhone.
>> 
>> 
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 12 22:27:36 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 13:27:36 +1100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Mark,
I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia),
but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA
when you get can from the likes of:
http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-NPT-x-DIN-300-M.html
http://www.northeastscubasupply.com/search.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=

You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid the
ones with bleeders for your application in case it gets knocked.

Cheers
Steve


On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hi Sean,
>
> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA
> tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The
> air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a
> control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a
> connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>
> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>
> Regards,
>
> Mark Widman
> 910-638-5229
>
> Sent from iPhone.
>
> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find
> male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
>
> What are you building?
>
> Sean
>
>
> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>>
>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Mark...
>> 910-638-5229
>>
>> Sent from iPhone.
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 13 08:26:49 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Mark via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 08:26:49 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <653C6D7A-CDAC-4F8B-9AB5-8E0B17259C41@nc.rr.com>

Thanks Steve,

This is exactly what I'm looking for.
(1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)

Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300 vs. DIN 477)?

Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more reasonable like 100 or so PSI.  Can you recommend an air pressure regulator?

Regards,

Mark Widman
910-638-5229

Sent from iPhone.

> On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Mark,
> I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia), but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA when you get can from the likes of:
> http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-NPT-x-DIN-300-M.htmlhttp://www.northeastscubasupply.com/search.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=
> 
> You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid the ones with bleeders for your application in case it gets knocked.
> 
> Cheers
> Steve
> 
> 
>> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Hi Sean,
>> 
>> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>> 
>> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Mark Widman
>> 910-638-5229
>> 
>> Sent from iPhone.
>> 
>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
>>> 
>>> What are you building?
>>> 
>>> Sean
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>>>> 
>>>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?  
>>>> 
>>>> Regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Mark...
>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 13 09:17:04 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 07:17:04 -0600
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: uf7EbXFv3fdZcuf7FbJDEq
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
 uf7EbXFv3fdZcuf7FbJDEq
Message-ID: <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>

300 is short for 300 bar, or the recommended maximum pressure of the fitting, indicating that it is a deeper thread than 200/232 bar fittings. The latter can be used with yoke style regulators (CGA-850) by using an insert in the female DIN on the tank valve. The 300 bar connection, being deeper, precludes this but is stronger. Similarly, if you have a 300 bar DIN fitting on your regulator, and screw it into a 200 bar DIN tank valve, it is compatible, but will show a couple of exposed threads which can be entrapment points.

DIN 477 is the actual thread specification.  Rarely seen in SCUBA equipment catalogs, but necessary if you're going to have a DIN thread machined.

Sean


On October 13, 2016 6:26:49 AM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>Thanks Steve,
>
>This is exactly what I'm looking for.
>(1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)
>
>Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300
>vs. DIN 477)?
>
>Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more
>reasonable like 100 or so PSI.  Can you recommend an air pressure
>regulator?
>
>Regards,
>
>Mark Widman
>910-638-5229
>
>Sent from iPhone.
>
>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via
>Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Mark,
>> I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering
>Australia), but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to
>you in the USA when you get can from the likes of:
>>
>http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-NPT-x-DIN-300-M.htmlhttp://www.northeastscubasupply.com/search.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=
>> 
>> You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid
>the ones with bleeders for your application in case it gets knocked.
>> 
>> Cheers
>> Steve
>> 
>> 
>>> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> Hi Sean,
>>> 
>>> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The
>SCUBA tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast
>tanks.  The air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in
>the sub (to a control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I
>need to acquire a connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>>> 
>>> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> Mark Widman
>>> 910-638-5229
>>> 
>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>> 
>>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via
>Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly
>find male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
>>>> 
>>>> What are you building?
>>>> 
>>>> Sean
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via
>Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC
>connector?  
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Mark...
>>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 13 09:55:18 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Mark via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 09:55:18 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>
Message-ID: <5F69543D-2BAF-499D-BC9A-072ECAA418D7@nc.rr.com>

Steve,

Thanks for the clarification on the DIN connector.  In terms of the pressure regulator, what device do most people use to regulate the air pressure?  Is this something I could purchase from a SCUBA parts supply company?  

Regards,

Mark Widman
910-638-5229

Sent from iPhone.

> On Oct 13, 2016, at 9:17 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 300 is short for 300 bar, or the recommended maximum pressure of the fitting, indicating that it is a deeper thread than 200/232 bar fittings. The latter can be used with yoke style regulators (CGA-850) by using an insert in the female DIN on the tank valve. The 300 bar connection, being deeper, precludes this but is stronger. Similarly, if you have a 300 bar DIN fitting on your regulator, and screw it into a 200 bar DIN tank valve, it is compatible, but will show a couple of exposed threads which can be entrapment points.
> 
> DIN 477 is the actual thread specification.  Rarely seen in SCUBA equipment catalogs, but necessary if you're going to have a DIN thread machined.
> 
> Sean
> 
> 
>> On October 13, 2016 6:26:49 AM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Thanks Steve,
>> 
>> This is exactly what I'm looking for.
>> (1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)
>> 
>> Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300 vs. DIN 477)?
>> 
>> Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more reasonable like 100 or so PSI.  Can you recommend an air pressure regulator?
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Mark Widman
>> 910-638-5229
>> 
>> Sent from iPhone.
>> 
>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Mark,
>>> I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia), but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA when you get can from the likes of:
>>> http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-NPT-x-DIN-300-M.htmlhttp://www.northeastscubasupply.com/search.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=
>>> 
>>> You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid the ones with bleeders for your application in ca! se it gets knocked.
>>> 
>>> Cheers
>>> Steve
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> Hi Sean,
>>>> 
>>>> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>>>> 
>>>> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>>>> 
>>>> Regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Mark Widman
>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>> 
>>>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
>>>>> 
>>>>> What are you building?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sean
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?  
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Mark...
>>>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 13 18:55:59 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 09:55:59 +1100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <5F69543D-2BAF-499D-BC9A-072ECAA418D7@nc.rr.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>
 <5F69543D-2BAF-499D-BC9A-072ECAA418D7@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <CAAzgXiMK9ORt+h=_02y6swZ78ufR+18L+M1Eb1VwJKf+ukO0XA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Mark,
Most SCUBA regulator first stages (the bit that goes onto a tank) will drop
the pressure to about 150PSI, and you could happily adjust most of them to
100PSI instead.

Bear in mind a regulator adds lots of different failure modes and if your
shutoff is after the regulator you may well lose all the gas in the
cylinder if there is a failure.  Probably doesn't matter in your
case!  This is also a reason regulators have an overpressure valve (OPV) -
in case they fail open and deliver full cylinder pressure into the low
pressure downstream line.  Quite important if you don't have a SCUBA second
stage (that bit that goes in your mouth) installed.

Also after the regulator there is no way of knowing what's left in the
cylinder.  A contents gauge is only useful on the high pressure side.

A useful resource for dealing with SCUBA regulators:
http://www.airspeedpress.com/newregbook.html

The cheapest SCUBA regulators are for argon and/or drysuit inflation.  Ie:
https://www.divegearexpress.com/inflation-regulator-w-opv
They are not adjustable (but generally set to lower pressure, more like
100-125PSI) and often have slightly less flow.  I don't think the
difference would be particularly significant for you.  They also tend to be
200bar DIN - so if you have a 300bar DIN valves they won't fit.

SCUBA regulators for breathing are more expensive, but have higher flows
and are meant to be more reliable, and adjustable.  You'd be looking for a
DIN "first stage" (they are pretty much all dual 200/300bar compatible) and
then you'll have to get a separate OPV. Ie:
https://www.divegearexpress.com/regulators-spgs

You'll also need one of these adaptors to turn the regulator outlet into
NPT: https://www.divegearexpress.com/adapter-1-4-inch-npt-female-3-8-inch-m

Cheers,
Steve

On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 12:55 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Steve,
>
> Thanks for the clarification on the DIN connector.  In terms of the
> pressure regulator, what device do most people use to regulate the air
> pressure?  Is this something I could purchase from a SCUBA parts supply
> company?
>
> Regards,
>
> Mark Widman
> 910-638-5229
>
> Sent from iPhone.
>
> On Oct 13, 2016, at 9:17 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> 300 is short for 300 bar, or the recommended maximum pressure of the
> fitting, indicating that it is a deeper thread than 200/232 bar fittings.
> The latter can be used with yoke style regulators (CGA-850) by using an
> insert in the female DIN on the tank valve. The 300 bar connection, being
> deeper, precludes this but is stronger. Similarly, if you have a 300 bar
> DIN fitting on your regulator, and screw it into a 200 bar DIN tank valve,
> it is compatible, but will show a couple of exposed threads which can be
> entrapment points.
>
> DIN 477 is the actual thread specification.  Rarely seen in SCUBA
> equipment catalogs, but necessary if you're going to have a DIN thread
> machined.
>
> Sean
>
>
> On October 13, 2016 6:26:49 AM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>> Thanks Steve,
>>
>> This is exactly what I'm looking for.
>> (1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)
>>
>> Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300 vs.
>> DIN 477)?
>>
>> Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more
>> reasonable like 100 or so PSI.  Can you recommend an air pressure regulator?
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Mark Widman
>> 910-638-5229
>>
>> Sent from iPhone.
>>
>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Mark,
>> I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia),
>> but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA
>> when you get can from the likes of:
>> http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-NPT-x-
>> DIN-300-M.htmlhttp://www.northeastscubasupply.com/
>> search.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=
>>
>> You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid the
>> ones with bleeders for your application in ca! se it gets knocked.
>>
>> Cheers
>> Steve
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Sean,
>>>
>>> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA
>>> tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The
>>> air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a
>>> control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a
>>> connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>>>
>>> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Mark Widman
>>> 910-638-5229
>>>
>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>
>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles
>>> <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find
>>> male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
>>>
>>> What are you building?
>>>
>>> Sean
>>>
>>>
>>> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>>>>
>>>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Mark...
>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>
>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 13 19:53:37 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 12:53:37 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <CAAzgXiMK9ORt+h=_02y6swZ78ufR+18L+M1Eb1VwJKf+ukO0XA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>
 <5F69543D-2BAF-499D-BC9A-072ECAA418D7@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMK9ORt+h=_02y6swZ78ufR+18L+M1Eb1VwJKf+ukO0XA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <FDBDB242-81B5-4105-9A74-FA7DF94480CF@yahoo.com>

Mark,
sorry if I am insulting your intelligence here, but if you have a 
standard regulator inside the hull reducing the pressure to 100
psi then you won't be able to blow your ballast tanks below 50ft.
As Steve suggests, a scuba first stage regulator will give you
130 psi above the ambient water pressure, enabling you to put
air in your ballast tanks at any depth.
Just mentioning this because this mistake has been made before.
Cheers Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 14/10/2016, at 11:55 am, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Mark,
> Most SCUBA regulator first stages (the bit that goes onto a tank) will drop the pressure to about 150PSI, and you could happily adjust most of them to 100PSI instead.
> 
> Bear in mind a regulator adds lots of different failure modes and if your shutoff is after the regulator you may well lose all the gas in the cylinder if there is a failure.  Probably doesn't matter in your case!  This is also a reason regulators have an overpressure valve (OPV) - in case they fail open and deliver full cylinder pressure into the low pressure downstream line.  Quite important if you don't have a SCUBA second stage (that bit that goes in your mouth) installed.
> 
> Also after the regulator there is no way of knowing what's left in the cylinder.  A contents gauge is only useful on the high pressure side.
> 
> A useful resource for dealing with SCUBA regulators:  http://www.airspeedpress.com/newregbook.html
> 
> The cheapest SCUBA regulators are for argon and/or drysuit inflation.  Ie: https://www.divegearexpress.com/inflation-regulator-w-opv
> They are not adjustable (but generally set to lower pressure, more like 100-125PSI) and often have slightly less flow.  I don't think the difference would be particularly significant for you.  They also tend to be 200bar DIN - so if you have a 300bar DIN valves they won't fit.
> 
> SCUBA regulators for breathing are more expensive, but have higher flows and are meant to be more reliable, and adjustable.  You'd be looking for a DIN "first stage" (they are pretty much all dual 200/300bar compatible) and then you'll have to get a separate OPV. Ie:
> https://www.divegearexpress.com/regulators-spgs
> 
> You'll also need one of these adaptors to turn the regulator outlet into NPT: https://www.divegearexpress.com/adapter-1-4-inch-npt-female-3-8-inch-m
> 
> Cheers,
> Steve
> 
>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 12:55 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Steve,
>> 
>> Thanks for the clarification on the DIN connector.  In terms of the pressure regulator, what device do most people use to regulate the air pressure?  Is this something I could purchase from a SCUBA parts supply company?  
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Mark Widman
>> 910-638-5229
>> 
>> Sent from iPhone.
>> 
>>> On Oct 13, 2016, at 9:17 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 300 is short for 300 bar, or the recommended maximum pressure of the fitting, indicating that it is a deeper thread than 200/232 bar fittings. The latter can be used with yoke style regulators (CGA-850) by using an insert in the female DIN on the tank valve. The 300 bar connection, being deeper, precludes this but is stronger. Similarly, if you have a 300 bar DIN fitting on your regulator, and screw it into a 200 bar DIN tank valve, it is compatible, but will show a couple of exposed threads which can be entrapment points.
>>> 
>>> DIN 477 is the actual thread specification.  Rarely seen in SCUBA equipment catalogs, but necessary if you're going to have a DIN thread machined.
>>> 
>>> Sean
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On October 13, 2016 6:26:49 AM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> Thanks Steve,
>>>> 
>>>> This is exactly what I'm looking for.
>>>> (1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)
>>>> 
>>>> Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300 vs. DIN 477)?
>>>> 
>>>> Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more reasonable like 100 or so PSI.  Can you recommend an air pressure regulator?
>>>> 
>>>> Regards,
>>>> 
>>>> Mark Widman
>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>> 
>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>> 
>>>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> Hi Mark,
>>>>> I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia), but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA when you get can from the likes of:
>>>>> http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-NPT-x-DIN-300-M.htmlhttp://www.northeastscubasupply.com/search.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=
>>>>> 
>>>>> You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid the ones with bleeders for your application in ca! se it gets knocked.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Cheers
>>>>> Steve
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>> Hi Sean,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Mark Widman
>>>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> What are you building?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Sean
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?  
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Mark...
>>>>>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 13 19:59:31 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 12:59:31 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <FDBDB242-81B5-4105-9A74-FA7DF94480CF@yahoo.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>
 <5F69543D-2BAF-499D-BC9A-072ECAA418D7@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMK9ORt+h=_02y6swZ78ufR+18L+M1Eb1VwJKf+ukO0XA@mail.gmail.com>
 <FDBDB242-81B5-4105-9A74-FA7DF94480CF@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <17DDED9B-0FCE-46D0-8F87-B5E65E3F116C@yahoo.com>

Correction, you won't be able to put air in your ballast tank
below 200ft with a 100psi regulator inside the hull.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 14/10/2016, at 12:53 pm, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Mark,
> sorry if I am insulting your intelligence here, but if you have a 
> standard regulator inside the hull reducing the pressure to 100
> psi then you won't be able to blow your ballast tanks below 50ft.
> As Steve suggests, a scuba first stage regulator will give you
> 130 psi above the ambient water pressure, enabling you to put
> air in your ballast tanks at any depth.
> Just mentioning this because this mistake has been made before.
> Cheers Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 14/10/2016, at 11:55 am, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Mark,
>> Most SCUBA regulator first stages (the bit that goes onto a tank) will drop the pressure to about 150PSI, and you could happily adjust most of them to 100PSI instead.
>> 
>> Bear in mind a regulator adds lots of different failure modes and if your shutoff is after the regulator you may well lose all the gas in the cylinder if there is a failure.  Probably doesn't matter in your case!  This is also a reason regulators have an overpressure valve (OPV) - in case they fail open and deliver full cylinder pressure into the low pressure downstream line.  Quite important if you don't have a SCUBA second stage (that bit that goes in your mouth) installed.
>> 
>> Also after the regulator there is no way of knowing what's left in the cylinder.  A contents gauge is only useful on the high pressure side.
>> 
>> A useful resource for dealing with SCUBA regulators:  http://www.airspeedpress.com/newregbook.html
>> 
>> The cheapest SCUBA regulators are for argon and/or drysuit inflation.  Ie: https://www.divegearexpress.com/inflation-regulator-w-opv
>> They are not adjustable (but generally set to lower pressure, more like 100-125PSI) and often have slightly less flow.  I don't think the difference would be particularly significant for you.  They also tend to be 200bar DIN - so if you have a 300bar DIN valves they won't fit.
>> 
>> SCUBA regulators for breathing are more expensive, but have higher flows and are meant to be more reliable, and adjustable.  You'd be looking for a DIN "first stage" (they are pretty much all dual 200/300bar compatible) and then you'll have to get a separate OPV. Ie:
>> https://www.divegearexpress.com/regulators-spgs
>> 
>> You'll also need one of these adaptors to turn the regulator outlet into NPT: https://www.divegearexpress.com/adapter-1-4-inch-npt-female-3-8-inch-m
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Steve
>> 
>>> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 12:55 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> Steve,
>>> 
>>> Thanks for the clarification on the DIN connector.  In terms of the pressure regulator, what device do most people use to regulate the air pressure?  Is this something I could purchase from a SCUBA parts supply company?  
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> Mark Widman
>>> 910-638-5229
>>> 
>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>> 
>>>> On Oct 13, 2016, at 9:17 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> 300 is short for 300 bar, or the recommended maximum pressure of the fitting, indicating that it is a deeper thread than 200/232 bar fittings. The latter can be used with yoke style regulators (CGA-850) by using an insert in the female DIN on the tank valve. The 300 bar connection, being deeper, precludes this but is stronger. Similarly, if you have a 300 bar DIN fitting on your regulator, and screw it into a 200 bar DIN tank valve, it is compatible, but will show a couple of exposed threads which can be entrapment points.
>>>> 
>>>> DIN 477 is the actual thread specification.  Rarely seen in SCUBA equipment catalogs, but necessary if you're going to have a DIN thread machined.
>>>> 
>>>> Sean
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>>> On October 13, 2016 6:26:49 AM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>> Thanks Steve,
>>>>> 
>>>>> This is exactly what I'm looking for.
>>>>> (1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300 vs. DIN 477)?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more reasonable like 100 or so PSI.  Can you recommend an air pressure regulator?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> 
>>>>> Mark Widman
>>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>> 
>>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Hi Mark,
>>>>>> I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia), but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA when you get can from the likes of:
>>>>>> http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-NPT-x-DIN-300-M.htmlhttp://www.northeastscubasupply.com/search.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid the ones with bleeders for your application in ca! se it gets knocked.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Cheers
>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi Sean,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Mark Widman
>>>>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> What are you building?
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Sean
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?  
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Mark...
>>>>>>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 13 22:58:32 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 13 Oct 2016 19:58:32 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] support skiff
Message-ID: <20161013195832.5A2E7727@m0086238.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 14 04:55:15 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 09:55:15 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <17DDED9B-0FCE-46D0-8F87-B5E65E3F116C@yahoo.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>
 <5F69543D-2BAF-499D-BC9A-072ECAA418D7@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMK9ORt+h=_02y6swZ78ufR+18L+M1Eb1VwJKf+ukO0XA@mail.gmail.com>
 <FDBDB242-81B5-4105-9A74-FA7DF94480CF@yahoo.com>
 <17DDED9B-0FCE-46D0-8F87-B5E65E3F116C@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UA0SJ-GSjwkP1phWp5uQbOzC04X0kgvFnfaAHWBE34f7g@mail.gmail.com>

Hello

I have a pressure reducing regulator connected to a manifold that allows me
to connect 2x tanks and set whatever pressure I want.

http://www.guernseysubmarine.com/Extended_files/Page15335.htm

Its nice and works well, but it was expensive and if I was doing this
again, I wouldn't bother with the regulator and just pipe the manifold to
the main pipes.  In fact, I probably wouldn't even bother with the manifold
as when I dive, I have one tank connected to emergency scuba anyway.  If I
need the second tank, I swap it out underwater.  Only had to do it once.

Keep it simple.

On 14 October 2016 at 00:59, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Correction, you won't be able to put air in your ballast tank
> below 200ft with a 100psi regulator inside the hull.
> Alan
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 14/10/2016, at 12:53 pm, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Mark,
> sorry if I am insulting your intelligence here, but if you have a
> standard regulator inside the hull reducing the pressure to 100
> psi then you won't be able to blow your ballast tanks below 50ft.
> As Steve suggests, a scuba first stage regulator will give you
> 130 psi above the ambient water pressure, enabling you to put
> air in your ballast tanks at any depth.
> Just mentioning this because this mistake has been made before.
> Cheers Alan
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 14/10/2016, at 11:55 am, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Hi Mark,
> Most SCUBA regulator first stages (the bit that goes onto a tank) will
> drop the pressure to about 150PSI, and you could happily adjust most of
> them to 100PSI instead.
>
> Bear in mind a regulator adds lots of different failure modes and if your
> shutoff is after the regulator you may well lose all the gas in the
> cylinder if there is a failure.  Probably doesn't matter in your
> case!  This is also a reason regulators have an overpressure valve (OPV) -
> in case they fail open and deliver full cylinder pressure into the low
> pressure downstream line.  Quite important if you don't have a SCUBA second
> stage (that bit that goes in your mouth) installed.
>
> Also after the regulator there is no way of knowing what's left in the
> cylinder.  A contents gauge is only useful on the high pressure side.
>
> A useful resource for dealing with SCUBA regulators:
> http://www.airspeedpress.com/newregbook.html
>
> The cheapest SCUBA regulators are for argon and/or drysuit inflation.  Ie:
> https://www.divegearexpress.com/inflation-regulator-w-opv
> They are not adjustable (but generally set to lower pressure, more like
> 100-125PSI) and often have slightly less flow.  I don't think the
> difference would be particularly significant for you.  They also tend to be
> 200bar DIN - so if you have a 300bar DIN valves they won't fit.
>
> SCUBA regulators for breathing are more expensive, but have higher flows
> and are meant to be more reliable, and adjustable.  You'd be looking for a
> DIN "first stage" (they are pretty much all dual 200/300bar compatible) and
> then you'll have to get a separate OPV. Ie:
> https://www.divegearexpress.com/regulators-spgs
>
> You'll also need one of these adaptors to turn the regulator outlet into
> NPT: https://www.divegearexpress.com/adapter-1-4-inch-npt-
> female-3-8-inch-m
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
>
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 12:55 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>> Steve,
>>
>> Thanks for the clarification on the DIN connector.  In terms of the
>> pressure regulator, what device do most people use to regulate the air
>> pressure?  Is this something I could purchase from a SCUBA parts supply
>> company?
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Mark Widman
>> 910-638-5229
>>
>> Sent from iPhone.
>>
>> On Oct 13, 2016, at 9:17 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>> 300 is short for 300 bar, or the recommended maximum pressure of the
>> fitting, indicating that it is a deeper thread than 200/232 bar fittings.
>> The latter can be used with yoke style regulators (CGA-850) by using an
>> insert in the female DIN on the tank valve. The 300 bar connection, being
>> deeper, precludes this but is stronger. Similarly, if you have a 300 bar
>> DIN fitting on your regulator, and screw it into a 200 bar DIN tank valve,
>> it is compatible, but will show a couple of exposed threads which can be
>> entrapment points.
>>
>> DIN 477 is the actual thread specification.  Rarely seen in SCUBA
>> equipment catalogs, but necessary if you're going to have a DIN thread
>> machined.
>>
>> Sean
>>
>>
>> On October 13, 2016 6:26:49 AM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks Steve,
>>>
>>> This is exactly what I'm looking for.
>>> (1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)
>>>
>>> Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300 vs.
>>> DIN 477)?
>>>
>>> Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more
>>> reasonable like 100 or so PSI.  Can you recommend an air pressure regulator?
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Mark Widman
>>> 910-638-5229
>>>
>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>
>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Mark,
>>> I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia),
>>> but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA
>>> when you get can from the likes of:
>>> http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-
>>> NPT-x-DIN-300-M.htmlhttp://www.northeastscubasupply.com/s
>>> earch.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=
>>>
>>> You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid the
>>> ones with bleeders for your application in ca! se it gets knocked.
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>> Steve
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Sean,
>>>>
>>>> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA
>>>> tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The
>>>> air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a
>>>> control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a
>>>> connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>>>>
>>>> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Mark Widman
>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>
>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>
>>>> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via
>>>> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find
>>>> male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
>>>>
>>>> What are you building?
>>>>
>>>> Sean
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <
>>>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>>>>>
>>>>> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Mark...
>>>>> 910-638-5229
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from iPhone.
>>>>>
>>>>> ------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>>
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 14 06:32:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 10:32:38 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] support skiff
In-Reply-To: <20161013195832.5A2E7727@m0086238.ppops.net>
References: <20161013195832.5A2E7727@m0086238.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <2013552303.133948.1476441158347@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,That is a brilliant idea, you will find invaluable to have a unlimited air supply when testing.Hank 

    On Thursday, October 13, 2016 8:58 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi All,??????????????? Bought a really cool light weight fiberglass skiff that I can load by myself on to the back of my truck.? My plan is to put my gas powered air compressor in it while I'm testing going up and down with the sub in a secluded part of the harbor.? That way I will have virtually unlimited air reserves and won't have to worry about using up my compressed tanks.? I also think it would be advantages to be able to inject an overflow amount of air into the main ballast while traversing on the surface.? The WWII subs would do that when they were really trying to haul ass out of a bad situation.??? The theory being the extra venting air would give you a bit more buoyancy.???It would be nice to be able to carry a gas powered compressor while making the crossing over to Anacapa Island.????I might be able to lift the compressor into the skiff with two people, but it's kind of an awkward job, still need to figure out the logistics of that.? ?Brian??
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 14 06:37:34 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 10:37:34 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UA0SJ-GSjwkP1phWp5uQbOzC04X0kgvFnfaAHWBE34f7g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>
 <5F69543D-2BAF-499D-BC9A-072ECAA418D7@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMK9ORt+h=_02y6swZ78ufR+18L+M1Eb1VwJKf+ukO0XA@mail.gmail.com>
 <FDBDB242-81B5-4105-9A74-FA7DF94480CF@yahoo.com>
 <17DDED9B-0FCE-46D0-8F87-B5E65E3F116C@yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UA0SJ-GSjwkP1phWp5uQbOzC04X0kgvFnfaAHWBE34f7g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1958596087.138553.1476441454979@mail.yahoo.com>

Agreed,Gamma and Elementary both use full tank pressure, no need for a regulator in my mind. ?James,?How is that new submarine shop coming along?Hank 

    On Friday, October 14, 2016 2:55 AM, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hello
I have a pressure reducing regulator connected to a manifold that allows me to connect 2x tanks and set whatever pressure I want.? ?http://www.guernseysubmarine.com/Extended_files/Page15335.htm?Its nice and works well, but it was expensive and if I was doing this again, I wouldn't bother with the regulator and just pipe the manifold to the main pipes.? In fact, I probably wouldn't even bother with the manifold as when I dive, I have one tank connected to emergency scuba anyway.? If I need the second tank, I swap it out underwater.? Only had to do it once.?Keep it simple.
On 14 October 2016 at 00:59, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Correction, you won't be able to put air in your ballast tankbelow 200ft with a 100psi regulator inside the hull.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 14/10/2016, at 12:53 pm, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> wrote:


Mark,sorry if I am insulting your intelligence here, but if you have a?standard regulator inside the hull reducing the pressure to 100psi then you won't be able to blow your ballast tanks below 50ft.As Steve suggests, a scuba first stage regulator will give you130 psi above the ambient water pressure, enabling you to putair in your ballast tanks at any depth.Just mentioning this because this mistake has been made before.Cheers Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 14/10/2016, at 11:55 am, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> wrote:


Hi Mark,Most SCUBA regulator first stages (the bit that goes onto a tank) will drop the pressure to about 150PSI, and you could happily adjust most of them to 100PSI instead.
Bear in mind a regulator adds lots of different failure modes and if your shutoff?is after the regulator you may well?lose all the gas in the cylinder if there is a failure.? Probably doesn't matter in your case!??This is also a reason?regulators have an overpressure valve (OPV) - in case they fail open and deliver full cylinder pressure into the low pressure downstream line.? Quite important if you don't have a SCUBA second stage (that bit that goes in your mouth) installed.
Also after the regulator there is no way of knowing what's left in the cylinder.? A contents gauge is only useful on the high pressure side.
A useful resource for dealing with SCUBA regulators:? http://www.airspeedpress.com/ newregbook.html
The?cheapest SCUBA regulators are for argon and/or drysuit inflation.? Ie: https://www.divegearexpress. com/inflation-regulator-w-opvThey are not adjustable (but generally set to lower pressure, more like 100-125PSI)?and often have slightly less flow.? I don't think the difference would be particularly significant for you.? They also tend to be 200bar?DIN - so if you have a 300bar DIN valves they won't fit.
SCUBA regulators for breathing?are more expensive, but have higher flows and are meant to be more reliable, and adjustable.? You'd be looking for a DIN "first stage" (they are pretty much all dual 200/300bar compatible) and then you'll have to get a separate OPV.?Ie:https://www.divegearexpress. com/regulators-spgs
You'll also need one of these adaptors to turn the regulator outlet into NPT: https://www.divegearexpress. com/adapter-1-4-inch-npt- female-3-8-inch-m
Cheers,Steve
On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 12:55 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> wrote:

Steve,
Thanks for the clarification on the DIN connector.? In terms of the pressure regulator, what device do most people use to regulate the air pressure?? Is this something I could purchase from a SCUBA parts supply company? ?

Regards,
Mark Widman910-638-5229
Sent from iPhone.
On Oct 13, 2016, at 9:17 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o rg> wrote:


300 is short for 300 bar, or the recommended maximum pressure of the fitting, indicating that it is a deeper thread than 200/232 bar fittings. The latter can be used with yoke style regulators (CGA-850) by using an insert in the female DIN on the tank valve. The 300 bar connection, being deeper, precludes this but is stronger. Similarly, if you have a 300 bar DIN fitting on your regulator, and screw it into a 200 bar DIN tank valve, it is compatible, but will show a couple of exposed threads which can be entrapment points.DIN 477 is the actual thread specification.? Rarely seen in SCUBA equipment catalogs, but necessary if you're going to have a DIN thread machined.Sean


On October 13, 2016 6:26:49 AM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o rg> wrote:
Thanks Steve,
This is exactly what I'm looking for.(1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)
Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300 vs. DIN 477)?
Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more reasonable like 100 or so PSI.? Can you recommend an air pressure regulator?
Regards,
Mark Widman910-638-5229
Sent fromiPhone.
On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o rg> wrote:


Hi Mark,I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia), but?being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA when you get can?from the likes of:http://www.northshorecompresso r.com/products/17B477D22-M- NPT-x-DIN-300-M.htmlhttp:// www.northeastscubasupply.com/s earch.php?search_query=DIN+NPT &Search=
You might be able to do a bit better if you look around -?but?avoid the ones with bleeders for your application in ca! se itgets knocked.
CheersSteve

On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o rg> wrote:

Hi Sean,
I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.? The SCUBA tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.? The air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.? I need to acquire a connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.

Regards,
Mark Widman910-638-5229
Sent from iPhone.
On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o rg> wrote:


That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.What are you building?Sean


On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o rg> wrote:
Good afternoon, Psubs team:

Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?  

Regards,

Mark...
910-638-5229

Sent from iPhone.


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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 14 08:22:21 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 14 Oct 2016 13:22:21 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Scuba Tank DIN connector to JIC
In-Reply-To: <1958596087.138553.1476441454979@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <d7a91cf0-2949-41b7-a269-8e66f3b02cfb@email.android.com>
 <46F3D458-8C4B-46CE-9532-67743CD67685@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMdQW65mQO8bS8QyUjgtAnevekh9nKqMuT=+MqRkAn10Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <c10d134c-f6e3-474f-87f7-32d1a186e981@email.android.com>
 <5F69543D-2BAF-499D-BC9A-072ECAA418D7@nc.rr.com>
 <CAAzgXiMK9ORt+h=_02y6swZ78ufR+18L+M1Eb1VwJKf+ukO0XA@mail.gmail.com>
 <FDBDB242-81B5-4105-9A74-FA7DF94480CF@yahoo.com>
 <17DDED9B-0FCE-46D0-8F87-B5E65E3F116C@yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UA0SJ-GSjwkP1phWp5uQbOzC04X0kgvFnfaAHWBE34f7g@mail.gmail.com>
 <1958596087.138553.1476441454979@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UAvP_fJqf5TuGhTixzQ4yCoRPonDnGdD3f8Qi9_3ChiKA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Hank
Shop is still being built.  Roof going on this week.  Hoping to get in
about December. Problems with the planning regulations have delayed
things.  Red tape, but underway now.  I cant wait as i have machine tools
stashed all over the island at the moment......

On 14 October 2016 at 11:37, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Agreed,
> Gamma and Elementary both use full tank pressure, no need for a regulator
> in my mind.
> James,
> How is that new submarine shop coming along?
> Hank
>
>
> On Friday, October 14, 2016 2:55 AM, James Frankland via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Hello
>
> I have a pressure reducing regulator connected to a manifold that allows
> me to connect 2x tanks and set whatever pressure I want.
>
> http://www.guernseysubmarine.com/Extended_files/Page15335.htm
>
> Its nice and works well, but it was expensive and if I was doing this
> again, I wouldn't bother with the regulator and just pipe the manifold to
> the main pipes.  In fact, I probably wouldn't even bother with the manifold
> as when I dive, I have one tank connected to emergency scuba anyway.  If I
> need the second tank, I swap it out underwater.  Only had to do it once.
>
> Keep it simple.
>
> On 14 October 2016 at 00:59, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Correction, you won't be able to put air in your ballast tank
> below 200ft with a 100psi regulator inside the hull.
> Alan
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 14/10/2016, at 12:53 pm, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> Mark,
> sorry if I am insulting your intelligence here, but if you have a
> standard regulator inside the hull reducing the pressure to 100
> psi then you won't be able to blow your ballast tanks below 50ft.
> As Steve suggests, a scuba first stage regulator will give you
> 130 psi above the ambient water pressure, enabling you to put
> air in your ballast tanks at any depth.
> Just mentioning this because this mistake has been made before.
> Cheers Alan
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 14/10/2016, at 11:55 am, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> Hi Mark,
> Most SCUBA regulator first stages (the bit that goes onto a tank) will
> drop the pressure to about 150PSI, and you could happily adjust most of
> them to 100PSI instead.
>
> Bear in mind a regulator adds lots of different failure modes and if your
> shutoff is after the regulator you may well lose all the gas in the
> cylinder if there is a failure.  Probably doesn't matter in your
> case!  This is also a reason regulators have an overpressure valve (OPV) -
> in case they fail open and deliver full cylinder pressure into the low
> pressure downstream line.  Quite important if you don't have a SCUBA second
> stage (that bit that goes in your mouth) installed.
>
> Also after the regulator there is no way of knowing what's left in the
> cylinder.  A contents gauge is only useful on the high pressure side.
>
> A useful resource for dealing with SCUBA regulators:  http://www.airspeedpress.com/
> newregbook.html <http://www.airspeedpress.com/newregbook.html>
>
> The cheapest SCUBA regulators are for argon and/or drysuit inflation.  Ie: https://www.divegearexpress.
> com/inflation-regulator-w-opv
> <https://www.divegearexpress.com/inflation-regulator-w-opv>
> They are not adjustable (but generally set to lower pressure, more like
> 100-125PSI) and often have slightly less flow.  I don't think the
> difference would be particularly significant for you.  They also tend to be
> 200bar DIN - so if you have a 300bar DIN valves they won't fit.
>
> SCUBA regulators for breathing are more expensive, but have higher flows
> and are meant to be more reliable, and adjustable.  You'd be looking for a
> DIN "first stage" (they are pretty much all dual 200/300bar compatible) and
> then you'll have to get a separate OPV. Ie:
> https://www.divegearexpress. com/regulators-spgs
> <https://www.divegearexpress.com/regulators-spgs>
>
> You'll also need one of these adaptors to turn the regulator outlet into
> NPT: https://www.divegearexpress. com/adapter-1-4-inch-npt-
> female-3-8-inch-m
> <https://www.divegearexpress.com/adapter-1-4-inch-npt-female-3-8-inch-m>
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
>
> On Fri, Oct 14, 2016 at 12:55 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> Steve,
>
> Thanks for the clarification on the DIN connector.  In terms of the
> pressure regulator, what device do most people use to regulate the air
> pressure?  Is this something I could purchase from a SCUBA parts supply
> company?
>
> Regards,
>
> Mark Widman
> 910-638-5229
>
> Sent from iPhone.
>
> On Oct 13, 2016, at 9:17 AM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o
> rg <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> 300 is short for 300 bar, or the recommended maximum pressure of the
> fitting, indicating that it is a deeper thread than 200/232 bar fittings.
> The latter can be used with yoke style regulators (CGA-850) by using an
> insert in the female DIN on the tank valve. The 300 bar connection, being
> deeper, precludes this but is stronger. Similarly, if you have a 300 bar
> DIN fitting on your regulator, and screw it into a 200 bar DIN tank valve,
> it is compatible, but will show a couple of exposed threads which can be
> entrapment points.
> DIN 477 is the actual thread specification.  Rarely seen in SCUBA
> equipment catalogs, but necessary if you're going to have a DIN thread
> machined.
> Sean
>
>
> On October 13, 2016 6:26:49 AM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o
> rg <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> Thanks Steve,
>
> This is exactly what I'm looking for.
> (1/4" m NPT x DIN 300 m)
>
> Sean recommended a DIN 477 connector, is there a difference (DIN 300 vs.
> DIN 477)?
>
> Lastly, I would like to regulate the air pressure to something more
> reasonable like 100 or so PSI.  Can you recommend an air pressure regulator?
>
> Regards,
>
> Mark Widman
> 910-638-5229
>
> Sent from iPhone.
>
> On Oct 12, 2016, at 10:27 PM, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o
> rg <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> Hi Mark,
> I have that sort of thing in my catalogue (TFM Engineering Australia),
> but being down under, not a lot of point sending them to you in the USA
> when you get can from the likes of:
> http://www.northshorecompresso r.com/products/17B477D22-M-
> NPT-x-DIN-300-M.html
> <http://www.northshorecompressor.com/products/17B477D22-M-NPT-x-DIN-300-M.html>http://
> www.northeastscubasupply.com/s earch.php?search_query=DIN+NPT &Search=
> <http://www.northeastscubasupply.com/search.php?search_query=DIN+NPT&Search=>
>
> You might be able to do a bit better if you look around - but avoid the
> ones with bleeders for your application in ca! se it gets knocked.
>
> Cheers
> Steve
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 13, 2016 at 6:44 AM, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o
> rg <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> Hi Sean,
>
> I have four SCUBA tanks mounted on the outside of the sub.  The SCUBA
> tanks are used to provide/control air for the external ballast tanks.  The
> air line runs from the SCUBA tank to a thru hull fitting in the sub (to a
> control valve) and then back out to the ballast tanks.  I need to acquire a
> connector from the SCUBA DIN to either NPT or JIC.
>
> If I can order a DIN 477 to NPT that would suffice.
>
> Regards,
>
> Mark Widman
> 910-638-5229
>
> Sent from iPhone.
>
> On Oct 12, 2016, at 3:15 PM, Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o
> rg <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> That's an oddball to find as a single piece, but you can certainly find
> male DIN 477 to e.g. NPT, and adapt that to a NPT/JIC.
> What are you building?
> Sean
>
>
> On October 12, 2016 12:49:50 PM MDT, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.o
> rg <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> Good afternoon, Psubs team:
>
> Do you know if and where I could purchase a SCUBA tank DIN to JIC connector?
>
> Regards,
>
> Mark...
> 910-638-5229
>
> Sent from iPhone.
>
> ------------------------------
>
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> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/l istinfo.cgi/personal_submersib les
> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>
>
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>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct 15 23:44:23 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2016 20:44:23 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] more progress
Message-ID: <20161015204423.77BEA48B@m0087792.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 04:44:58 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 08:44:58 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] more progress
In-Reply-To: <20161015204423.77BEA48B@m0087792.ppops.net>
References: <20161015204423.77BEA48B@m0087792.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <2080941432.506918.1476607498695@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,That must have been a treat to get it to fit just right. ?Can i make a suggestion? ?I can't see inside the hopper, so I?can't see if there is extra material around the bolts. ?I think you should weld some extra material to the hopper where the bolts go through. ?All the load will be on a small area and the bolts could tear out when the sub starts heaving. ?Hank 

    On Saturday, October 15, 2016 9:44 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi All,??????????????? Here are some pics of my emergency drop weight hopper for the lead ball release:??
_______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 11:30:42 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 08:30:42 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] more progress
Message-ID: <20161016083042.77BEAE30@m0087792.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 12:06:35 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:06:35 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] more progress
In-Reply-To: <20161016083042.77BEAE30@m0087792.ppops.net>
References: <20161016083042.77BEAE30@m0087792.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <165674402.648642.1476633995863@mail.yahoo.com>

Oh yes, I remember you saying that. ?I bet drilling it by hand was a bugger! ?Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 9:30 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,????????????? There is extra material in that area, I was?as thinking the same thing too, I was also going to put some extras support?bolts where it mates up to the ferro-cement hull as well.?? But once I got it all cinched up and tight I was amazed at the strength of the whole thing, I will definitely be putting some washers in there?.? Having to drill?that stainless was a bitch !? I could?weld some heavy duty washers in there or a piece of 1/4" flat bar with holes for the bolts for good measure.? I actually made a fiber-glass mold?of the kettle and first cut away on that before taking the grinder to the kettle itself.? ?Brian?????
--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] more progress
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 08:44:58 +0000 (UTC)

Brian,That must have been a treat to get it to fit just right. ?Can i make a suggestion? ?I can't see inside the hopper, so I?can't see if there is extra material around the bolts. ?I think you should weld some extra material to the hopper where the bolts go through. ?All the load will be on a small area and the bolts could tear out when the sub starts heaving. ?Hank 

    On Saturday, October 15, 2016 9:44 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi All,??????????????? Here are some pics of my emergency drop weight hopper for the lead ball release:??
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 12:18:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
References: <1358636543.646939.1476634723469.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1358636543.646939.1476634723469@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi all,I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water. ?I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board. ?The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume. ?Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit. ?I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer. ?So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water. ?The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer. ?To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer. ?I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.Easy PeezyHank
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 13:20:51 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 10:20:51 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] more progress
Message-ID: <20161016102051.5A2ECF9B@m0086238.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 13:21:18 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 10:21:18 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Message-ID: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 13:28:54 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 17:28:54 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>

There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake) ?yes the start of the mighty Columbia river. ? ?The A frame will allow me to dive there.Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Interesting idea !?

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)

Hi all,I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water. ?I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board. ?The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume. ?Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit. ?I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer. ?So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water. ?The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer. ?To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer. ?I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.Easy PeezyHank_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 15:20:30 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 08:20:30 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <ED010192-8057-48D4-9A37-89A4F4C43E58@yahoo.com>

Hank, what is the problem. Is the ramp not long enough, or not steep enough!
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake)  yes the start of the mighty Columbia river.    The A frame will allow me to dive there.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Interesting idea ! 
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
> Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Hi all,
> I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water.  I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board.  The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume.  Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.
> But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit.  I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer.  So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water.  The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer.  To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer.  I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.
> Easy Peezy
> Hank
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 15:29:51 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 08:29:51 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>

Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a more
beefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgs
Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake)  yes the start of the mighty Columbia river.    The A frame will allow me to dive there.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Interesting idea ! 
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
> Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Hi all,
> I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water.  I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board.  The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume.  Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.
> But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit.  I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer.  So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water.  The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer.  To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer.  I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.
> Easy Peezy
> Hank
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 16:16:47 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 20:16:47 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <702208818.744486.1476649007337@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,?That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail. ?Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off. ?Gamma has a raked guard now,?hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work. ?I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though. ?The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out. ?The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom.?Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a morebeefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgsAlan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake) ?yes the start of the mighty Columbia river. ? ?The A frame will allow me to dive there.Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Interesting idea !?

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)

Hi all,I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water. ?I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board. ?The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume. ?Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit. ?I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer. ?So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water. ?The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer. ?To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer. ?I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.Easy PeezyHank_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 17:05:02 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 10:05:02 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <702208818.744486.1476649007337@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>
 <702208818.744486.1476649007337@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <36608F86-35E6-4329-B67C-71AEEC523ADB@yahoo.com>

Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.
What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags low down
on the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.
   Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing..... you
have a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards on the
end of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the props under,
then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then use it as a tender 
to get to your dive spot.!
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan, 
> That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail.  Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off.  Gamma has a raked guard now, hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work.  I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though.  
> The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out.  The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom. 
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a more
> beefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)
> https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgs
> Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake)  yes the start of the mighty Columbia river.    The A frame will allow me to dive there.
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Interesting idea ! 
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
>> Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water.  I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board.  The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume.  Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.
>> But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit.  I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer.  So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water.  The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer.  To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer.  I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.
>> Easy Peezy
>> Hank
>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 17:41:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 21:41:38 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <36608F86-35E6-4329-B67C-71AEEC523ADB@yahoo.com>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>
 <702208818.744486.1476649007337@mail.yahoo.com>
 <36608F86-35E6-4329-B67C-71AEEC523ADB@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1723655726.746341.1476654098624@mail.yahoo.com>

My floating launch cart was better on paper than in the water lol. ?I don't like the idea of temporary lift from bags, I think it will tip over.I am thinking about a drop down beavertail, and hydraulic driven rollers. ?I am sure there will be a new idea tomorrow.Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 3:05 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags low downon the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.? ?Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing..... youhave a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards on theend of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the props under,then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then use it as a tender?to get to your dive spot.!Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,?That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail. ?Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off. ?Gamma has a raked guard now,?hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work. ?I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though. ?The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out. ?The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom.?Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a morebeefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgsAlan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake) ?yes the start of the mighty Columbia river. ? ?The A frame will allow me to dive there.Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Interesting idea !?

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)

Hi all,I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water. ?I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board. ?The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume. ?Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit. ?I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer. ?So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water. ?The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer. ?To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer. ?I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.Easy PeezyHank_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 23:37:33 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (T Novak via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 20:37:33 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: vtHbb2oUyfdZcvtHdbgFQq
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>
 <702208818.744486.1476649007337@mail.yahoo.com>
 <36608F86-35E6-4329-B67C-71AEEC523ADB@yahoo.com> vtHbb2oUyfdZcvtHdbgFQq
Message-ID: <002501d22827$cd083b30$6718b190$@telus.net>

Hank,

If the sub will be float clear of the bottom within reach of an A-frame crane on the trailer, would a double beavertail (photo) work for you instead of the crane? A double, or triple, beavertail may be sufficient to roll the sub off into sufficiently deep water.  Rather than rollers on the trailer, perhaps rollers on the sub's skids that would then match up with gutter tracks on the beavertail and trailer bed?  At least one psub out there has rollers on its skids. The skids should also have a ski-tip on each end to allow the winch to drag the sub through the mud-sand substrate to launch and recover.

Tim

 

From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2016 2:42 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch

 

My floating launch cart was better on paper than in the water lol.  I don't like the idea of temporary lift from bags, I think it will tip over. 

I am thinking about a drop down beavertail, and hydraulic driven rollers.  I am sure there will be a new idea tomorrow.

Hank

 

On Sunday, October 16, 2016 3:05 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote:

 

Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.

What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags low down

on the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.

   Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing..... you

have a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards on the

end of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the props under,

then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then use it as a tender 

to get to your dive spot.!

Alan

Sent from my iPad


On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote:

Alan, 

That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail.  Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off.  Gamma has a raked guard now, hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work.  I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though.  

The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out.  The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom. 

Hank

 

On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote:

 

Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a more

beefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgs

Alan



Sent from my iPad


On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote:

There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake)  yes the start of the mighty Columbia river.    The A frame will allow me to dive there.

Hank

 

On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> > wrote:

 

Interesting idea ! 

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org>  wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:personal_submersibles at psubs.org> >
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)

Hi all,

I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water.  I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board.  The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume.  Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.

But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit.  I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer.  So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water.  The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer.  To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer.  I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.

Easy Peezy

Hank

_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles 

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org> 
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org> 
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org <mailto:Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org> 
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

_______________________________________________
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http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 16 23:59:56 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 23:59:56 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 40, Issue 38
In-Reply-To: <mailman.659.1476651883.850.personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
References: <mailman.659.1476651883.850.personal_submersibles@psubs.org>
Message-ID: <CAGL1GvEtJG5FLL94BDi4nz0vyzhkadpAzGYQzs_tVP09Tk9Bgw@mail.gmail.com>

Lifting a sub of even modest weight off of a trailer using a rotating A
frame will require a rather large counter weight on the tongue. I wouldn't
trust the hitch alone to hold back that much torque in the wrong direction.
I think a simpler solution would be to just attach large wheels to the sub
ala Simon Lake's Argonaut. Then any standard twin axle car trailer with a
winch would work for sub duty. This would probably be a good system for
someone who owns multiple subs. No need to build (or register and insure) a
custom trailer for every sub you build. Three large wheels on the sub could
be locked for transport easier than dozens of rollers. You would still have
trouble with launches from gently sloping,shallow, muddy shores though
since the wheels might bog down. You'd have a hard time launching a sub
using any method in those conditions though.

-- 
-River J. Dolfi


rdolfi7 at gmail.com
rwd5301 at psu.edu
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 00:00:47 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 00:00:47 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Message-ID: <CAGL1GvFJbL5BAgxy4XmtTAGv+BOLRBDqJhm=qURZCX5YQb9A-A@mail.gmail.com>

Lifting a sub of even modest weight off of a trailer using a rotating A
frame will require a rather large counter weight on the tongue. I wouldn't
trust the hitch alone to hold back that much torque in the wrong direction.
I think a simpler solution would be to just attach large wheels to the sub
ala Simon Lake's Argonaut. Then any standard twin axle car trailer with a
winch would work for sub duty. This would probably be a good system for
someone who owns multiple subs. No need to build (or register and insure) a
custom trailer for every sub you build. Three large wheels on the sub could
be locked for transport easier than dozens of rollers. You would still have
trouble with launches from gently sloping,shallow, muddy shores though
since the wheels might bog down. You'd have a hard time launching a sub
using any method in those conditions though.


-- 
-River J. Dolfi

412-997-2526
rdolfi7 at gmail.com
rwd5301 at psu.edu
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 03:16:18 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 20:16:18 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Submarine training manual
Message-ID: <91717C2B-1ECC-42A7-A374-63EB677C036D@yahoo.com>

Stumbled across this training manual for S - class submarines (1918-1925)
https://archive.hnsa.org/doc/s-boat/index.htm
Might be of interest to someone.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 06:11:02 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 10:11:02 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <CAGL1GvFJbL5BAgxy4XmtTAGv+BOLRBDqJhm=qURZCX5YQb9A-A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGL1GvFJbL5BAgxy4XmtTAGv+BOLRBDqJhm=qURZCX5YQb9A-A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <609179379.1055909.1476699062962@mail.yahoo.com>

The sub trailer I am using is a long boat trailer that had a jet ski lift on it. ?The lift consisted of two A frames with two racks for the jet skis to sit on. The A frames pivoted all the way back into the water, then the jet skis floated into the racks. ?The A frames then lifted the jet ski's up above the boat, then you float the boat onto the trailer. ?It was like a double decker trailer. ? ?Jet skis must weigh 400 lbs or so? ? that means it can lift 800 lbs. ? I would no expect to lift any more than an 800 lb load with the A frame when lifting the sub. ?Remember ?the sub is in the water so there is not a lot of weight there to lift an inch or two. ?No need for counter weight because the load is not extending far beyond the end of the trailer and the trailer is about 28 feet long. ?Alan might be onto a better idea though, a simple manual ?beavertail to deflect the sub onto a roller may be simpler idea.Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 10:01 PM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Lifting a sub of even modest weight off of a trailer using a rotating A frame will require a rather large counter weight on the tongue. I wouldn't trust the hitch alone to hold back that much torque in the wrong direction. I think a simpler solution would be to just attach large wheels to the sub ala Simon Lake's Argonaut. Then any standard twin axle car trailer with a winch would work for sub duty. This would probably be a good system for someone who owns multiple subs. No need to build (or register and insure) a custom trailer for every sub you build. Three large wheels on the sub could be locked for transport easier than dozens of rollers. You would still have trouble with launches from gently sloping,shallow, muddy shores though since the wheels might bog down. You'd have a hard time launching a sub using any method in those conditions though.

-- 
-River J. Dolfi
412-997-2526rdolfi7 at gmail.comrwd5301@psu.edu
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 06:15:24 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 11:15:24 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UDYsqZkk0y32d=Wo63=PKH2rzxB-WL30C2-n5SHNtetTg@mail.gmail.com>

Just in temporary old garage.  Cleaned up a treat with 20% hydrochloric
acid...  Chucks and toolposts still to do.  Took all day this.


?
?
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 06:26:03 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 11:26:03 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <609179379.1055909.1476699062962@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <CAGL1GvFJbL5BAgxy4XmtTAGv+BOLRBDqJhm=qURZCX5YQb9A-A@mail.gmail.com>
 <609179379.1055909.1476699062962@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UBSWZdNowPatUYjB23eSFYc1Xa_yXUFGRknBhQSiimm0g@mail.gmail.com>

Hank\Alan.  I am keeping a close eye on how you get on with this.
Launching is still my biggest issue.  I want to be able to get my boat off
a trailer onto the beach and of course, back on.  I have some really good
bays here that I cant get into as there is no suitable slipway, but I can
get onto the sand.

My ultimate solution is a standard skip truck.  Ive measured up a normal
truck and it would work.  But its an expensive way of doing it and I don't
have anywhere to put the truck.


?

On 17 October 2016 at 11:11, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> The sub trailer I am using is a long boat trailer that had a jet ski lift
> on it.  The lift consisted of two A frames with two racks for the jet skis
> to sit on. The A frames pivoted all the way back into the water, then the
> jet skis floated into the racks.  The A frames then lifted the jet ski's up
> above the boat, then you float the boat onto the trailer.  It was like a
> double decker trailer.    Jet skis must weigh 400 lbs or so?   that means
> it can lift 800 lbs.   I would no expect to lift any more than an 800 lb
> load with the A frame when lifting the sub.  Remember  the sub is in the
> water so there is not a lot of weight there to lift an inch or two.  No
> need for counter weight because the load is not extending far beyond the
> end of the trailer and the trailer is about 28 feet long.
> Alan might be onto a better idea though, a simple manual  beavertail to
> deflect the sub onto a roller may be simpler idea.
> Hank
>
>
> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 10:01 PM, River Dolfi via
> Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
> Lifting a sub of even modest weight off of a trailer using a rotating A
> frame will require a rather large counter weight on the tongue. I wouldn't
> trust the hitch alone to hold back that much torque in the wrong direction.
> I think a simpler solution would be to just attach large wheels to the sub
> ala Simon Lake's Argonaut. Then any standard twin axle car trailer with a
> winch would work for sub duty. This would probably be a good system for
> someone who owns multiple subs. No need to build (or register and insure) a
> custom trailer for every sub you build. Three large wheels on the sub could
> be locked for transport easier than dozens of rollers. You would still have
> trouble with launches from gently sloping,shallow, muddy shores though
> since the wheels might bog down. You'd have a hard time launching a sub
> using any method in those conditions though.
>
>
> --
> -River J. Dolfi
>
> 412-997-2526
> rdolfi7 at gmail.com
> rwd5301 at psu.edu
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 06:26:42 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 10:26:42 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <002501d22827$cd083b30$6718b190$@telus.net>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>
 <702208818.744486.1476649007337@mail.yahoo.com>
 <36608F86-35E6-4329-B67C-71AEEC523ADB@yahoo.com>
 <002501d22827$cd083b30$6718b190$@telus.net>
Message-ID: <1116841670.1068162.1476700002541@mail.yahoo.com>

Tim,Rollers under the skids is ideal. ?Problem is I don't have skids. ?Gamma does have a nice raked bumper that is intended to protect the dome when the sub comes up to the trailer and to deflect the sub onto the trailer. ?some times when I launch the sub the water is not deep enough and I can just lift the sub and slide it off by hand. ?In a case like that, the hand winch can pull the sub onto the trailer by sliding the sub on the raked bumper. ??I kept all the hydraulic lift stuff from the trailer, so I have a couple options.?Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 9:38 PM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 #yiv9319147639 #yiv9319147639 -- _filtered #yiv9319147639 {font-family:Helvetica;panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;} _filtered #yiv9319147639 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv9319147639 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}#yiv9319147639 #yiv9319147639 p.yiv9319147639MsoNormal, #yiv9319147639 li.yiv9319147639MsoNormal, #yiv9319147639 div.yiv9319147639MsoNormal {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv9319147639 a:link, #yiv9319147639 span.yiv9319147639MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv9319147639 a:visited, #yiv9319147639 span.yiv9319147639MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv9319147639 span.yiv9319147639EmailStyle17 {color:#1F497D;}#yiv9319147639 .yiv9319147639MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;} _filtered #yiv9319147639 {margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}#yiv9319147639 div.yiv9319147639WordSection1 {}#yiv9319147639 Hank,If the sub will be float clear of the bottom within reach of an A-frame crane on the trailer, would a double beavertail (photo) work for you instead of the crane? A double, or triple, beavertail may be sufficient to roll the sub off into sufficiently deep water.? Rather than rollers on the trailer, perhaps rollers on the sub's skids that would then match up with gutter tracks on the beavertail and trailer bed?? At least one psub out there has rollers on its skids. The skids should also have a ski-tip on each end to allow the winch to drag the sub through the mud-sand substrate to launch and recover.Tim ?From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2016 2:42 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch ?My floating launch cart was better on paper than in the water lol. ?I don't like the idea of temporary lift from bags, I think it will tip over. I am thinking about a drop down beavertail, and hydraulic driven rollers. ?I am sure there will be a new idea tomorrow.Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 3:05 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags low downon the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.? ?Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing..... youhave a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards on theend of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the props under,then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then use it as a tender?to get to your dive spot.!Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
Alan,?That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail. ?Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off. ?Gamma has a raked guard now,?hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work. ?I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though. ?The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out. ?The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom.?Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a morebeefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgsAlan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake) ?yes the start of the mighty Columbia river. ? ?The A frame will allow me to dive there.Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Interesting idea !?

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)Hi all,I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water. ?I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board. ?The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume. ?Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit. ?I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer. ?So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water. ?The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer. ?To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer. ?I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.Easy PeezyHank_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles  ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
 ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
 ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?
_______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 07:13:47 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 13:13:47 +0200
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UDYsqZkk0y32d=Wo63=PKH2rzxB-WL30C2-n5SHNtetTg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHpB=UDYsqZkk0y32d=Wo63=PKH2rzxB-WL30C2-n5SHNtetTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <022f01d22867$87c876d0$97596470$@nl>

Ha, better keep it oiled to prevent that!.

 

I recognize a Colchester master 2000 or 2500 ..

 

Emile

 

 

Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: maandag 17 oktober 2016 12:15
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After

 

Just in temporary old garage.  Cleaned up a treat with 20% hydrochloric acid...  Chucks and toolposts still to do.  Took all day this.

 




?
?

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 08:17:18 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 13:17:18 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After
In-Reply-To: <022f01d22867$87c876d0$97596470$@nl>
References: <CAHpB=UDYsqZkk0y32d=Wo63=PKH2rzxB-WL30C2-n5SHNtetTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <022f01d22867$87c876d0$97596470$@nl>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UC0pWiQtBkeM-UvXwaDc7cfMbZ2rCdqSyecFpaAP_MdaQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Emile\all

Its a Colchester Triumph 2000.

Just had a lathe nightmare.  Sent these pictures this morning all happy
with my weekends cleaning.  Went around for lunch to find all previously
cleaned metal parts, now oxidised again, almost to how it was before I
started.

Luckily a light lunchtime rub down has taken it back to clean ish, but it
needs more.  I had oiled the beds and all exposed parts with WD40 before
leaving it after my days cleaning.  Obviously its oxidised  up again, but
why so fast?

I have cleaned it up as best I could in 20 minutes and left it literally
swimming in oil.

Time for some serious googling......

Anyone any ideas on this rapid return to rust?  And in particular how to
stop it?

Thanks
James




On 17 October 2016 at 12:13, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Ha, better keep it oiled to prevent that!.
>
>
>
> I recognize a Colchester master 2000 or 2500 ..
>
>
>
> Emile
>
>
>
>
>
> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> bounces at psubs.org] *Namens *James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles
> *Verzonden:* maandag 17 oktober 2016 12:15
> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After
>
>
>
> Just in temporary old garage.  Cleaned up a treat with 20% hydrochloric
> acid...  Chucks and toolposts still to do.  Took all day this.
>
>
>
>
> ?
> ?
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 09:02:16 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 15:02:16 +0200
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UC0pWiQtBkeM-UvXwaDc7cfMbZ2rCdqSyecFpaAP_MdaQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHpB=UDYsqZkk0y32d=Wo63=PKH2rzxB-WL30C2-n5SHNtetTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <022f01d22867$87c876d0$97596470$@nl>
 <CAHpB=UC0pWiQtBkeM-UvXwaDc7cfMbZ2rCdqSyecFpaAP_MdaQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <025901d22876$af7491f0$0e5db5d0$@nl>

The acid goes in the porosity of the cast iron. Problem might stay for a while..

And you are surrounded by the salty sea.. Lucky that your Defender is galvanized ;-)

 

Emile

 

Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: maandag 17 oktober 2016 14:17
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After

 

Hi Emile\all

 

Its a Colchester Triumph 2000.

 

Just had a lathe nightmare.  Sent these pictures this morning all happy with my weekends cleaning.  Went around for lunch to find all previously cleaned metal parts, now oxidised again, almost to how it was before I started.

 

Luckily a light lunchtime rub down has taken it back to clean ish, but it needs more.  I had oiled the beds and all exposed parts with WD40 before leaving it after my days cleaning.  Obviously its oxidised  up again, but why so fast?

 

I have cleaned it up as best I could in 20 minutes and left it literally swimming in oil.

 

Time for some serious googling......

 

Anyone any ideas on this rapid return to rust?  And in particular how to stop it?

 

Thanks

James

 

 

 

 

On 17 October 2016 at 12:13, emile via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Ha, better keep it oiled to prevent that!.

 

I recognize a Colchester master 2000 or 2500 ..

 

Emile

 

 

Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: maandag 17 oktober 2016 12:15
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After

 

Just in temporary old garage.  Cleaned up a treat with 20% hydrochloric acid...  Chucks and toolposts still to do.  Took all day this.

 




?
?


_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 09:30:40 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 14:30:40 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After
In-Reply-To: <025901d22876$af7491f0$0e5db5d0$@nl>
References: <CAHpB=UDYsqZkk0y32d=Wo63=PKH2rzxB-WL30C2-n5SHNtetTg@mail.gmail.com>
 <022f01d22867$87c876d0$97596470$@nl>
 <CAHpB=UC0pWiQtBkeM-UvXwaDc7cfMbZ2rCdqSyecFpaAP_MdaQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <025901d22876$af7491f0$0e5db5d0$@nl>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UDS-FPkNXXyf=fEsNTPkFYPUmzRfbqNRW50JTxDsJtPuw@mail.gmail.com>

oh dear.  I was so pleased with how it turned out.

I suppose I will just have to keep wiping\cleaning until it stops.

and yes....cars here disintegrate.  Bought a 1974 VW Beetle a while
ago.  35 years in the UK and it was still good.  1 year in
Guernsey.......disintegrated.... :(



On 17 October 2016 at 14:02, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> The acid goes in the porosity of the cast iron. Problem might stay for a
> while..
>
> And you are surrounded by the salty sea.. Lucky that your Defender is
> galvanized ;-)
>
>
>
> Emile
>
>
>
> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> bounces at psubs.org] *Namens *James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles
> *Verzonden:* maandag 17 oktober 2016 14:17
> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> *Onderwerp:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After
>
>
>
> Hi Emile\all
>
>
>
> Its a Colchester Triumph 2000.
>
>
>
> Just had a lathe nightmare.  Sent these pictures this morning all happy
> with my weekends cleaning.  Went around for lunch to find all previously
> cleaned metal parts, now oxidised again, almost to how it was before I
> started.
>
>
>
> Luckily a light lunchtime rub down has taken it back to clean ish, but it
> needs more.  I had oiled the beds and all exposed parts with WD40 before
> leaving it after my days cleaning.  Obviously its oxidised  up again, but
> why so fast?
>
>
>
> I have cleaned it up as best I could in 20 minutes and left it literally
> swimming in oil.
>
>
>
> Time for some serious googling......
>
>
>
> Anyone any ideas on this rapid return to rust?  And in particular how to
> stop it?
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
> James
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 17 October 2016 at 12:13, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Ha, better keep it oiled to prevent that!.
>
>
>
> I recognize a Colchester master 2000 or 2500 ..
>
>
>
> Emile
>
>
>
>
>
> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> bounces at psubs.org] *Namens *James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles
> *Verzonden:* maandag 17 oktober 2016 12:15
> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Lathe Before\After
>
>
>
> Just in temporary old garage.  Cleaned up a treat with 20% hydrochloric
> acid...  Chucks and toolposts still to do.  Took all day this.
>
>
>
>
> ?
> ?
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 09:32:49 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 15:32:49 +0200
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UBSWZdNowPatUYjB23eSFYc1Xa_yXUFGRknBhQSiimm0g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGL1GvFJbL5BAgxy4XmtTAGv+BOLRBDqJhm=qURZCX5YQb9A-A@mail.gmail.com>
 <609179379.1055909.1476699062962@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UBSWZdNowPatUYjB23eSFYc1Xa_yXUFGRknBhQSiimm0g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <026801d2287a$f4642290$dd2c67b0$@nl>

James,

 

Consider a triple axle trailer. I have one now and the ground pressure is so reduced that it can drive on sand and gras.

Maybe you can bolt on a extra axle under the existing trailer.

A truck with crane is top of the bill off coarse.

 

Emile

 

Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: maandag 17 oktober 2016 12:26
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch

 

Hank\Alan.  I am keeping a close eye on how you get on with this.  Launching is still my biggest issue.  I want to be able to get my boat off a trailer onto the beach and of course, back on.  I have some really good bays here that I cant get into as there is no suitable slipway, but I can get onto the sand. 

 

My ultimate solution is a standard skip truck.  Ive measured up a normal truck and it would work.  But its an expensive way of doing it and I don't have anywhere to put the truck.

 


?

 

On 17 October 2016 at 11:11, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

The sub trailer I am using is a long boat trailer that had a jet ski lift on it.  The lift consisted of two A frames with two racks for the jet skis to sit on. The A frames pivoted all the way back into the water, then the jet skis floated into the racks.  The A frames then lifted the jet ski's up above the boat, then you float the boat onto the trailer.  It was like a double decker trailer.    Jet skis must weigh 400 lbs or so?   that means it can lift 800 lbs.   I would no expect to lift any more than an 800 lb load with the A frame when lifting the sub.  Remember  the sub is in the water so there is not a lot of weight there to lift an inch or two.  No need for counter weight because the load is not extending far beyond the end of the trailer and the trailer is about 28 feet long.  

Alan might be onto a better idea though, a simple manual  beavertail to deflect the sub onto a roller may be simpler idea.

Hank

 

On Sunday, October 16, 2016 10:01 PM, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

 

Lifting a sub of even modest weight off of a trailer using a rotating A frame will require a rather large counter weight on the tongue. I wouldn't trust the hitch alone to hold back that much torque in the wrong direction. I think a simpler solution would be to just attach large wheels to the sub ala Simon Lake's Argonaut. Then any standard twin axle car trailer with a winch would work for sub duty. This would probably be a good system for someone who owns multiple subs. No need to build (or register and insure) a custom trailer for every sub you build. Three large wheels on the sub could be locked for transport easier than dozens of rollers. You would still have trouble with launches from gently sloping,shallow, muddy shores though since the wheels might bog down. You'd have a hard time launching a sub using any method in those conditions though.




 

-- 

-River J. Dolfi

 

412-997-2526

rdolfi7 at gmail.com

rwd5301 at psu.edu

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles




_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 15:12:57 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 08:12:57 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <1116841670.1068162.1476700002541@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>
 <702208818.744486.1476649007337@mail.yahoo.com>
 <36608F86-35E6-4329-B67C-71AEEC523ADB@yahoo.com>
 <002501d22827$cd083b30$6718b190$@telus.net>
 <1116841670.1068162.1476700002541@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <873D355A-5C49-441E-B790-4A599A58B2AE@yahoo.com>

Hank,
after more thought, maybe the cheapest easiest way would be to have a
telescopic extension tube between the truck & trailer. Like the traditional
method but a lot longer. It would be easy to make; just 3 tubes of varying
diameters, with holes for bolts to go through to lock in place. One problem 
would be lifting it in to place with the added weight. You would
also then need a small tender to get to your sub. Of course there 
could be the odd problem of drop offs at the end of the boat ramp!
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 17/10/2016, at 11:26 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Tim,
> Rollers under the skids is ideal.  Problem is I don't have skids.  Gamma does have a nice raked bumper that is intended to protect the dome when the sub comes up to the trailer and to deflect the sub onto the trailer.  some times when I launch the sub the water is not deep enough and I can just lift the sub and slide it off by hand.  In a case like that, the hand winch can pull the sub onto the trailer by sliding the sub on the raked bumper.   
> I kept all the hydraulic lift stuff from the trailer, so I have a couple options. 
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 9:38 PM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hank,
> If the sub will be float clear of the bottom within reach of an A-frame crane on the trailer, would a double beavertail (photo) work for you instead of the crane? A double, or triple, beavertail may be sufficient to roll the sub off into sufficiently deep water.  Rather than rollers on the trailer, perhaps rollers on the sub's skids that would then match up with gutter tracks on the beavertail and trailer bed?  At least one psub out there has rollers on its skids. The skids should also have a ski-tip on each end to allow the winch to drag the sub through the mud-sand substrate to launch and recover.
> Tim
>  
> From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
> Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2016 2:42 PM
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
>  
> My floating launch cart was better on paper than in the water lol.  I don't like the idea of temporary lift from bags, I think it will tip over.
> I am thinking about a drop down beavertail, and hydraulic driven rollers.  I am sure there will be a new idea tomorrow.
> Hank
>  
> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 3:05 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>  
> Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.
> What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags low down
> on the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.
>    Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing..... you
> have a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards on the
> end of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the props under,
> then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then use it as a tender 
> to get to your dive spot.!
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> Alan, 
> That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail.  Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off.  Gamma has a raked guard now, hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work.  I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though.  
> The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out.  The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom. 
> Hank
>  
> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>  
> Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a more
> beefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)
> https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgs
> Alan
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake)  yes the start of the mighty Columbia river.    The A frame will allow me to dive there.
> Hank
>  
> On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>  
> Interesting idea ! 
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
> Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)
> Hi all,
> I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water.  I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board.  The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume.  Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.
> But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit.  I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer.  So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water.  The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer.  To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer.  I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.
> Easy Peezy
> Hank
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>  
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 16:43:53 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 13:43:53 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Message-ID: <20161017134353.77BF0701@m0087792.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 17:00:22 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 21:00:22 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <20161017134353.77BF0701@m0087792.ppops.net>
References: <20161017134353.77BF0701@m0087792.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <251143953.1561119.1476738022725@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,When my sub came of the cart last year, I had to bring in a 20 ton truck crane to rescue the sub off the ramp ;-( ?my wife said I should buy one of those (crane truck) ?She said that was real easy with the crane. ??Hank 

    On Monday, October 17, 2016 2:44 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 A big giant crane !

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 08:12:57 +1300

Hank,after more thought, maybe the cheapest easiest way would be to have atelescopic extension tube between the truck & trailer. Like the traditionalmethod but a lot longer. It would be easy to make; just 3 tubes of varyingdiameters, with holes for bolts to go through to lock in place. One problem?would be lifting it in to place with the added weight. You wouldalso then need a small tender to get to your sub. Of course there?could be the odd problem of drop offs at the end of the boat ramp!Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 11:26 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Tim,Rollers under the skids is ideal. ?Problem is I don't have skids. ?Gamma does have a nice raked bumper that is intended to protect the dome when the sub comes up to the trailer and to deflect the sub onto the trailer. ?some times when I launch the sub the water is not deep enough and I can just lift the sub and slide it off by hand. ?In a case like that, the hand winch can pull the sub onto the trailer by sliding the sub on the raked bumper. ??I kept all the hydraulic lift stuff from the trailer, so I have a couple options.?Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 9:38 PM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,If the sub will be float clear of the bottom within reach of an A-frame crane on the trailer, would a double beavertail (photo) work for you instead of the crane? A double, or triple, beavertail may be sufficient to roll the sub off into sufficiently deep water.? Rather than rollers on the trailer, perhaps rollers on the sub's skids that would then match up with gutter tracks on the beavertail and trailer bed?? At least one psub out there has rollers on its skids. The skids should also have a ski-tip on each end to allow the winch to drag the sub through the mud-sand substrate to launch and recover.Tim ?From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2016 2:42 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch ?My floating launch cart was better on paper than in the water lol. ?I don't like the idea of temporary lift from bags, I think it will tip over. I am thinking about a drop down beavertail, and hydraulic driven rollers. ?I am sure there will be a new idea tomorrow.Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 3:05 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags low downon the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.? ?Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing..... youhave a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards on theend of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the props under,then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then use it as a tender?to get to your dive spot.!Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
Alan,?That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail. ?Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off. ?Gamma has a raked guard now,?hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work. ?I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though. ?The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out. ?The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom.?Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a morebeefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgsAlan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake) ?yes the start of the mighty Columbia river. ? ?The A frame will allow me to dive there.Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Interesting idea !?

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)Hi all,I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water. ?I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board. ?The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume. ?Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit. ?I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer. ?So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water. ?The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer. ?To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer. ?I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.Easy PeezyHank_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles  ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
 ?_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?

_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
 ?_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
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_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 16:57:11 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 20:57:11 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <873D355A-5C49-441E-B790-4A599A58B2AE@yahoo.com>
References: <20161016102118.5A2ECFE0@m0086238.ppops.net>
 <596871851.680222.1476638934436@mail.yahoo.com>
 <0547F12E-5B76-49FD-98E5-21DD18B83DFE@yahoo.com>
 <702208818.744486.1476649007337@mail.yahoo.com>
 <36608F86-35E6-4329-B67C-71AEEC523ADB@yahoo.com>
 <002501d22827$cd083b30$6718b190$@telus.net>
 <1116841670.1068162.1476700002541@mail.yahoo.com>
 <873D355A-5C49-441E-B790-4A599A58B2AE@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1423864416.1561238.1476737832018@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,An extension pole won't help because the lake is not deep enough for the sub on the trailer for 100 feet. ?I think the A frame or beavertail with rollers will be good. ?The trailer already has a hydraulic A frame, just have to put it back on.Hank 

    On Monday, October 17, 2016 1:13 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,after more thought, maybe the cheapest easiest way would be to have atelescopic extension tube between the truck & trailer. Like the traditionalmethod but a lot longer. It would be easy to make; just 3 tubes of varyingdiameters, with holes for bolts to go through to lock in place. One problem?would be lifting it in to place with the added weight. You wouldalso then need a small tender to get to your sub. Of course there?could be the odd problem of drop offs at the end of the boat ramp!Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 11:26 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Tim,Rollers under the skids is ideal. ?Problem is I don't have skids. ?Gamma does have a nice raked bumper that is intended to protect the dome when the sub comes up to the trailer and to deflect the sub onto the trailer. ?some times when I launch the sub the water is not deep enough and I can just lift the sub and slide it off by hand. ?In a case like that, the hand winch can pull the sub onto the trailer by sliding the sub on the raked bumper. ??I kept all the hydraulic lift stuff from the trailer, so I have a couple options.?Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 9:38 PM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 #yiv9587615262 -- filtered {font-family:Helvetica;panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;}#yiv9587615262 filtered {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}#yiv9587615262 filtered {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}#yiv9587615262 p.yiv9587615262MsoNormal, #yiv9587615262 li.yiv9587615262MsoNormal, #yiv9587615262 div.yiv9587615262MsoNormal {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv9587615262 a:link, #yiv9587615262 span.yiv9587615262MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv9587615262 a:visited, #yiv9587615262 span.yiv9587615262MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv9587615262 span.yiv9587615262EmailStyle17 {color:#1F497D;}#yiv9587615262 .yiv9587615262MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;}#yiv9587615262 filtered {margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}#yiv9587615262 div.yiv9587615262WordSection1 {}#yiv9587615262 Hank,If the sub will be float clear of the bottom within reach of an A-frame crane on the trailer, would a double beavertail (photo) work for you instead of the crane? A double, or triple, beavertail may be sufficient to roll the sub off into sufficiently deep water.? Rather than rollers on the trailer, perhaps rollers on the sub's skids that would then match up with gutter tracks on the beavertail and trailer bed?? At least one psub out there has rollers on its skids. The skids should also have a ski-tip on each end to allow the winch to drag the sub through the mud-sand substrate to launch and recover.Tim ?From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2016 2:42 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch ?My floating launch cart was better on paper than in the water lol. ?I don't like the idea of temporary lift from bags, I think it will tip over. I am thinking about a drop down beavertail, and hydraulic driven rollers. ?I am sure there will be a new idea tomorrow.Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 3:05 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags low downon the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.? ?Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing..... youhave a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards on theend of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the props under,then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then use it as a tender?to get to your dive spot.!Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
Alan,?That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail. ?Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off. ?Gamma has a raked guard now,?hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work. ?I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though. ?The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out. ?The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom.?Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a morebeefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgsAlan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake) ?yes the start of the mighty Columbia river. ? ?The A frame will allow me to dive there.Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Interesting idea !?

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)Hi all,I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water. ?I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board. ?The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume. ?Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit. ?I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer. ?So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water. ?The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer. ?To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer. ?I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.Easy PeezyHank_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles  ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
 ?_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
 ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?
_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 17:05:13 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 21:05:13 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <DM3PR1201MB10219BF06061E64068FE7BA2DFD00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB10219BF06061E64068FE7BA2DFD00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <694644529.1554895.1476738313194@mail.yahoo.com>

I can buy this crane for 11,500 in certification locally. ? ?I might look silly towing Gamma behind this.Hank

     On Monday, October 17, 2016 3:03 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 17:59:05 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (roberto alvarez via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 17:59:05 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] =?utf-8?q?=C3=9Anete_a_Meetup_en_tu_ciudad?=
Message-ID: <411897294.1476741545921.JavaMail.nobody@app12.phi.meetup.com>

roberto alvarez te invita a unirte a Meetup

--------------------------------------

?Qu? es Meetup?

Meetup es la red de grupos locales m?s grande del mundo. Meetup permite a cualquier persona organizar un grupo local, o encontrar uno de los miles de grupos que ya existen y se re?nen cara a cara. Es gratis, simple, y solo toma unos minutos comenzar.

--------------------------------------

Unirse a Meetup


https://secure.meetup.com/n/?s=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJkZXN0IjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zZWN1cmUubWVldHVwLmNvbS9lcy1FUy9yZWdpc3Rlci8_X3h0ZD1ncXRsYldGcGJGOWpiR2xqYTlvQUpESXlZamcxT0daakxXWmxaakF0TkRVeU15MWlOelF3TFRjek9UVTFPREUzTldJeVk2cHBiblpwZEdWbFgybGtxREUxTkRrMU1Ua3gmcmc9dHMxJmN0eD1pbnYmdGFyZ2V0VXJpPWh0dHBzJTNBJTJGJTJGd3d3Lm1lZXR1cC5jb20lMkZlcy1FUyUyRiUzRnJnJTNEdHMxIiwiaG9vayI6ImludiIsImVtYWlsX2ludml0ZWVfaWQiOjE1NDk1MTkxLCJpYXQiOjE0NzY3NDE1NDUsImp0aSI6IjZmMmU0NmZkLWQ3MTMtNGNiYy1hN2JlLTgyZjJjOTJkZWUyMSIsImV4cCI6MTQ3Nzk1MTE0NX0%3D.wG_-b5xf2GNxpUxzabSDlz7fBwkUEJLJSSkeWiI8xB4%3D

-------
Este mensaje lo ha enviado Meetup en nombre de roberto alvarez (https://www.meetup.com/es-ES/members/194078553/).


?Preguntas? Puedes enviar un email a support at meetup.com y hablar con nuestro Equipo de Comunidad.

Dejar de recibir (https://secure.meetup.com/n/?s=eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJob29rIjoiaW52X29wdG91dCIsImRlc3QiOiJodHRwczovL3d3dy5tZWV0dXAuY29tL2VzLUVTL2FjY291bnQvb3B0b3V0Lz9zdWJtaXQ9dHJ1ZSZlbz10czEmZW1haWw9aW52aXRlJl9tc191bnN1Yj10cnVlIiwiZW1haWwiOiJwZXJzb25hbF9zdWJtZXJzaWJsZXNAcHN1YnMub3JnIiwiaW52aXRlcl9pZCI6MTk0MDc4NTUzLCJpYXQiOjE0NzY3NDE1NDUsImp0aSI6Ijk5ZTA0Y2M5LWI4ZGItNGVmOC04NDE4LTgwZTI2NjQ0MWVjMiIsImV4cCI6MTQ3Nzk1MTE0NX0%3D.jmR3SpUEGzdZkjKByxMUrGDtEmN0h4W99rQgWnP2ieQ%3D) correos electr?nicos como este.

Meetup Inc. https://www.meetup.com/es-ES/, POB 4668 #37895 New York NY USA 10163
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 18:33:11 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 15:33:11 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Message-ID: <20161017153311.5A2FAAC2@m0087791.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 20:28:49 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 17:28:49 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Message-ID: <20161017172849.5A2E9061@m0087793.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 21:05:42 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Sean T. Stevenson via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 19:05:42 -0600
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: wIHcbDNpEfdZcwIHeboBRB
References: wIHcbDNpEfdZcwIHeboBRB
Message-ID: <97a8d24b-1347-4037-bb65-085e32e73a29@email.android.com>

Hank, how feasible would it be to build ballast tanks into the trailer and make it a floating drydock (or at least, shallow draft dock)?

Sean


On October 17, 2016 6:28:49 PM MDT, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>Hank ,
>
>What about attaching a long pole or structure to the sub itself and
>pushing it out .  Maybe start with the sub cantilevered off the back
>end.
>
> 
>
>Brian
>
>--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>
>From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
>Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 20:57:11 +0000 (UTC)
>
>Alan,
>
>An extension pole won't help because the lake is not deep enough for
>the sub on the trailer for 100 feet.  I think the A frame or beavertail
>with rollers will be good.  The trailer already has a hydraulic A
>frame, just have to put it back on.
>
>Hank
>
>
>
>On Monday, October 17, 2016 1:13 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
>
>Hank,
>
>after more thought, maybe the cheapest easiest way would be to have a
>
>telescopic extension tube between the truck & trailer. Like the
>traditional
>
>method but a lot longer. It would be easy to make; just 3 tubes of
>varying
>
>diameters, with holes for bolts to go through to lock in place. One
>problem 
>
>would be lifting it in to place with the added weight. You would
>
>also then need a small tender to get to your sub. Of course there 
>
>could be the odd problem of drop offs at the end of the boat ramp!
>
>Alan
>
>Sent from my iPad
>
>
>On 17/10/2016, at 11:26 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>Tim,
>
>Rollers under the skids is ideal.  Problem is I don't have skids. 
>Gamma does have a nice raked bumper that is intended to protect the
>dome when the sub comes up to the trailer and to deflect the sub onto
>the trailer.  some times when I launch the sub the water is not deep
>enough and I can just lift the sub and slide it off by hand.  In a case
>like that, the hand winch can pull the sub onto the trailer by sliding
>the sub on the raked bumper.   
>
>I kept all the hydraulic lift stuff from the trailer, so I have a
>couple options. 
>
>Hank
>
>
>
>On Sunday, October 16, 2016 9:38 PM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>
>
>Hank,
>
>If the sub will be float clear of the bottom within reach of an A-frame
>crane on the trailer, would a double beavertail (photo) work for you
>instead of the crane? A double, or triple, beavertail may be sufficient
>to roll the sub off into sufficiently deep water.  Rather than rollers
>on the trailer, perhaps rollers on the sub's skids that would then
>match up with gutter tracks on the beavertail and trailer bed?  At
>least one psub out there has rollers on its skids. The skids should
>also have a ski-tip on each end to allow the winch to drag the sub
>through the mud-sand substrate to launch and recover.
>
>Tim
>
> 
>
>From: Personal_Submersibles
>[mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank
>pronk via Personal_Submersibles
>Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2016 2:42 PM
>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
>
> 
>
>My floating launch cart was better on paper than in the water lol.  I
>don't like the idea of temporary lift from bags, I think it will tip
>over. 
>
>I am thinking about a drop down beavertail, and hydraulic driven
>rollers.  I am sure there will be a new idea tomorrow.
>
>Hank
>
> 
>
>On Sunday, October 16, 2016 3:05 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> 
>
>Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.
>
>What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags
>low down
>
>on the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.
>
>Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing.....
>you
>
>have a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards
>on the
>
>end of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the
>props under,
>
>then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then
>use it as a tender 
>
>to get to your dive spot.!
>
>Alan
>
>Sent from my iPad
>
>
>On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>Alan, 
>
>That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a
>beavertail.  Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full
>rollers for the sub to roll off.  Gamma has a raked guard now, hmmmm
>you got me thinking, might be less work.  I am not in love with the sub
>sitting on rollers though.  
>
>The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out. 
>The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom. 
>
>Hank
>
> 
>
>On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> 
>
>Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a more
>
>beefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)
>
>https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgs
>
>Alan
>
>
>
>Sent from my iPad
>
>
>On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in,
>(Columbia Lake)  yes the start of the mighty Columbia river.    The A
>frame will allow me to dive there.
>
>Hank
>
> 
>
>On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via
>Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> 
>
>Interesting idea ! 
>
>--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>
>From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
><personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
>Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)
>
>Hi all,
>
>I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow
>water.  I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or
>so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board.  The steel
>tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume.  Also the thruster
>tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.
>
>But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit.  I am
>thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone
>without the trailer.  So my plan is to install an A frame on the
>trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water.  The
>sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and
>then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer.  To load
>the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable
>to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and
>drags it onto the trailer.  I figure I will need a roller on the end of
>the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.
>
>Easy Peezy
>
>Hank
>
>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles
>mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles 
>
> 
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> 
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> 
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> 
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> 
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
> 
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles
>mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles 
>
>
>
>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>_______________________________________________
>Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 17 21:37:55 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 01:37:55 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
In-Reply-To: <20161017172849.5A2E9061@m0087793.ppops.net>
References: <20161017172849.5A2E9061@m0087793.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <74862751.1694691.1476754675242@mail.yahoo.com>

Sean,That is very?feasible ?at least on paper. ?I have thought about that for years but never pulled the trigger. ?It is surprising how easily a trailer will float. ?I don't know if you saw the performance at the Washington convention, when Steve was backing in my brand new sub trailer and it was floating. ?The frame tubes and tires were enough to float it. ?I had to drill holes in the frame after that so the darn thing would sink faster.?
Brian, ?the sub would have to be floating to get to the cantilevered position on the trailer. ?But if the trailer had rollers and a beavertail, then a long reach hydraulic cylinder could both push it off and pull it on. ?Pity, I just gave a hiab crane away that had a long two stage cylinder on it.Hank 

    On Monday, October 17, 2016 6:29 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank ,????????????????????? What about attaching a long pole or structure to the sub itself and pushing it out .? Maybe start with the sub cantilevered off the back end.?Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Mon, 17 Oct 2016 20:57:11 +0000 (UTC)

Alan,An extension pole won't help because the lake is not deep enough for the sub on the trailer for 100 feet. ?I think the A frame or beavertail with rollers will be good. ?The trailer already has a hydraulic A frame, just have to put it back on.Hank 

    On Monday, October 17, 2016 1:13 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,after more thought, maybe the cheapest easiest way would be to have atelescopic extension tube between the truck & trailer. Like the traditionalmethod but a lot longer. It would be easy to make; just 3 tubes of varyingdiameters, with holes for bolts to go through to lock in place. One problem?would be lifting it in to place with the added weight. You wouldalso then need a small tender to get to your sub. Of course there?could be the odd problem of drop offs at the end of the boat ramp!Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 11:26 pm, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Tim,Rollers under the skids is ideal. ?Problem is I don't have skids. ?Gamma does have a nice raked bumper that is intended to protect the dome when the sub comes up to the trailer and to deflect the sub onto the trailer. ?some times when I launch the sub the water is not deep enough and I can just lift the sub and slide it off by hand. ?In a case like that, the hand winch can pull the sub onto the trailer by sliding the sub on the raked bumper. ??I kept all the hydraulic lift stuff from the trailer, so I have a couple options.?Hank 

    On Sunday, October 16, 2016 9:38 PM, T Novak via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,If the sub will be float clear of the bottom within reach of an A-frame crane on the trailer, would a double beavertail (photo) work for you instead of the crane? A double, or triple, beavertail may be sufficient to roll the sub off into sufficiently deep water.? Rather than rollers on the trailer, perhaps rollers on the sub's skids that would then match up with gutter tracks on the beavertail and trailer bed?? At least one psub out there has rollers on its skids. The skids should also have a ski-tip on each end to allow the winch to drag the sub through the mud-sand substrate to launch and recover.Tim ?From: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] On Behalf Of hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles
Sent: Sunday, October 16, 2016 2:42 PM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch ?My floating launch cart was better on paper than in the water lol. ?I don't like the idea of temporary lift from bags, I think it will tip over. I am thinking about a drop down beavertail, and hydraulic driven rollers. ?I am sure there will be a new idea tomorrow.Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 3:05 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Yes, you don't want it coming off the trailer & sitting in the mud.What happened to your floating trailer idea? Or can you fit air bags low downon the sub, just to aid buoyancy for tricky launching.? ?Ok here's another idea that you are well capable of implementing..... youhave a floating trailer with pontoons down either side & twin outboards on theend of the pontoons. You drive your trailer in far enough to get the props under,then use outboard power to pull the trailer out till it's floating then use it as a tender?to get to your dive spot.!Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 9:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
Alan,?That would work if the sub had a raked front end or the trailer had a beavertail. ?Not a bad solution indeed, the trailer would need full rollers for the sub to roll off. ?Gamma has a raked guard now,?hmmmm you got me thinking, might be less work. ?I am not in love with the sub sitting on rollers though. ?The lake has not enough depth at the end of the ramp or further out. ?The sub could cruise out but it would be close to hitting bottom.?Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 1:30 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Just googled this idea for a shallow launch & wondered if a morebeefed up version would help. ( 2 parts to the video)https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=47y0KNSvUgsAlan

Sent from my iPad
On 17/10/2016, at 6:28 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
There is a real nice lake 20 minutes from home that I can't get in, (Columbia Lake) ?yes the start of the mighty Columbia river. ? ?The A frame will allow me to dive there.Hank ?On Sunday, October 16, 2016 11:22 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote: ?Interesting idea !?

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] sub launch
Date: Sun, 16 Oct 2016 16:18:43 +0000 (UTC)Hi all,I have been pondering the age old problem of launching in shallow water. ?I am making new fibreglass MBT's for Gamma in a few weeks or so, I will increase the diameter to give me more free board. ?The steel tanks are a bit to heavy and could use more volume. ?Also the thruster tubes will be vectored in the new tanks.But that will only help with launching in shallow water a bit. ?I am thinking that typically the water is deep enough for the sub alone without the trailer. ?So my plan is to install an A frame on the trailer that can lift the sub when it is backed into the water. ?The sub is light at this point, so lifting it off the trailer is easy and then the A frame tilts back dragging the sub off the trailer. ?To load the sub, just drive it up to the back of the trailer and hook the cable to the lifting eye, then tilt the A frame forward, it lifts the sub and drags it onto the trailer. ?I figure I will need a roller on the end of the trailer to help the sub slide ahead.Easy PeezyHank_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles  ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
 ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
 ?_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles ?
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 18 03:43:50 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
References: <1740861642.2151481.1476776630362.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1740861642.2151481.1476776630362@mail.yahoo.com>

I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention, except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate& pushes away. I will be able to use the?same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottomvalve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thicknessof wire & number of turns. If it fails you won't be able to release air?to dive, but will always be able tofill the tanks with air.The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoidis already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank& drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a templatefor holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversizedto receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valveis dropped in & bolted down.I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.Any thoughts???Alan?
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 18 04:18:48 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 01:18:48 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
Message-ID: <20161018011848.5A2DFC0C@m0087795.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 18 04:37:04 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 21:37:04 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
In-Reply-To: <20161018011848.5A2DFC0C@m0087795.ppops.net>
References: <20161018011848.5A2DFC0C@m0087795.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <9609012B-3F9A-41E7-ABC9-02CCCF3B2D74@yahoo.com>

No. Failure mode is I won't be able to dive. If you were desperate you could unbolt
the bottom valves & get a diver to depress the top valves. If the wiring thickness &
windings are calculated with a large margin of error against burning out,
& the wire is protected against breakage, it should be pretty reliable. My ambient
has solenoid valves, but they were modified commercial valves that could corrode.
This gives you the liberty of operating the valves from a portable module.
Not shown in the drawing is a wire gauss that will stop the ingress of rubbish.
Alan  


Sent from my iPad

> On 18/10/2016, at 9:18 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,     Will you have a mechanical valve for back up ?
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
> Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)
> It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention,
> except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.
> I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,
> but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate
> & pushes away.
> I will be able to use the same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottom
> valve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thickness
> of wire & number of turns.
> If it fails you won't be able to release air to dive, but will always be able to
> fill the tanks with air.
> The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoid
> is already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.
> The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank
> & drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a template
> for holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversized
> to receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valve
> is dropped in & bolted down.
> I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.
> I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.
> Any thoughts???
> Alan 
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 18 05:01:05 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 10:01:05 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <694644529.1554895.1476738313194@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB10219BF06061E64068FE7BA2DFD00@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
 <694644529.1554895.1476738313194@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UDp592c-6RgkAZHQJCKpDiwEk6DZdtU+nRTHH+mNZbwjg@mail.gmail.com>

Get it!  that's surely the ultimate sub launching contraption.  No more
launching troubles, ever...

On 17 October 2016 at 22:05, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> I can buy this crane for 11,500 in certification locally.    I might look
> silly towing Gamma behind this.
> Hank
>
> On Monday, October 17, 2016 3:03 PM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 18 07:32:14 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 11:32:14 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
In-Reply-To: <9609012B-3F9A-41E7-ABC9-02CCCF3B2D74@yahoo.com>
References: <20161018011848.5A2DFC0C@m0087795.ppops.net>
 <9609012B-3F9A-41E7-ABC9-02CCCF3B2D74@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1335012720.1958203.1476790334713@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,Why do you want two valves, one for water in and one for air out" ? When you are submerged you will add air, but you will have to open the bottom valve to let water out. ?but they are connected, so you will be letting your air out. ?Nice valve, I like how it is enclosed in the tank.Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 2:37 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 No. Failure mode is I won't be able to dive. If you were desperate you could unboltthe bottom valves & get a diver to depress the top valves. If the wiring thickness &windings are calculated with a large margin of error against burning out,& the wire is protected against breakage, it should be pretty reliable. My ambienthas solenoid valves, but they were modified commercial valves that could corrode.This gives you the liberty of operating the valves from a portable module.Not shown in the drawing is a wire gauss that will stop the ingress of rubbish.Alan ?

Sent from my iPad
On 18/10/2016, at 9:18 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,???? Will you have a mechanical valve for back up ??Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)

I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention, except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate& pushes away. I will be able to use the?same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottomvalve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thicknessof wire & number of turns. If it fails you won't be able to release air?to dive, but will always be able tofill the tanks with air.The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoidis already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank& drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a templatefor holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversizedto receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valveis dropped in & bolted down.I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.Any thoughts???Alan?
_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 18 11:10:50 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2016 04:10:50 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
In-Reply-To: <1335012720.1958203.1476790334713@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161018011848.5A2DFC0C@m0087795.ppops.net>
 <9609012B-3F9A-41E7-ABC9-02CCCF3B2D74@yahoo.com>
 <1335012720.1958203.1476790334713@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6E375F84-7220-4ABC-9B54-8430873A7F9F@yahoo.com>

Hank, the bottom valve is different from the top &
the water will force out against the spring closure.
It will need to be a lot larger.
I intend to tow this sub at fast speed to off shore Island groups &
it will let me ride a bit higher if the bottom is sealed.
With constant pounding on waves there would be compression
of the air in the ballast tank that would let more & more water in.
Also a bit of redundancy if you left the sub sitting in the water
over night.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 19/10/2016, at 12:32 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> Why do you want two valves, one for water in and one for air out"   When you are submerged you will add air, but you will have to open the bottom valve to let water out.  but they are connected, so you will be letting your air out.  Nice valve, I like how it is enclosed in the tank.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 2:37 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> No. Failure mode is I won't be able to dive. If you were desperate you could unbolt
> the bottom valves & get a diver to depress the top valves. If the wiring thickness &
> windings are calculated with a large margin of error against burning out,
> & the wire is protected against breakage, it should be pretty reliable. My ambient
> has solenoid valves, but they were modified commercial valves that could corrode.
> This gives you the liberty of operating the valves from a portable module.
> Not shown in the drawing is a wire gauss that will stop the ingress of rubbish.
> Alan  
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 18/10/2016, at 9:18 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,     Will you have a mechanical valve for back up ?
>>  
>> Brian
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
>> Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)
>> 
>> I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)
>> It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention,
>> except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.
>> I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,
>> but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate
>> & pushes away.
>> I will be able to use the same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottom
>> valve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thickness
>> of wire & number of turns.
>> If it fails you won't be able to release air to dive, but will always be able to
>> fill the tanks with air.
>> The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoid
>> is already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.
>> The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank
>> & drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a template
>> for holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversized
>> to receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valve
>> is dropped in & bolted down.
>> I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.
>> I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.
>> Any thoughts???
>> Alan 
>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 19 08:16:56 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2016 12:16:56 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
In-Reply-To: <6E375F84-7220-4ABC-9B54-8430873A7F9F@yahoo.com>
References: <20161018011848.5A2DFC0C@m0087795.ppops.net>
 <9609012B-3F9A-41E7-ABC9-02CCCF3B2D74@yahoo.com>
 <1335012720.1958203.1476790334713@mail.yahoo.com>
 <6E375F84-7220-4ABC-9B54-8430873A7F9F@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1418022309.2779564.1476879416893@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,Okay got it, makes?sense now. ?is there a commercial flush valve like your building? ?I sure like that!Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 9:11 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank, the bottom valve is different from the top &the water will force out against the spring closure.It will need to be a lot larger.I intend to tow this sub at fast speed to off shore Island groups &it will let me ride a bit higher if the bottom is sealed.With constant pounding on waves there would be compressionof the air in the ballast tank that would let more & more water in.Also a bit of redundancy if you left the sub sitting in the waterover night.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 19/10/2016, at 12:32 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,Why do you want two valves, one for water in and one for air out" ? When you are submerged you will add air, but you will have to open the bottom valve to let water out. ?but they are connected, so you will be letting your air out. ?Nice valve, I like how it is enclosed in the tank.Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 2:37 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 No. Failure mode is I won't be able to dive. If you were desperate you could unboltthe bottom valves & get a diver to depress the top valves. If the wiring thickness &windings are calculated with a large margin of error against burning out,& the wire is protected against breakage, it should be pretty reliable. My ambienthas solenoid valves, but they were modified commercial valves that could corrode.This gives you the liberty of operating the valves from a portable module.Not shown in the drawing is a wire gauss that will stop the ingress of rubbish.Alan ?

Sent from my iPad
On 18/10/2016, at 9:18 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,???? Will you have a mechanical valve for back up ??Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)

I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention, except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate& pushes away. I will be able to use the?same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottomvalve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thicknessof wire & number of turns. If it fails you won't be able to release air?to dive, but will always be able tofill the tanks with air.The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoidis already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank& drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a templatefor holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversizedto receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valveis dropped in & bolted down.I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.Any thoughts???Alan?
_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 19 08:19:22 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2016 12:19:22 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] vent valves
References: <503559057.2795951.1476879562600.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <503559057.2795951.1476879562600@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi Hugh,What does your Com Sub have for vent valves. ?Are they electric?Hank
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 19 14:21:12 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2016 07:21:12 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
In-Reply-To: <1418022309.2779564.1476879416893@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161018011848.5A2DFC0C@m0087795.ppops.net>
 <9609012B-3F9A-41E7-ABC9-02CCCF3B2D74@yahoo.com>
 <1335012720.1958203.1476790334713@mail.yahoo.com>
 <6E375F84-7220-4ABC-9B54-8430873A7F9F@yahoo.com>
 <1418022309.2779564.1476879416893@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <27B764D5-E020-4021-8D93-46157FD94A0A@yahoo.com>

Hank,
no, I spent a lot of time looking for something suitable. Although I
did find an expensive stainless solenoid valve it would need to protrude
about 3" above the ballast tank & I would still have to waterproof the
wiring.
This way it will be flush with the top of the tank & easy to mount.
There will need to be a slightly larger gap between the iron plunger &
the coil so no muck jams it & so the epoxy on the core doesn't wear.
It would be simple to have a gyro & piece of electronics to control the
ballast fill on all tanks similtaneously, so you descended evenly at the
press of a button.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 20/10/2016, at 1:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> Okay got it, makes sense now.  is there a commercial flush valve like your building?  I sure like that!
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 9:11 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hank, the bottom valve is different from the top &
> the water will force out against the spring closure.
> It will need to be a lot larger.
> I intend to tow this sub at fast speed to off shore Island groups &
> it will let me ride a bit higher if the bottom is sealed.
> With constant pounding on waves there would be compression
> of the air in the ballast tank that would let more & more water in.
> Also a bit of redundancy if you left the sub sitting in the water
> over night.
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 19/10/2016, at 12:32 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,
>> Why do you want two valves, one for water in and one for air out"   When you are submerged you will add air, but you will have to open the bottom valve to let water out.  but they are connected, so you will be letting your air out.  Nice valve, I like how it is enclosed in the tank.
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 2:37 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> No. Failure mode is I won't be able to dive. If you were desperate you could unbolt
>> the bottom valves & get a diver to depress the top valves. If the wiring thickness &
>> windings are calculated with a large margin of error against burning out,
>> & the wire is protected against breakage, it should be pretty reliable. My ambient
>> has solenoid valves, but they were modified commercial valves that could corrode.
>> This gives you the liberty of operating the valves from a portable module.
>> Not shown in the drawing is a wire gauss that will stop the ingress of rubbish.
>> Alan  
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On 18/10/2016, at 9:18 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Alan,     Will you have a mechanical valve for back up ?
>>>  
>>> Brian
>>> 
>>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>>> 
>>> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
>>> Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)
>>> 
>>> I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)
>>> It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention,
>>> except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.
>>> I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,
>>> but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate
>>> & pushes away.
>>> I will be able to use the same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottom
>>> valve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thickness
>>> of wire & number of turns.
>>> If it fails you won't be able to release air to dive, but will always be able to
>>> fill the tanks with air.
>>> The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoid
>>> is already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.
>>> The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank
>>> & drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a template
>>> for holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversized
>>> to receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valve
>>> is dropped in & bolted down.
>>> I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.
>>> I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.
>>> Any thoughts???
>>> Alan 
>>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 19 14:46:56 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (k6fee via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2016 11:46:56 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
Message-ID: <9y63k8lx6k9g1c6t0kmrgoyw.1476902816125@email.android.com>

How about using a pneumatic operated valve, using air from the ballast blow manifold. No shorts, no potting, etc.
Keith T.


Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
-------- Original message --------From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> Date: 10/19/16  11:21 AM  (GMT-08:00) To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE 
Hank,no, I spent a lot of time looking for something suitable. Although Idid find an expensive stainless solenoid valve it would need to protrudeabout 3" above the ballast tank & I would still have to waterproof thewiring.This way it will be flush with the top of the tank & easy to mount.There will need to be a slightly larger gap between the iron plunger &the coil so no muck jams it & so the epoxy on the core doesn't wear.It would be simple to have a gyro & piece of electronics to control theballast fill on all tanks similtaneously, so you descended evenly at thepress of a button.Alan
Sent from my iPad
On 20/10/2016, at 1:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Alan,Okay got it, makes?sense now. ?is there a commercial flush valve like your building? ?I sure like that!Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 9:11 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
  

 Hank, the bottom valve is different from the top &the water will force out against the spring closure.It will need to be a lot larger.I intend to tow this sub at fast speed to off shore Island groups &it will let me ride a bit higher if the bottom is sealed.With constant pounding on waves there would be compressionof the air in the ballast tank that would let more & more water in.Also a bit of redundancy if you left the sub sitting in the waterover night.Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 19/10/2016, at 12:32 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Alan,Why do you want two valves, one for water in and one for air out" ? When you are submerged you will add air, but you will have to open the bottom valve to let water out. ?but they are connected, so you will be letting your air out. ?Nice valve, I like how it is enclosed in the tank.Hank 

    On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 2:37 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
  

 No. Failure mode is I won't be able to dive. If you were desperate you could unboltthe bottom valves & get a diver to depress the top valves. If the wiring thickness &windings are calculated with a large margin of error against burning out,& the wire is protected against breakage, it should be pretty reliable. My ambienthas solenoid valves, but they were modified commercial valves that could corrode.This gives you the liberty of operating the valves from a portable module.Not shown in the drawing is a wire gauss that will stop the ingress of rubbish.Alan ?

Sent from my iPad
On 18/10/2016, at 9:18 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Alan,???? Will you have a mechanical valve for back up ??Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)

I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention, except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate& pushes away. I will be able to use the?same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottomvalve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thicknessof wire & number of turns. If it fails you won't be able to release air?to dive, but will always be able tofill the tanks with air.The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoidis already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank& drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a templatefor holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversizedto receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valveis dropped in & bolted down.I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.Any thoughts???Alan?
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


     _______________________________________________
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http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Wed Oct 19 15:52:03 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2016 08:52:03 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
In-Reply-To: <9y63k8lx6k9g1c6t0kmrgoyw.1476902816125@email.android.com>
References: <9y63k8lx6k9g1c6t0kmrgoyw.1476902816125@email.android.com>
Message-ID: <BEAE6A6B-4685-4E3F-A531-37CEE375B912@yahoo.com>

Hi Keith, 
Vance's original design that I based this on, had a pneumatic cylinder.
For that you would need to put a Tee off your ballast fill air line then
a 3 way valve for pressurising the cylinder & venting it in to the hull
for it to return. Then you need a pneumatic cylinder that operates
reliably in saltwater. The pneumatic cylinder would see ambient water
pressure against the outside of it's piston seals for the dive duration
& I would not be sure that what I bought was designed for external pressure.
Having said all that, it was a design that worked.
In my design the wire in the solenoid coil is already coated, so when I have wound it, it
is just a matter of adding a couple of protective coats of epoxy, then the
potting of the through hull fitting.
On my ambient sub I have solenoid valves for fill & empty. Everything worked
remotely off a play station 2 controller with the push of a button. It worked great
but everything needs beefing up for the next sub.
Cheers Alan
 


Sent from my iPad

> On 20/10/2016, at 7:46 am, k6fee via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> How about using a pneumatic operated valve, using air from the ballast blow manifold. No shorts, no potting, etc.
> 
> Keith T.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
> 
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Date: 10/19/16 11:21 AM (GMT-08:00)
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
> 
> Hank,
> no, I spent a lot of time looking for something suitable. Although I
> did find an expensive stainless solenoid valve it would need to protrude
> about 3" above the ballast tank & I would still have to waterproof the
> wiring.
> This way it will be flush with the top of the tank & easy to mount.
> There will need to be a slightly larger gap between the iron plunger &
> the coil so no muck jams it & so the epoxy on the core doesn't wear.
> It would be simple to have a gyro & piece of electronics to control the
> ballast fill on all tanks similtaneously, so you descended evenly at the
> press of a button.
> Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 20/10/2016, at 1:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Alan,
>> Okay got it, makes sense now.  is there a commercial flush valve like your building?  I sure like that!
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 9:11 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Hank, the bottom valve is different from the top &
>> the water will force out against the spring closure.
>> It will need to be a lot larger.
>> I intend to tow this sub at fast speed to off shore Island groups &
>> it will let me ride a bit higher if the bottom is sealed.
>> With constant pounding on waves there would be compression
>> of the air in the ballast tank that would let more & more water in.
>> Also a bit of redundancy if you left the sub sitting in the water
>> over night.
>> Alan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On 19/10/2016, at 12:32 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Alan,
>>> Why do you want two valves, one for water in and one for air out"   When you are submerged you will add air, but you will have to open the bottom valve to let water out.  but they are connected, so you will be letting your air out.  Nice valve, I like how it is enclosed in the tank.
>>> Hank
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 2:37 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> No. Failure mode is I won't be able to dive. If you were desperate you could unbolt
>>> the bottom valves & get a diver to depress the top valves. If the wiring thickness &
>>> windings are calculated with a large margin of error against burning out,
>>> & the wire is protected against breakage, it should be pretty reliable. My ambient
>>> has solenoid valves, but they were modified commercial valves that could corrode.
>>> This gives you the liberty of operating the valves from a portable module.
>>> Not shown in the drawing is a wire gauss that will stop the ingress of rubbish.
>>> Alan  
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>> 
>>>> On 18/10/2016, at 9:18 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Alan,     Will you have a mechanical valve for back up ?
>>>>  
>>>> Brian
>>>> 
>>>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
>>>> Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)
>>>> 
>>>> I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)
>>>> It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention,
>>>> except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.
>>>> I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,
>>>> but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate
>>>> & pushes away.
>>>> I will be able to use the same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottom
>>>> valve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thickness
>>>> of wire & number of turns.
>>>> If it fails you won't be able to release air to dive, but will always be able to
>>>> fill the tanks with air.
>>>> The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoid
>>>> is already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.
>>>> The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank
>>>> & drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a template
>>>> for holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversized
>>>> to receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valve
>>>> is dropped in & bolted down.
>>>> I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.
>>>> I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.
>>>> Any thoughts???
>>>> Alan 
>>>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 20 12:07:18 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2016 18:07:18 +0200
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
In-Reply-To: <9y63k8lx6k9g1c6t0kmrgoyw.1476902816125@email.android.com>
References: <9y63k8lx6k9g1c6t0kmrgoyw.1476902816125@email.android.com>
Message-ID: <04a501d22aec$08419590$18c4c0b0$@nl>

Keith,

 

Works on the Nemo 2  Normally closed off coarse..

 

Emile

 

Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens k6fee via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: woensdag 19 oktober 2016 20:47
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE

 

How about using a pneumatic operated valve, using air from the ballast blow manifold. No shorts, no potting, etc.

 

Keith T.

 

 

 

Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

 

-------- Original message --------

From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 

Date: 10/19/16 11:21 AM (GMT-08:00) 

To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 

Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE 

 

Hank,

no, I spent a lot of time looking for something suitable. Although I

did find an expensive stainless solenoid valve it would need to protrude

about 3" above the ballast tank & I would still have to waterproof the

wiring.

This way it will be flush with the top of the tank & easy to mount.

There will need to be a slightly larger gap between the iron plunger &

the coil so no muck jams it & so the epoxy on the core doesn't wear.

It would be simple to have a gyro & piece of electronics to control the

ballast fill on all tanks similtaneously, so you descended evenly at the

press of a button.

Alan


Sent from my iPad


On 20/10/2016, at 1:16 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Alan,

Okay got it, makes sense now.  is there a commercial flush valve like your building?  I sure like that!

Hank

 

On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 9:11 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

 

Hank, the bottom valve is different from the top &

the water will force out against the spring closure.

It will need to be a lot larger.

I intend to tow this sub at fast speed to off shore Island groups &

it will let me ride a bit higher if the bottom is sealed.

With constant pounding on waves there would be compression

of the air in the ballast tank that would let more & more water in.

Also a bit of redundancy if you left the sub sitting in the water

over night.

Alan

Sent from my iPad


On 19/10/2016, at 12:32 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Alan,

Why do you want two valves, one for water in and one for air out"   When you are submerged you will add air, but you will have to open the bottom valve to let water out.  but they are connected, so you will be letting your air out.  Nice valve, I like how it is enclosed in the tank.

Hank

 

On Tuesday, October 18, 2016 2:37 AM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

 

No. Failure mode is I won't be able to dive. If you were desperate you could unbolt

the bottom valves & get a diver to depress the top valves. If the wiring thickness &

windings are calculated with a large margin of error against burning out,

& the wire is protected against breakage, it should be pretty reliable. My ambient

has solenoid valves, but they were modified commercial valves that could corrode.

This gives you the liberty of operating the valves from a portable module.

Not shown in the drawing is a wire gauss that will stop the ingress of rubbish.

Alan  



Sent from my iPad


On 18/10/2016, at 9:18 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Alan,     Will you have a mechanical valve for back up ?

 

Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] SOLENOID BALLAST VALVE
Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2016 07:43:50 +0000 (UTC)

I have been working on my ballast valve design. (below)

It's based on the drawing Vance handed out at the Islamorada convention, 

except it's operated by a solenoid rather than an air cylinder.

I am intending to have a similar valve on the bottom of my ballast tank,

but modified so that the sealing gasket sits on the outside of the top plate

& pushes away. 

I will be able to use the same wire on the top valve on the coil of the bottom

valve so they work in unison. Just a matter of getting the right thickness

of wire & number of turns. 

If it fails you won't be able to release air to dive, but will always be able to

fill the tanks with air.

The iron core of the plunger will need to be coated. The wiring of the solenoid

is already coated but I'll add a bit of epoxy.

The intended assembly method is to cut a whole in the top of the ballast tank

& drop the module in. Then use the bolt holes in the top plate as a template

for holes through the ballast tank. The ballast tank holes are then oversized

to receive threaded inserts that are epoxied in from the inside. Then the valve

is dropped in & bolted down.

I am thinking of doing it all in hard anodized aluminum but are not quite sure.

I am intending to weld the body to the top plate.

Any thoughts???

Alan 

_______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

 

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Thu Oct 20 23:55:31 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 20 Oct 2016 20:55:31 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
Message-ID: <20161020205531.5A240301@m0087798.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 05:56:11 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 09:56:11 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
In-Reply-To: <20161020205531.5A240301@m0087798.ppops.net>
References: <20161020205531.5A240301@m0087798.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1397581638.151052.1477043771841@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi Brian,?In the end I think you will be way ahead to pick up two 50 lb trolling motors and clamp them onto your sub for harbour operations. ?You can also ?buy 100 lb thrust motors here in Canada (Vancouver) for 600 dollars each. ? You can leave them just as they are with no modifications, then sell them when your done testing. ?You can oil fill them and use them on the sub permanently. ?By the time you buy a gen set and motors, housings, and seals, you could have a couple of those 100 lb motors. ?Doing this will also give you a sense of what you need to push that baby around, two of those motors (100 lb thrust) ?will give you 4 hp. ?Hank 

    On Thursday, October 20, 2016 9:55 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi All,???????????????????? Been thinking about how I'm going to get around the harbor with my sub.? I'm thinking that for the time being I'm just going to run ( on the surface) a 2000 watt?Honda generator and then for the motors , use these 1/3 HP dryer motors in a oil flooded housing, probably made out of aluminum tubing.? They obviously run with 120 V? AC power.? ???Since on my sub I will have dual motors on each side, port and starboard, I was thinking to also have additional motors facing foreword to stop my foreword progress ( a brake)?? .?? ??These dryer motors can be got really cheap , new they're about?$75.00??I'm pretty?sure they would be ok flooded with oil.?? So I would have a total of 4 motors , two on each side one going?frontwards?and one?opposing .? It would be a totally on or off drive of course ,?with no speed control.? ??Here's a video of the motors I'm talking about.? ?????https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIrCUh1S8x8??Brian???
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 06:04:25 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 10:04:25 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <DM3PR1201MB102183E7E19ED7D7DA77570BDFD40@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
References: <DM3PR1201MB102183E7E19ED7D7DA77570BDFD40@DM3PR1201MB1021.namprd12.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <1549208007.142937.1477044265415@mail.yahoo.com>

Here is the ad for the motors and that is in Canadian dollars, so your cost is about 450 dollars each.Hank

     On Friday, October 21, 2016 4:01 AM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  2 HP 100 lbs Electric trolling Motor 24 volts
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-boat-parts-trailer-accessories/burnaby-new-westminster/2-hp-100-lbs-electric-trolling-motor-24-volts/1162587863?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 11:46:18 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 08:46:18 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
Message-ID: <20161021084618.5A23F413@m0087797.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 14:49:04 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 07:49:04 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
In-Reply-To: <20161020205531.5A240301@m0087798.ppops.net>
References: <20161020205531.5A240301@m0087798.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <B5E4F9BB-4127-47F1-B512-F90B50860A31@yahoo.com>

Hi Brian,
what happened to the high powered motors you were looking at a while back?
These motors are huge & only put out 1/3 rd horsepower. Minn kotta is 2hp. There is a 
lot of work making a housing for them. The shaft would have to be extended to fit another bearing, seal & the propeller, let alone all the work for a housing that is bolted together &
sealed with a wiring entry welded on.
If you are just wanting to do buoyancy / stability tests before you invest in thrusters,
why not have a small inflatable tender with outboard to drag it round.
Alternatively look on Cliffs project page on his Minn kotta modification, as he has done
some good work on them that may be helpful.
Cheers Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 21/10/2016, at 4:55 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi All,
>                      Been thinking about how I'm going to get around the harbor with my sub.  I'm thinking that for the time being I'm just going to run ( on the surface) a 2000 watt Honda generator and then for the motors , use these 1/3 HP dryer motors in a oil flooded housing, probably made out of aluminum tubing.  They obviously run with 120 V  AC power. 
>  
>   Since on my sub I will have dual motors on each side, port and starboard, I was thinking to also have additional motors facing foreword to stop my foreword progress ( a brake)   .  
>  
>  These dryer motors can be got really cheap , new they're about $75.00  I'm pretty sure they would be ok flooded with oil.   So I would have a total of 4 motors , two on each side one going frontwards and one opposing .  It would be a totally on or off drive of course , with no speed control. 
>  
>  
> Here's a video of the motors I'm talking about. 
>  
>  
>    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIrCUh1S8x8
>  
>  
> Brian
>  
>  
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 14:57:41 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 18:57:41 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <20161021084618.5A23F413@m0087797.ppops.net>
References: <20161021084618.5A23F413@m0087797.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <442161599.17058.1477076261157@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,Minkota 100 lb motors are a lot more than these ones I showed you. ?These are probably cheap Chinese motors. ?I think are worth a try, and I intend on being the sacrificial lamb. ?I am not converting them though, I will use them as surface power. ?They will be stored inside the sub or on the buoy marker. ?Of coarse for the benefit of us all, I will tear one down and have a peek at how well they are built.Hank 

    On Friday, October 21, 2016 9:46 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Thought they would be way more that that

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 10:04:25 +0000 (UTC)

Here is the ad for the motors and that is in Canadian dollars, so your cost is about 450 dollars each.Hank

     On Friday, October 21, 2016 4:01 AM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  2 HP 100 lbs Electric trolling Motor 24 volts
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-boat-parts-trailer-accessories/burnaby-new-westminster/2-hp-100-lbs-electric-trolling-motor-24-volts/1162587863?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 15:18:04 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 08:18:04 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <442161599.17058.1477076261157@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161021084618.5A23F413@m0087797.ppops.net>
 <442161599.17058.1477076261157@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <C94A56DE-3D1D-42A8-AB18-3FD61FA3C015@yahoo.com>

Hank,
I have 4 cheap Chinese trolling motors on my ambient.
Have pulled a couple apart & found iron filings in then &
one had the thrust bearing mounted in a plastic fitting that
didn't look very substantial. The main housing seals & seat
weren't fantastic & the seal was worse for wear by the time
I reassembled it. There were long bolts running down the 
inside of the motor holding the housing together. These were
a devil to get back in as the motor magnets pulled them
away from the threaded hole I was trying to bolt them in about 6" in. 
However there are more than 1 trolling motor manufacturers
in China. Good luck.
  Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 7:57 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Brian,
> Minkota 100 lb motors are a lot more than these ones I showed you.  These are probably cheap Chinese motors.  I think are worth a try, and I intend on being the sacrificial lamb.  I am not converting them though, I will use them as surface power.  They will be stored inside the sub or on the buoy marker.  Of coarse for the benefit of us all, I will tear one down and have a peek at how well they are built.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Friday, October 21, 2016 9:46 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Thought they would be way more that that
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
> Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 10:04:25 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Here is the ad for the motors and that is in Canadian dollars, so your cost is about 450 dollars each.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Friday, October 21, 2016 4:01 AM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
> 
> 
> 2 HP 100 lbs Electric trolling Motor 24 volts
> 
> http://www.kijiji.ca/v-boat-parts-trailer-accessories/burnaby-new-westminster/2-hp-100-lbs-electric-trolling-motor-24-volts/1162587863?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 15:41:14 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 19:41:14 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <C94A56DE-3D1D-42A8-AB18-3FD61FA3C015@yahoo.com>
References: <20161021084618.5A23F413@m0087797.ppops.net>
 <442161599.17058.1477076261157@mail.yahoo.com>
 <C94A56DE-3D1D-42A8-AB18-3FD61FA3C015@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1717166215.498659.1477078874276@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,Yaaaaa, hmmmmm, not sure what to do? ? ?Your probably right, they are?likely junk.Hank 

    On Friday, October 21, 2016 1:18 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,I have 4 cheap Chinese trolling motors on my ambient.Have pulled a couple apart & found iron filings in then &one had the thrust bearing mounted in a plastic fitting thatdidn't look very substantial. The main housing seals & seatweren't fantastic & the seal was worse for wear by the timeI reassembled it. There were long bolts running down the?inside of the motor holding the housing together. These werea devil to get back in as the motor magnets pulled themaway from the threaded hole I was trying to bolt them in about 6" in.?However there are more than 1 trolling motor manufacturersin China. Good luck.? Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 22/10/2016, at 7:57 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Brian,Minkota 100 lb motors are a lot more than these ones I showed you. ?These are probably cheap Chinese motors. ?I think are worth a try, and I intend on being the sacrificial lamb. ?I am not converting them though, I will use them as surface power. ?They will be stored inside the sub or on the buoy marker. ?Of coarse for the benefit of us all, I will tear one down and have a peek at how well they are built.Hank 

    On Friday, October 21, 2016 9:46 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Thought they would be way more that that

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 10:04:25 +0000 (UTC)

Here is the ad for the motors and that is in Canadian dollars, so your cost is about 450 dollars each.Hank

     On Friday, October 21, 2016 4:01 AM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  2 HP 100 lbs Electric trolling Motor 24 volts
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-boat-parts-trailer-accessories/burnaby-new-westminster/2-hp-100-lbs-electric-trolling-motor-24-volts/1162587863?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 16:25:09 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 09:25:09 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <1717166215.498659.1477078874276@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161021084618.5A23F413@m0087797.ppops.net>
 <442161599.17058.1477076261157@mail.yahoo.com>
 <C94A56DE-3D1D-42A8-AB18-3FD61FA3C015@yahoo.com>
 <1717166215.498659.1477078874276@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <612C5C0E-BEEA-49F8-B313-7878945F4471@yahoo.com>

I can't remember what seal they use, but it could be just an O-ring.
I would like to send you over one of my motors but they are not ready yet.
Am having a rectifier made for me so I can run the motor off mains in a 
pool for a hundred or so hours. Also am being supplied with some mechanical
seals to evaluate next week. Although there is an off the shelf regulator
that Cliff is using for equalising his Minn kottas, I want to look at building
my own compensator. Slowly getting there though.
Alan 

Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 8:41 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
> Yaaaaa, hmmmmm, not sure what to do?    Your probably right, they are likely junk.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Friday, October 21, 2016 1:18 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Hank,
> I have 4 cheap Chinese trolling motors on my ambient.
> Have pulled a couple apart & found iron filings in then &
> one had the thrust bearing mounted in a plastic fitting that
> didn't look very substantial. The main housing seals & seat
> weren't fantastic & the seal was worse for wear by the time
> I reassembled it. There were long bolts running down the 
> inside of the motor holding the housing together. These were
> a devil to get back in as the motor magnets pulled them
> away from the threaded hole I was trying to bolt them in about 6" in. 
> However there are more than 1 trolling motor manufacturers
> in China. Good luck.
>   Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 22/10/2016, at 7:57 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Brian,
>> Minkota 100 lb motors are a lot more than these ones I showed you.  These are probably cheap Chinese motors.  I think are worth a try, and I intend on being the sacrificial lamb.  I am not converting them though, I will use them as surface power.  They will be stored inside the sub or on the buoy marker.  Of coarse for the benefit of us all, I will tear one down and have a peek at how well they are built.
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Friday, October 21, 2016 9:46 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Thought they would be way more that that
>> 
>> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
>> 
>> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
>> Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 10:04:25 +0000 (UTC)
>> 
>> Here is the ad for the motors and that is in Canadian dollars, so your cost is about 450 dollars each.
>> Hank
>> 
>> 
>> On Friday, October 21, 2016 4:01 AM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 2 HP 100 lbs Electric trolling Motor 24 volts
>> 
>> http://www.kijiji.ca/v-boat-parts-trailer-accessories/burnaby-new-westminster/2-hp-100-lbs-electric-trolling-motor-24-volts/1162587863?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 16:46:03 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 20:46:03 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
In-Reply-To: <612C5C0E-BEEA-49F8-B313-7878945F4471@yahoo.com>
References: <20161021084618.5A23F413@m0087797.ppops.net>
 <442161599.17058.1477076261157@mail.yahoo.com>
 <C94A56DE-3D1D-42A8-AB18-3FD61FA3C015@yahoo.com>
 <1717166215.498659.1477078874276@mail.yahoo.com>
 <612C5C0E-BEEA-49F8-B313-7878945F4471@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1549135148.566185.1477082763867@mail.yahoo.com>

Alan,If I recall, the Perry subs had o-ring seals on the main shaft, but were not allowed to go past 1,000 feet or?something.Nothing wrong with a o-ring in my opinion. ?You just need to machine the correct groove. ? Also I would guess that a low rpm system would be favourable with an o-ring.Hank
 

    On Friday, October 21, 2016 2:25 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 I can't remember what seal they use, but it could be just an O-ring.I would like to send you over one of my motors but they are not ready yet.Am having a rectifier made for me so I can run the motor off mains in a?pool for a hundred or so hours. Also am being supplied with some mechanicalseals to evaluate next week. Although there is an off the shelf regulatorthat Cliff is using for equalising his Minn kottas, I want to look at buildingmy own compensator. Slowly getting there though.Alan?

Sent from my iPad
On 22/10/2016, at 8:41 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Alan,Yaaaaa, hmmmmm, not sure what to do? ? ?Your probably right, they are?likely junk.Hank 

    On Friday, October 21, 2016 1:18 PM, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,I have 4 cheap Chinese trolling motors on my ambient.Have pulled a couple apart & found iron filings in then &one had the thrust bearing mounted in a plastic fitting thatdidn't look very substantial. The main housing seals & seatweren't fantastic & the seal was worse for wear by the timeI reassembled it. There were long bolts running down the?inside of the motor holding the housing together. These werea devil to get back in as the motor magnets pulled themaway from the threaded hole I was trying to bolt them in about 6" in.?However there are more than 1 trolling motor manufacturersin China. Good luck.? Alan

Sent from my iPad
On 22/10/2016, at 7:57 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Brian,Minkota 100 lb motors are a lot more than these ones I showed you. ?These are probably cheap Chinese motors. ?I think are worth a try, and I intend on being the sacrificial lamb. ?I am not converting them though, I will use them as surface power. ?They will be stored inside the sub or on the buoy marker. ?Of coarse for the benefit of us all, I will tear one down and have a peek at how well they are built.Hank 

    On Friday, October 21, 2016 9:46 AM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Thought they would be way more that that

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Fw:
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 10:04:25 +0000 (UTC)

Here is the ad for the motors and that is in Canadian dollars, so your cost is about 450 dollars each.Hank

     On Friday, October 21, 2016 4:01 AM, xxx xxxxx <mp13 at live.ca> wrote:
 

  2 HP 100 lbs Electric trolling Motor 24 volts
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-boat-parts-trailer-accessories/burnaby-new-westminster/2-hp-100-lbs-electric-trolling-motor-24-volts/1162587863?enableSearchNavigationFlag=true


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   

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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 18:58:28 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Mark via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 18:58:28 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure release valve
Message-ID: <53E49D3B-6222-40BA-9187-E4879BFDC549@nc.rr.com>

Good afternoon, psub'ers:

Thanks again for all your help last week with the SCUBA DIN connector - they arrived yesterday (perfect).

I have another question.  I know many of you fabricated your own pressure release valve -  is there a commercial valve that I can purchase online?  We live on a lake where the maximum depth is 60 feet.

Regards,

Mark Widman
910-638-5229

Sent from iPhone.


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 19:17:03 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 12:17:03 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure release valve
In-Reply-To: <53E49D3B-6222-40BA-9187-E4879BFDC549@nc.rr.com>
References: <53E49D3B-6222-40BA-9187-E4879BFDC549@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <79200F20-F3E2-4739-BD62-E94F612F2D29@yahoo.com>

Mark,
on my ambient I have a one way brass plumbing valve like this.


Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 11:58 am, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Good afternoon, psub'ers:
> 
> Thanks again for all your help last week with the SCUBA DIN connector - they arrived yesterday (perfect).
> 
> I have another question.  I know many of you fabricated your own pressure release valve -  is there a commercial valve that I can purchase online?  We live on a lake where the maximum depth is 60 feet.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mark Widman
> 910-638-5229
> 
> Sent from iPhone.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 19:18:24 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 16:18:24 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
Message-ID: <20161021161824.5A23B508@m0087796.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 19:23:27 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 12:23:27 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure release valve
In-Reply-To: <53E49D3B-6222-40BA-9187-E4879BFDC549@nc.rr.com>
References: <53E49D3B-6222-40BA-9187-E4879BFDC549@nc.rr.com>
Message-ID: <FCED8182-23FE-4117-B2D1-970A95FF4855@yahoo.com>

Sorry that last one fired too soon.
Like this   http://www.zeppy.io/product/us/2/121170556823/1-2-brass-in-line-spring-check-valve-200wog
Costs about $5- & found in most plumbers supplies store. The one I have is about 1 or 2
psi opening pressure which is what you want. Other than that Emile made his own & sells bits & pieces, he may be able to help you.
Cheers Alan



Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 11:58 am, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Good afternoon, psub'ers:
> 
> Thanks again for all your help last week with the SCUBA DIN connector - they arrived yesterday (perfect).
> 
> I have another question.  I know many of you fabricated your own pressure release valve -  is there a commercial valve that I can purchase online?  We live on a lake where the maximum depth is 60 feet.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mark Widman
> 910-638-5229
> 
> Sent from iPhone.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 19:51:12 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 16:51:12 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure release valve
Message-ID: <20161021165112.5A230727@m0087797.ppops.net>

Alan,    your ambient looks like it could be a 1 Atm .  Can it not take too much pressure?


Brian    




--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure release valve
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 12:17:03 +1300

Mark,
on my ambient I have a one way brass plumbing valve like this.


Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 11:58 am, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Good afternoon, psub'ers:
> 
> Thanks again for all your help last week with the SCUBA DIN connector - they arrived yesterday (perfect).
> 
> I have another question.  I know many of you fabricated your own pressure release valve -  is there a commercial valve that I can purchase online?  We live on a lake where the maximum depth is 60 feet.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mark Widman
> 910-638-5229
> 
> Sent from iPhone.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles



From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 20:33:07 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 13:33:07 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure release valve
In-Reply-To: <20161021165112.5A230727@m0087797.ppops.net>
References: <20161021165112.5A230727@m0087797.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <263B29BE-0E93-4A36-9833-361CF8038CDC@yahoo.com>

I wouldn't like to try it Brian.
It started life as a model for my 1atm & the frame was mdf which is the
next step up from cardboard. I did put some thick layers of fibreglass over it though.
I think it would crush between 15-30ft. The dome is 10mm thick.
Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 12:51 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,    your ambient looks like it could be a 1 Atm .  Can it not take too much pressure?
> 
> 
> Brian    
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Pressure release valve
> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 12:17:03 +1300
> 
> Mark,
> on my ambient I have a one way brass plumbing valve like this.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On 22/10/2016, at 11:58 am, Mark via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> 
>> Good afternoon, psub'ers:
>> 
>> Thanks again for all your help last week with the SCUBA DIN connector - they arrived yesterday (perfect).
>> 
>> I have another question.  I know many of you fabricated your own pressure release valve -  is there a commercial valve that I can purchase online?  We live on a lake where the maximum depth is 60 feet.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> Mark Widman
>> 910-638-5229
>> 
>> Sent from iPhone.
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 21:35:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 01:35:43 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
In-Reply-To: <20161021161824.5A23B508@m0087796.ppops.net>
References: <20161021161824.5A23B508@m0087796.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1146084322.50366.1477100143590@mail.yahoo.com>

Ouch $4000-, would you have to replace the shaft witha longer propeller shaft?What combined hp. are you looking for. How many motors?Have you sorted the motor controller for the motors?Alan?

      From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2016 12:18 PM
 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
   
Alan,???????????????? I still plan to use those motors, but they are expensive. $4000 each?? Been spending money like a drunken sailor, so I?was trying to brainstorm a cheppo solution?;-)?? I still kind of like the fact that a mass produced motor like the ones showed could be a cheap?alterative .? Those little?Honda generators?are quite amazing , very compact, quite, and they sip the gasoline.? I noticed a lot of sailboat people would use them?for house power?instead of?firing up they're onboard engines, they?would set them out on the bow.? ??Brian??

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 07:49:04 +1300

Hi Brian,what happened to the high powered motors you were looking at a while back?These motors are huge & only put out 1/3 rd horsepower. Minn kotta is 2hp. There is a?lot of work making a housing for them. The shaft would have to be extended to fit another bearing, seal & the propeller, let alone all the work for a housing that is bolted together &sealed with a wiring entry welded on.If you are just wanting to do buoyancy / stability tests before you invest in thrusters,why not have a small inflatable tender with outboard to drag it round.Alternatively look on Cliffs project page on his Minn kotta modification, as he has donesome good work on them that may be helpful.Cheers Alan
Sent from my iPad
On 21/10/2016, at 4:55 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Hi All,???????????????????? Been thinking about how I'm going to get around the harbor with my sub.? I'm thinking that for the time being I'm just going to run ( on the surface) a 2000 watt?Honda generator and then for the motors , use these 1/3 HP dryer motors in a oil flooded housing, probably made out of aluminum tubing.? They obviously run with 120 V? AC power.? ???Since on my sub I will have dual motors on each side, port and starboard, I was thinking to also have additional motors facing foreword to stop my foreword progress ( a brake)?? .?? ??These dryer motors can be got really cheap , new they're about?$75.00??I'm pretty?sure they would be ok flooded with oil.?? So I would have a total of 4 motors , two on each side one going?frontwards?and one?opposing .? It would be a totally on or off drive of course ,?with no speed control.? ??Here's a video of the motors I'm talking about.? ?????https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIrCUh1S8x8??Brian???

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_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 21:47:03 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 18:47:03 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
Message-ID: <20161021184703.77BCA378@m0087792.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 21:48:26 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 18:48:26 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
Message-ID: <20161021184826.77BCA371@m0087792.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 22:27:46 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 15:27:46 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
In-Reply-To: <20161021184826.77BCA371@m0087792.ppops.net>
References: <20161021184826.77BCA371@m0087792.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <430F17B9-E621-445E-9CF6-573F7D75CBD4@yahoo.com>

What a beast! Do you need all that horsepower, as you will need a 
huge battery bank to take advantage of it. That is not a bad price with
controller included from what I have seen of other systems.You will need a pressure compensating system to take it down deep. How many motors? & how are you
going to configure them. 
Alan
P.S. Really enjoying your elections down here in N.Z. can't wait for the next
episode of "Saturday night live"


Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 2:48 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,    The motor could go into the water the way it is, attach the prop directly to the motor shaft.
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 01:35:43 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Ouch $4000-, would you have to replace the shaft with
> a longer propeller shaft?
> What combined hp. are you looking for. How many motors?
> Have you sorted the motor controller for the motors?
> Alan
>  
> 
> 
> From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
> Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2016 12:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> 
> Alan,
>                  I still plan to use those motors, but they are expensive. $4000 each   Been spending money like a drunken sailor, so I was trying to brainstorm a cheppo solution ;-)   I still kind of like the fact that a mass produced motor like the ones showed could be a cheap alterative .  Those little Honda generators are quite amazing , very compact, quite, and they sip the gasoline.  I noticed a lot of sailboat people would use them for house power instead of firing up they're onboard engines, they would set them out on the bow. 
>  
>  
> Brian  
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 07:49:04 +1300
> 
> Hi Brian,
> what happened to the high powered motors you were looking at a while back?
> These motors are huge & only put out 1/3 rd horsepower. Minn kotta is 2hp. There is a 
> lot of work making a housing for them. The shaft would have to be extended to fit another bearing, seal & the propeller, let alone all the work for a housing that is bolted together &
> sealed with a wiring entry welded on.
> If you are just wanting to do buoyancy / stability tests before you invest in thrusters,
> why not have a small inflatable tender with outboard to drag it round.
> Alternatively look on Cliffs project page on his Minn kotta modification, as he has done
> some good work on them that may be helpful.
> Cheers Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 21/10/2016, at 4:55 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi All,
>                      Been thinking about how I'm going to get around the harbor with my sub.  I'm thinking that for the time being I'm just going to run ( on the surface) a 2000 watt Honda generator and then for the motors , use these 1/3 HP dryer motors in a oil flooded housing, probably made out of aluminum tubing.  They obviously run with 120 V  AC power. 
>  
>   Since on my sub I will have dual motors on each side, port and starboard, I was thinking to also have additional motors facing foreword to stop my foreword progress ( a brake)   .  
>  
>  These dryer motors can be got really cheap , new they're about $75.00  I'm pretty sure they would be ok flooded with oil.   So I would have a total of 4 motors , two on each side one going frontwards and one opposing .  It would be a totally on or off drive of course , with no speed control. 
>  
>  
> Here's a video of the motors I'm talking about. 
>  
>  
>    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIrCUh1S8x8
>  
>  
> Brian
>  
>  
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 22:39:05 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 15:39:05 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
In-Reply-To: <20161021184703.77BCA378@m0087792.ppops.net>
References: <20161021184703.77BCA378@m0087792.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <41550103-1B22-4154-AC59-C2C199FB5F27@yahoo.com>

Brian,
after more reading, I see it does a maximum of 10,000 rpm.
When I was researching thrusters 3000rpm seemed to be the
maximum propeller rpm that was used. It probably needs to go 
through a gearbox. 
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 2:47 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,
>                 Here's the motor below.  the one I was looking at was 35 HP this one says 65 !   but it depends on how you ask for certain parameters, they can design them to run with 48 volts or instance.  What I was looking for was a continuous working duty of 50% of it's full power.
>  
> http://www.evwest.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=8&products_id=371
>  
>  
> Here is the power graph for the motor:
>  
> http://www.hpevs.com/hpevs-ac-electric-motors-oil-cooled-ac-34-power-graphs.htm
>  
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 01:35:43 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Ouch $4000-, would you have to replace the shaft with
> a longer propeller shaft?
> What combined hp. are you looking for. How many motors?
> Have you sorted the motor controller for the motors?
> Alan
>  
> 
> 
> From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
> Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2016 12:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> 
> Alan,
>                  I still plan to use those motors, but they are expensive. $4000 each   Been spending money like a drunken sailor, so I was trying to brainstorm a cheppo solution ;-)   I still kind of like the fact that a mass produced motor like the ones showed could be a cheap alterative .  Those little Honda generators are quite amazing , very compact, quite, and they sip the gasoline.  I noticed a lot of sailboat people would use them for house power instead of firing up they're onboard engines, they would set them out on the bow. 
>  
>  
> Brian  
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 07:49:04 +1300
> 
> Hi Brian,
> what happened to the high powered motors you were looking at a while back?
> These motors are huge & only put out 1/3 rd horsepower. Minn kotta is 2hp. There is a 
> lot of work making a housing for them. The shaft would have to be extended to fit another bearing, seal & the propeller, let alone all the work for a housing that is bolted together &
> sealed with a wiring entry welded on.
> If you are just wanting to do buoyancy / stability tests before you invest in thrusters,
> why not have a small inflatable tender with outboard to drag it round.
> Alternatively look on Cliffs project page on his Minn kotta modification, as he has done
> some good work on them that may be helpful.
> Cheers Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 21/10/2016, at 4:55 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi All,
>                      Been thinking about how I'm going to get around the harbor with my sub.  I'm thinking that for the time being I'm just going to run ( on the surface) a 2000 watt Honda generator and then for the motors , use these 1/3 HP dryer motors in a oil flooded housing, probably made out of aluminum tubing.  They obviously run with 120 V  AC power. 
>  
>   Since on my sub I will have dual motors on each side, port and starboard, I was thinking to also have additional motors facing foreword to stop my foreword progress ( a brake)   .  
>  
>  These dryer motors can be got really cheap , new they're about $75.00  I'm pretty sure they would be ok flooded with oil.   So I would have a total of 4 motors , two on each side one going frontwards and one opposing .  It would be a totally on or off drive of course , with no speed control. 
>  
>  
> Here's a video of the motors I'm talking about. 
>  
>  
>    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIrCUh1S8x8
>  
>  
> Brian
>  
>  
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 22:45:33 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 19:45:33 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
Message-ID: <20161021194533.5A24ABD1@m0087798.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 22:47:41 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 19:47:41 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
Message-ID: <20161021194741.5A24ABC4@m0087798.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 21 23:39:41 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 16:39:41 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
In-Reply-To: <20161021194533.5A24ABD1@m0087798.ppops.net>
References: <20161021194533.5A24ABD1@m0087798.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <4037A38B-2A08-4825-933E-A25D5C6A1C50@yahoo.com>

Brian,
they will still need a pressure compensating system, bladder or similar.
And I would check how the wires come out of the motor to see that 
nothing is going to burst under pressure.
The 35hp is 26,000W. The larger motor draws up to 650 amps, so you
will need to make sure the batteries can handle that draw continuously.
4 x 24V 100 ah batteries at 50% depth of discharge will last about 10
minutes on full power. 
Nothing is simple & straight forward with these subs :(
Cheers Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 22/10/2016, at 3:45 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,  they are oil filled !   One on each side. More power is better !!   Just in case I have to get away from a giant squid ,  or fish and game !   my sub will be 8 tons when all is said and done.  Was thinking 8 deep cycle AGM batteries , 4 for each motor.  
>  
> Brian
>  
> PS:  Everybody is arming themselves !  luckily my drop weights will double as cannon balls !
>  
>  
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 15:27:46 +1300
> 
> What a beast! Do you need all that horsepower, as you will need a 
> huge battery bank to take advantage of it. That is not a bad price with
> controller included from what I have seen of other systems.You will need a pressure compensating system to take it down deep. How many motors? & how are you
> going to configure them. 
> Alan
> P.S. Really enjoying your elections down here in N.Z. can't wait for the next
> episode of "Saturday night live"
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 22/10/2016, at 2:48 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Alan,    The motor could go into the water the way it is, attach the prop directly to the motor shaft.
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 01:35:43 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Ouch $4000-, would you have to replace the shaft with
> a longer propeller shaft?
> What combined hp. are you looking for. How many motors?
> Have you sorted the motor controller for the motors?
> Alan
>  
> 
> 
> From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
> Sent: Saturday, October 22, 2016 12:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> 
> Alan,
>                  I still plan to use those motors, but they are expensive. $4000 each   Been spending money like a drunken sailor, so I was trying to brainstorm a cheppo solution ;-)   I still kind of like the fact that a mass produced motor like the ones showed could be a cheap alterative .  Those little Honda generators are quite amazing , very compact, quite, and they sip the gasoline.  I noticed a lot of sailboat people would use them for house power instead of firing up they're onboard engines, they would set them out on the bow. 
>  
>  
> Brian  
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
> Date: Sat, 22 Oct 2016 07:49:04 +1300
> 
> Hi Brian,
> what happened to the high powered motors you were looking at a while back?
> These motors are huge & only put out 1/3 rd horsepower. Minn kotta is 2hp. There is a 
> lot of work making a housing for them. The shaft would have to be extended to fit another bearing, seal & the propeller, let alone all the work for a housing that is bolted together &
> sealed with a wiring entry welded on.
> If you are just wanting to do buoyancy / stability tests before you invest in thrusters,
> why not have a small inflatable tender with outboard to drag it round.
> Alternatively look on Cliffs project page on his Minn kotta modification, as he has done
> some good work on them that may be helpful.
> Cheers Alan
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 21/10/2016, at 4:55 pm, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi All,
>                      Been thinking about how I'm going to get around the harbor with my sub.  I'm thinking that for the time being I'm just going to run ( on the surface) a 2000 watt Honda generator and then for the motors , use these 1/3 HP dryer motors in a oil flooded housing, probably made out of aluminum tubing.  They obviously run with 120 V  AC power. 
>  
>   Since on my sub I will have dual motors on each side, port and starboard, I was thinking to also have additional motors facing foreword to stop my foreword progress ( a brake)   .  
>  
>  These dryer motors can be got really cheap , new they're about $75.00  I'm pretty sure they would be ok flooded with oil.   So I would have a total of 4 motors , two on each side one going frontwards and one opposing .  It would be a totally on or off drive of course , with no speed control. 
>  
>  
> Here's a video of the motors I'm talking about. 
>  
>  
>    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIrCUh1S8x8
>  
>  
> Brian
>  
>  
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct 22 00:18:20 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 21 Oct 2016 21:18:20 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] temporary propulsion
Message-ID: <20161021211820.5A22C2A1@m0087794.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 24 21:58:40 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 24 Oct 2016 18:58:40 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Cannon Balls
Message-ID: <20161024185840.5A23CAE8@m0087795.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 25 03:53:32 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 07:53:32 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Cannon Balls
In-Reply-To: <20161024185840.5A23CAE8@m0087795.ppops.net>
References: <20161024185840.5A23CAE8@m0087795.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1031584016.279359.1477382012180@mail.yahoo.com>

Looks good Brian.If you gain weight with extra batteries you canalways drill a hole through your cannon balls& go fishing.Alan?

      From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: PSubs <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2016 2:58 PM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Cannon Balls
   
Hi All,?????????????? Been cranking out the cannon balls while I wait for my additional axial to arrive.?Brian?
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 25 04:23:12 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 08:23:12 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] LEDs
References: <404368718.282391.1477383792814.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <404368718.282391.1477383792814@mail.yahoo.com>

Had 15 LED samples arrive today (see pic)They are all 80W & $6- each. The smaller round LEDs are bridgelux& latest 2016 FLIP CHIP technology. http://info.taiwantrade.com/EP/resources/member/275112/productcatalog/cd798993-dc6c-4548-810b-e7000d9ae1c4_INTRODUCTION.pdfThey are just over 1" x 1" & are the first I will make a housing for. I like the smaller size,as the glass lenses are expensive &?the smaller the diameterthe deeper the light will go for a given thickness.I am impressed with the?company I bought them from, Tongyifang Optioelectronics
http://www.tyf-led.com/products_list/pmcId=58.htmlEvery LED has my name printed on the back of it & I was gettingfollow up emails to check they had arrived.The other items in the photo are the buck / boost constant current led drivers.I have destroyed 2 of these already. I have a 48V battery bank with a pre-chargeresistor to stop current inrush to the capacitors. I am pretty sure I destroyedthem when I didn't use the pre-charge resistor.Alan

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 25 13:05:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2016 13:05:43 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Medical clamps and K Boats
Message-ID: <003601d22ee2$0586c290$109447b0$@gmail.com>

Picked up a MiniOx O2 meter for Harold.  It came with a clamp for attaching
it to a medical pole. Hmmm .. I wondered . would it work on the internal
braces of a K350?

 

The answer is YES.  Like a boss.  I quickly went on eBay and picked up a lot
of seven more.  I can think of all sorts of uses like holding screens or
gopro mounts or adding temporary gizmos and such.  Needed to share.  Because
sometimes things just .. Work.

 

 <https://www.instagram.com/p/BL_O77SDgki/>
https://www.instagram.com/p/BL_O77SDgki/

 

Brian

 

 

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 25 15:18:33 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2016 08:18:33 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Medical clamps and K Boats
In-Reply-To: <003601d22ee2$0586c290$109447b0$@gmail.com>
References: <003601d22ee2$0586c290$109447b0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6F763135-D87B-4617-B4F2-88311995AB4C@yahoo.com>

Thanks Brian,
how is it attached to the transformer in the picture?
I followed the links to Mondosubmerso & saw that you have been experimenting
with the high powered (cob) LEDs for a while. There is a black light with a 50W
LED that looks to be a standard housing modified for use of the 50W cob. Is
that correct? What have you learnt experimenting with & running these large LEDs?
Is that transformer constant current?
Cheers Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 26/10/2016, at 6:05 am, Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Picked up a MiniOx O2 meter for Harold.  It came with a clamp for attaching it to a medical pole. Hmmm ?. I wondered ? would it work on the internal braces of a K350?
>  
> The answer is YES.  Like a boss.  I quickly went on eBay and picked up a lot of seven more.  I can think of all sorts of uses like holding screens or gopro mounts or adding temporary gizmos and such.  Needed to share.  Because sometimes things just ?. Work.
>  
> https://www.instagram.com/p/BL_O77SDgki/
>  
> Brian
>  
>  
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 25 20:10:26 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2016 00:10:26 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Medical clamps and K Boats
Message-ID: <219B85F470BD7B39.ce955711-b188-4683-8f14-9a10b3f18dee@mail.outlook.com>



Attaching the clamp: it came with some holes predrilled and taped so I just put holes in the cover and screwed it on. 



LEDS and diving. Yes, been messing with them for several years. I started with DIY canister lights, modifying Maglite flashlights into light heads. I found a guy online who made thick replacement lenses. I have a few left if anyone wants to experiment. A mini lathe and I was in business. 


Then the Chinese dive lights started showing up. Without batteries they are pretty cheap. So I made a video light out of one and a 50w flat bulb. Turned a piece of aluminum bar to sit under the bulb as a heat sink. Also nicely holds the bulb just under the lens. Found an old, cheap Dive Rite canister designed for a regular lead acid battery. Replaced battery with Li Phosphate and that left enough room for a transformer. It worked so well I made one for Harold.






Get Outlook for Android


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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Tue Oct 25 20:30:34 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Wed, 26 Oct 2016 13:30:34 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Medical clamps and K Boats
In-Reply-To: <219B85F470BD7B39.ce955711-b188-4683-8f14-9a10b3f18dee@mail.outlook.com>
References: <219B85F470BD7B39.ce955711-b188-4683-8f14-9a10b3f18dee@mail.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <5B108886-C867-4395-B5B3-AC88CAA2613A@yahoo.com>

Thanks Brian.
I will keep posting what I am doing with my new Flip LEDs in case it's of any
interest or you can put me on the right track. I bought the bare emitter, which
requires soldering the wires on to the heat sink. After some futile attempts at soldering
with a 25W gun, China advised me that I needed at least a 120W of heat.
so am ordering some more LEDs pre-soldered. Can't afford the wires falling off when
they heat up.
Cheers Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 26/10/2016, at 1:10 pm, Brian Hughes via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Attaching the clamp: it came with some holes predrilled and taped so I just put holes in the cover and screwed it on. 
> 
> LEDS and diving. Yes, been messing with them for several years. I started with DIY canister lights, modifying Maglite flashlights into light heads. I found a guy online who made thick replacement lenses. I have a few left if anyone wants to experiment. A mini lathe and I was in business.
> 
> Then the Chinese dive lights started showing up. Without batteries they are pretty cheap. So I made a video light out of one and a 50w flat bulb. Turned a piece of aluminum bar to sit under the bulb as a heat sink. Also nicely holds the bulb just under the lens. Found an old, cheap Dive Rite canister designed for a regular lead acid battery. Replaced battery with Li Phosphate and that left enough room for a transformer. It worked so well I made one for Harold.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Get Outlook for Android
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 01:10:24 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 22:10:24 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
Message-ID: <20161027221024.5A20CD78@m0087794.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 01:50:44 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 05:50:44 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
In-Reply-To: <20161027221024.5A20CD78@m0087794.ppops.net>
References: <20161027221024.5A20CD78@m0087794.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1840917593.310697.1477633844335@mail.yahoo.com>

Are they throwing out any motor controllers Brian, as thesenormally cost more than the motors.Kelly do controllers for Golf carts at a reasonable price.http://kellycontroller.com/Alan??



      From: Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: PSubs <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Friday, October 28, 2016 6:10 PM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
   
This electric golf cart business that is close buy has all these 3 HP dc motors that they just throw into the dumpster.? They are usually traded in by customers and the motors are perfectly fine .? Talk to them today and they're going to give me three motors for some honey.?? They literally have 50 to 60 golf carts in their boneyard?with motors at any one time, and they are constantly dumping them into the a giant roll-a-way bin for pick up.? I may try to work a deal with them?to get some more.? Most of them are 36 volt.?Brian???
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 02:06:58 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Thu, 27 Oct 2016 23:06:58 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
Message-ID: <20161027230658.5A26A9CF@m0087798.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 08:20:28 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 12:20:28 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
In-Reply-To: <20161027221024.5A20CD78@m0087794.ppops.net>
References: <20161027221024.5A20CD78@m0087794.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <420975950.400973.1477657228385@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,,Take all you can, they are the toughest motor out there, and get the controllers as Alan said. ?You can go online to get the wiring diagram. ?Man that is a score! ?Hank 

    On Thursday, October 27, 2016 11:10 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 This electric golf cart business that is close buy has all these 3 HP dc motors that they just throw into the dumpster.? They are usually traded in by customers and the motors are perfectly fine .? Talk to them today and they're going to give me three motors for some honey.?? They literally have 50 to 60 golf carts in their boneyard?with motors at any one time, and they are constantly dumping them into the a giant roll-a-way bin for pick up.? I may try to work a deal with them?to get some more.? Most of them are 36 volt.?Brian???
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 14:04:05 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 11:04:05 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
Message-ID: <20161028110405.5A2684F9@m0087798.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 14:15:27 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 08:15:27 -1000
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
In-Reply-To: <20161027221024.5A20CD78@m0087794.ppops.net>
References: <20161027221024.5A20CD78@m0087794.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <CALUZTEvurqAtKS+astusDGdm4y0paJuoraegBcmP4y6Z4F_M9A@mail.gmail.com>

Brian,

Could you check with them to see if they are also chucking the accelerator
pedal units or if they don't, how much they would want for one, 36v? I
would like to attach one to my foot yoke that controls my rear thruster to
free up my hands for my side thrusters. Would need one of their
forward/reverse switches as well.
Also, tried contacting James Frankland about the tractor seat he is using
but address not working. If you see this James, contact me off list @,
rick at landnseawelding.com
Thanks
Rick


On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 7:10 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> This electric golf cart business that is close buy has all these 3 HP dc
> motors that they just throw into the dumpster.  They are usually traded in
> by customers and the motors are perfectly fine .  Talk to them today and
> they're going to give me three motors for some honey.   They literally have
> 50 to 60 golf carts in their boneyard with motors at any one time, and they
> are constantly dumping them into the a giant roll-a-way bin for pick up.  I
> may try to work a deal with them to get some more.  Most of them are 36
> volt.
>
> Brian
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 14:58:44 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 07:58:44 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
In-Reply-To: <20161028110405.5A2684F9@m0087798.ppops.net>
References: <20161028110405.5A2684F9@m0087798.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <ECA8AEE2-C6F3-4C48-99BE-8B5B45E6D5C1@yahoo.com>

Brian,
look at the whole package before you get too many of those motors.
Will you need a gearbox with them? The gearboxes can cost more
than the motor. Is the motor suitable for putting in a housing? How will
it mount in there? Will you need to replace the drive shaft through the 
motor to extend it, or replace it with stainless? No doubt you will have 
to take the drive shaft out to machine in Circlip groves as Stops against
housing bearings, or machining for the propeller .Do you need to replace 
the motor bearings or the brushes?
The housing for it needs to be in sections that bolt together with O rings
and with press fit tolerances for the bearings & seals. A lot of work which
makes a new Minn kota look like a cheaper alternative.
My tiny 3 hp brushless motors have neodymium magnets & only cost
$60- each.
Regards Alan
 

Sent from my iPad

> On 29/10/2016, at 7:04 am, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Looking good on the motor front !   I think this is going to be an on going deal, I'll have to find a way to repay this guy, since I gave him the last of my honey stash !  
>  
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
> Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 12:20:28 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Brian,,
> Take all you can, they are the toughest motor out there, and get the controllers as Alan said.  You can go online to get the wiring diagram.  
> Man that is a score!  
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Thursday, October 27, 2016 11:10 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> This electric golf cart business that is close buy has all these 3 HP dc motors that they just throw into the dumpster.  They are usually traded in by customers and the motors are perfectly fine .  Talk to them today and they're going to give me three motors for some honey.   They literally have 50 to 60 golf carts in their boneyard with motors at any one time, and they are constantly dumping them into the a giant roll-a-way bin for pick up.  I may try to work a deal with them to get some more.  Most of them are 36 volt.
>  
> Brian
>  
>   
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 16:58:17 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 20:58:17 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] suction cup
References: <1889037280.694960.1477688297801.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1889037280.694960.1477688297801@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi all,Does anyone know where I can get a suction cup that can lift my dome, or plans how to make one?Hank
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 17:48:44 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 14:48:44 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
Message-ID: <20161028144844.5A22A436@m0087793.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 17:52:23 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 14:52:23 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
Message-ID: <20161028145223.5A22A4FC@m0087793.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 17:56:37 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 21:56:37 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
In-Reply-To: <20161028145223.5A22A4FC@m0087793.ppops.net>
References: <20161028145223.5A22A4FC@m0087793.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1483201947.764469.1477691798010@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,look for the older motors, they have a shaft sticking out the end, 1 inch by about 3 inches keyed.Hank 

    On Friday, October 28, 2016 3:52 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Alan,?? No doubt there will be issues to solve.? There is no face plate on one side since they fit into a gear box/ Tranny.? I would like to use aluminum so I don't have to paint it.?Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 07:58:44 +1300

Brian,look at the whole package before you get too many of those motors.Will you need a gearbox with them? The gearboxes can cost morethan the motor. Is the motor suitable for putting in a housing? How willit mount in there? Will you need to replace the drive shaft through the?motor to extend it, or replace it with stainless? No doubt you will have?to take the drive shaft out to machine in Circlip groves as Stops againsthousing bearings, or machining for the propeller .Do you need to replace?the motor bearings or the brushes?The housing for it needs to be in sections that bolt together with O ringsand with press fit tolerances for the bearings & seals. A lot of work whichmakes a new Minn kota look like a cheaper alternative.My tiny 3 hp brushless motors have neodymium magnets & only cost$60- each.Regards Alan?
Sent from my iPad
On 29/10/2016, at 7:04 am, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:


Looking good on the motor front !?? I think this is going to be an on going deal, I'll have to find a way to repay this guy, since I gave him the last of my honey stash !?? ??Brian

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 12:20:28 +0000 (UTC)

Brian,,Take all you can, they are the toughest motor out there, and get the controllers as Alan said. ?You can go online to get the wiring diagram. ?Man that is a score! ?Hank 

    On Thursday, October 27, 2016 11:10 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 This electric golf cart business that is close buy has all these 3 HP dc motors that they just throw into the dumpster.? They are usually traded in by customers and the motors are perfectly fine .? Talk to them today and they're going to give me three motors for some honey.?? They literally have 50 to 60 golf carts in their boneyard?with motors at any one time, and they are constantly dumping them into the a giant roll-a-way bin for pick up.? I may try to work a deal with them?to get some more.? Most of them are 36 volt.?Brian???
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 19:13:44 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 12:13:44 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
In-Reply-To: <1483201947.764469.1477691798010@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20161028145223.5A22A4FC@m0087793.ppops.net>
 <1483201947.764469.1477691798010@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <39580F3D-303C-499B-B30B-B3A68E541A34@yahoo.com>

Brian,
the aluminium is another issue. I had to go with a stock size thick walled
extruded aluminium tube, that I machined to the correct diameter inside
& out; & a solid rod for the front & back housings. Not cheap. The Minn kotta
housings are cast & as such there is a saving in size & material. Then there is
the anodising!
Cheers Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 29/10/2016, at 10:56 am, hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Brian,
> look for the older motors, they have a shaft sticking out the end, 1 inch by about 3 inches keyed.
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Friday, October 28, 2016 3:52 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> Alan,   No doubt there will be issues to solve.  There is no face plate on one side since they fit into a gear box/ Tranny.  I would like to use aluminum so I don't have to paint it.
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
> Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 07:58:44 +1300
> 
> Brian,
> look at the whole package before you get too many of those motors.
> Will you need a gearbox with them? The gearboxes can cost more
> than the motor. Is the motor suitable for putting in a housing? How will
> it mount in there? Will you need to replace the drive shaft through the 
> motor to extend it, or replace it with stainless? No doubt you will have 
> to take the drive shaft out to machine in Circlip groves as Stops against
> housing bearings, or machining for the propeller .Do you need to replace 
> the motor bearings or the brushes?
> The housing for it needs to be in sections that bolt together with O rings
> and with press fit tolerances for the bearings & seals. A lot of work which
> makes a new Minn kota look like a cheaper alternative.
> My tiny 3 hp brushless motors have neodymium magnets & only cost
> $60- each.
> Regards Alan
>  
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On 29/10/2016, at 7:04 am, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Looking good on the motor front !   I think this is going to be an on going deal, I'll have to find a way to repay this guy, since I gave him the last of my honey stash !  
>  
>  
> Brian
> 
> --- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:
> 
> From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] motors
> Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 12:20:28 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> Brian,,
> Take all you can, they are the toughest motor out there, and get the controllers as Alan said.  You can go online to get the wiring diagram.  
> Man that is a score!  
> Hank
> 
> 
> On Thursday, October 27, 2016 11:10 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> 
> This electric golf cart business that is close buy has all these 3 HP dc motors that they just throw into the dumpster.  They are usually traded in by customers and the motors are perfectly fine .  Talk to them today and they're going to give me three motors for some honey.   They literally have 50 to 60 golf carts in their boneyard with motors at any one time, and they are constantly dumping them into the a giant roll-a-way bin for pick up.  I may try to work a deal with them to get some more.  Most of them are 36 volt.
>  
> Brian
>  
>   
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> _______________________________________________ Personal_Submersibles mailing list Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 19:33:19 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 23:33:19 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] suction cup
In-Reply-To: <1889037280.694960.1477688297801@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1889037280.694960.1477688297801.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1889037280.694960.1477688297801@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1498846374.27890.1477697599822@mail.yahoo.com>



      From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2016 9:58 AM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] suction cup
   
Hi all,Does anyone know where I can get a suction cup that can lift my dome, or plans how to make one?Hank
_______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 20:09:05 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 14:09:05 -1000
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] suction cup
In-Reply-To: <1498846374.27890.1477697599822@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1889037280.694960.1477688297801.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1889037280.694960.1477688297801@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1498846374.27890.1477697599822@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CALUZTEvWcs9rRz7nZC8guexn+M8ZtkgymwKV6iBgGovT1MJfMw@mail.gmail.com>

What's the weight Hank?
Rick

On Friday, October 28, 2016, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> [image: Image result for toilet plunger]
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','personal_submersibles at psubs.org');>>
> *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','personal_submersibles at psubs.org');>>
> *Sent:* Saturday, October 29, 2016 9:58 AM
> *Subject:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] suction cup
>
> Hi all,
> Does anyone know where I can get a suction cup that can lift my dome, or
> plans how to make one?
> Hank
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org');>
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 20:27:02 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 00:27:02 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] suction cup
In-Reply-To: <CALUZTEvWcs9rRz7nZC8guexn+M8ZtkgymwKV6iBgGovT1MJfMw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1889037280.694960.1477688297801.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1889037280.694960.1477688297801@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1498846374.27890.1477697599822@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CALUZTEvWcs9rRz7nZC8guexn+M8ZtkgymwKV6iBgGovT1MJfMw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <838815155.23439.1477700822569@mail.yahoo.com>

I am guessing the dome weighs around 100 lbs, ?I need one or two to remove the dome without the straps and ring. ?Alan, those look pretty good!Hank 

    On Friday, October 28, 2016 6:09 PM, Rick Patton via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 What's the weight Hank?Rick?

On Friday, October 28, 2016, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:



      From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs. org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> 
 Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2016 9:58 AM
 Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] suction cup
  
Hi all,Does anyone know where I can get a suction cup that can lift my dome, or plans how to make one?Hank
______________________________ _________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles


   

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 20:50:06 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Fri, 28 Oct 2016 17:50:06 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
Message-ID: <20161028175006.5A214D9A@m0087797.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Fri Oct 28 21:31:02 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 01:31:02 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
In-Reply-To: <20161028175006.5A214D9A@m0087797.ppops.net>
References: <20161028175006.5A214D9A@m0087797.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1691751703.46639.1477704662965@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,Nice, but keep it simple! ?make a housing and end cap with a simple seal, either a spring seal or an o-ring. ?The beauty of these motors is the low rpm. ?Gamma used to have a 2 hp?golf cart?motor, well really a 3 hp running on 24v is 2 hp. ?That was the entire drive.Hankhey why is the ground not white, it looks green? 

    On Friday, October 28, 2016 6:50 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi All,????????????? Looks like I'll be getting motors every week over the next month or so, kind of a slow dribble ( like wiki leaks ! only with motors !)? .? My new found friend over at the golf cart place is going to be ridding himself of all these carts that have been piling up.? But he has to see what is what, so at the end of every week I'll be hauling away motors !??today I got two motors (48 VDC) plus a drive shaft/ gear box.? I'm thinking that I should use the gear box as part of my drive.? One good thing about it is that it is an in-line configuration rather than a 90 degree.? Also it's a 6 to 1 reduction which is really great.? I might be able to make a custom pod to house everything.? I would like to run the whole thing in oil.?Pics:??Brian?
_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct 29 14:42:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 11:42:43 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
Message-ID: <20161029114243.F99D5B8@m0087793.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sat Oct 29 15:38:05 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 19:38:05 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
In-Reply-To: <20161029114243.F99D5B8@m0087793.ppops.net>
References: <20161029114243.F99D5B8@m0087793.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1412347521.310064.1477769885229@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,If I recall Gamma ran about 1,800 rpm with the golf cart motor. ? The support shaft is removed by unscrewing it, if it is stubborn, throw a little ?heat at it. ?Then there are potting options for the wires. ?I prefer to drill in two electrical penetrators into the motor body and plug the hole from the support rod. ?That works well if your motors are fixed solid. ?If the motors ?need to rotate, then you make a penetrating shaft with the wires potted inside the new shaft.If you just want to putter around the test area, then just clamp them on the sub as they are.Hank 

    On Saturday, October 29, 2016 12:42 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,????? I didn't think they were such low rpm, I'll have to look that up from the name plate on line.??? I also have two trolling motors, one is a Johnson and the other is a 30 lb thrust minikota,? not sure how powerful the Johnson is since there is no info on the motor?.? On those trolling motors there is a support shaft that comes up from the back and has the wires in there, what does everybody do with that?? is that removed and then some sort of seal put in and the wires potted in??Brian??

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 01:31:02 +0000 (UTC)

Brian,Nice, but keep it simple! ?make a housing and end cap with a simple seal, either a spring seal or an o-ring. ?The beauty of these motors is the low rpm. ?Gamma used to have a 2 hp?golf cart?motor, well really a 3 hp running on 24v is 2 hp. ?That was the entire drive.Hankhey why is the ground not white, it looks green? 

    On Friday, October 28, 2016 6:50 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi All,????????????? Looks like I'll be getting motors every week over the next month or so, kind of a slow dribble ( like wiki leaks ! only with motors !)? .? My new found friend over at the golf cart place is going to be ridding himself of all these carts that have been piling up.? But he has to see what is what, so at the end of every week I'll be hauling away motors !??today I got two motors (48 VDC) plus a drive shaft/ gear box.? I'm thinking that I should use the gear box as part of my drive.? One good thing about it is that it is an in-line configuration rather than a 90 degree.? Also it's a 6 to 1 reduction which is really great.? I might be able to make a custom pod to house everything.? I would like to run the whole thing in oil.?Pics:??Brian?
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 01:00:56 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 22:00:56 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
Message-ID: <20161029220056.F9C3F89@m0087797.ppops.net>

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 05:23:57 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 09:23:57 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
In-Reply-To: <20161029220056.F9C3F89@m0087797.ppops.net>
References: <20161029220056.F9C3F89@m0087797.ppops.net>
Message-ID: <1852790560.472552.1477819437745@mail.yahoo.com>

Brian,Yes your motors are more modern than what I am used to with the open end and all. ?Sounds like you have a plan and lots of spare parts.Hank 

    On Saturday, October 29, 2016 11:01 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,?? So far from what I see is that these motors run quite fast , there are some that do run in the 1600 rpm range , but the ones I'm looking at ( 3 hp ) run around 4000 rpm.? But that's ok because what I think I'm going to do is use the rear end differential for running the prop.? It's really made to order and will get the?rpm down to around 500 .? Which would be fantastic, I could get a whole bunch of torque out of the motor, run a big multi blade large prop and cruise .? All I would need to do is secure one side of the differential and?use the other side as the drive shaft.? It's a?very tight little gear box which would fit inside a 14" pipe, with another 8" pipe welded to it off center to house the motor.? ?Brian?

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 19:38:05 +0000 (UTC)

Brian,If I recall Gamma ran about 1,800 rpm with the golf cart motor. ? The support shaft is removed by unscrewing it, if it is stubborn, throw a little ?heat at it. ?Then there are potting options for the wires. ?I prefer to drill in two electrical penetrators into the motor body and plug the hole from the support rod. ?That works well if your motors are fixed solid. ?If the motors ?need to rotate, then you make a penetrating shaft with the wires potted inside the new shaft.If you just want to putter around the test area, then just clamp them on the sub as they are.Hank 

    On Saturday, October 29, 2016 12:42 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hank,????? I didn't think they were such low rpm, I'll have to look that up from the name plate on line.??? I also have two trolling motors, one is a Johnson and the other is a 30 lb thrust minikota,? not sure how powerful the Johnson is since there is no info on the motor?.? On those trolling motors there is a support shaft that comes up from the back and has the wires in there, what does everybody do with that?? is that removed and then some sort of seal put in and the wires potted in??Brian??

--- personal_submersibles at psubs.org wrote:

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] got motors
Date: Sat, 29 Oct 2016 01:31:02 +0000 (UTC)

Brian,Nice, but keep it simple! ?make a housing and end cap with a simple seal, either a spring seal or an o-ring. ?The beauty of these motors is the low rpm. ?Gamma used to have a 2 hp?golf cart?motor, well really a 3 hp running on 24v is 2 hp. ?That was the entire drive.Hankhey why is the ground not white, it looks green? 

    On Friday, October 28, 2016 6:50 PM, Brian Cox via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi All,????????????? Looks like I'll be getting motors every week over the next month or so, kind of a slow dribble ( like wiki leaks ! only with motors !)? .? My new found friend over at the golf cart place is going to be ridding himself of all these carts that have been piling up.? But he has to see what is what, so at the end of every week I'll be hauling away motors !??today I got two motors (48 VDC) plus a drive shaft/ gear box.? I'm thinking that I should use the gear box as part of my drive.? One good thing about it is that it is an in-line configuration rather than a 90 degree.? Also it's a 6 to 1 reduction which is really great.? I might be able to make a custom pod to house everything.? I would like to run the whole thing in oil.?Pics:??Brian?
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   _______________________________________________Personal_Submersibles mailing listPersonal_Submersibles at psubs.orghttp://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
_______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 13:58:43 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 17:58:43 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] lighting
References: <471271569.579089.1477850323273.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <471271569.579089.1477850323273@mail.yahoo.com>

Gamma is getting a lighting upgrade from 24,000 lumen to 48,000 lumen. ?I thought this was pretty impressive until I had a look at Nuytco's Sun ?at 65,000 lumen. ?Man that is BIG!?Hank
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 15:06:29 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Phil Nuytten via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 12:06:29 -0700
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] lighting
In-Reply-To: <471271569.579089.1477850323273@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <471271569.579089.1477850323273.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <471271569.579089.1477850323273@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <385671E29A384C11AB291F612743FB52@PhillPC>

Hi Hank, 
Yeah, the large ?Newtsun? series are pretty darn awesome ? we have sold a lot of the big?uns to Work Class ROV operators and get back nothing but positive comments. The small ?Newtsun?s are the ones we use on the DeepWorker subs and on the Exosuits. We are just finishing the build of a huge work-class all-electric ROV called the ?NEWTROV?, it?is pretty wild ? 13 or our large thrusters and a total bollard-pull in excess of a ton. We plan to use it in the drinking water system in New York ? we?ve worked there before (set a record going six miles into the water conduits by submersibles) and you can?t have even a drop of oil in their system or they toss you off the claim! Most ROV?s are Electric over hydraulic, hence the all-electric ? The NewtRov will have four of the big Newtsuns mounted on it ? we launch on November 24th, 2016 ? I?m looking forward to seeing the beast with all lights blazing! 

From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles 
Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2016 10:58 AM
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion 
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] lighting

Gamma is getting a lighting upgrade from 24,000 lumen to 48,000 lumen.  I thought this was pretty impressive until I had a look at Nuytco's Sun  at 65,000 lumen.  Man that is BIG! 
Hank


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 15:57:58 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 19:57:58 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] lighting
In-Reply-To: <385671E29A384C11AB291F612743FB52@PhillPC>
References: <471271569.579089.1477850323273.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <471271569.579089.1477850323273@mail.yahoo.com>
 <385671E29A384C11AB291F612743FB52@PhillPC>
Message-ID: <1350198079.640002.1477857478336@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi Phil,They will be able to see that from the space station,lol ?I am shocked you need that much light, I have been in pitch black with 24,000 and could see great. ?I am adding a second for redundancy more than anything. ?I am diving the SS City Of Ainsworth in Kootenay Lake in February and need back up lighting. ?I also had to add extra thrusters and battery bank to make the trip across the bay to the wreck.Hank

    On Sunday, October 30, 2016 1:06 PM, Phil Nuytten via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
 

 Hi Hank, Yeah, the large ?Newtsun? series are pretty darn awesome ? we have sold a lot of the big?uns to Work Class ROV operators and get back nothing but positive comments. The small ?Newtsun?s are the ones we use on the DeepWorker subs and on the Exosuits. We are just finishing the build of a huge work-class all-electric ROV called the ?NEWTROV?, it?is pretty wild ? 13 or our large thrusters and a total bollard-pull in excess of a ton. We plan to use it in the drinking water system in New York ? we?ve worked there before (set a record going six miles into the water conduits by submersibles) and you can?t have even a drop of oil in their system or they toss you off the claim! Most ROV?s are Electric over hydraulic, hence the all-electric ? The NewtRov will have four of the big Newtsuns mounted on it ? we launch on November 24th, 2016 ? I?m looking forward to seeing the beast with all lights blazing! ?From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2016 10:58 AMTo: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] lighting?Gamma is getting a lighting upgrade from 24,000 lumen to 48,000 lumen.? I thought this was pretty impressive until I had a look at Nuytco's Sun? at 65,000 lumen.? Man that is BIG! Hank_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
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Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 16:02:07 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 20:02:07 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>

Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a throughhull so?I can?display the tank contents pressure on a screen.Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a throughhull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't havea shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.Alan
?
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 16:04:38 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 20:04:38 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] lighting
In-Reply-To: <385671E29A384C11AB291F612743FB52@PhillPC>
References: <471271569.579089.1477850323273.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <471271569.579089.1477850323273@mail.yahoo.com>
 <385671E29A384C11AB291F612743FB52@PhillPC>
Message-ID: <952975538.759034.1477857878653@mail.yahoo.com>

Phil,I remember you saying that ROVs were likephone sex! Alan?

      From: Phil Nuytten via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 8:06 AM
 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] lighting
   
Hi Hank, Yeah, the large ?Newtsun? series are pretty darn awesome ? we have sold a lot of the big?uns to Work Class ROV operators and get back nothing but positive comments. The small ?Newtsun?s are the ones we use on the DeepWorker subs and on the Exosuits. We are just finishing the build of a huge work-class all-electric ROV called the ?NEWTROV?, it?is pretty wild ? 13 or our large thrusters and a total bollard-pull in excess of a ton. We plan to use it in the drinking water system in New York ? we?ve worked there before (set a record going six miles into the water conduits by submersibles) and you can?t have even a drop of oil in their system or they toss you off the claim! Most ROV?s are Electric over hydraulic, hence the all-electric ? The NewtRov will have four of the big Newtsuns mounted on it ? we launch on November 24th, 2016 ? I?m looking forward to seeing the beast with all lights blazing! ?From: hank pronk via Personal_Submersibles Sent: Sunday, October 30, 2016 10:58 AMTo: Personal Submersibles General Discussion Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] lighting?Gamma is getting a lighting upgrade from 24,000 lumen to 48,000 lumen.? I thought this was pretty impressive until I had a look at Nuytco's Sun? at 65,000 lumen.? Man that is BIG! Hank_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles

_______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 16:19:03 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (emile via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Sun, 30 Oct 2016 21:19:03 +0100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>

The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it as it is unreliable.

 

Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.

 

 

Br, Emile

 

Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge

 

Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?

I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the

1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through

hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.

Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.

An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through

hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the 

inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have

a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.

Alan


 

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 19:34:26 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 10:34:26 +1100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
Message-ID: <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Alan,
I have pressure transmitters (similar to many commonly used in
industry) that could probably be adapted for that - see attached
photos.  You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable
gland plate.  It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or
4-20mA (both linear).  They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the
SCUBA HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.

I imagine you're worried about leaks of HP inside, and maybe cost as
well.  Something you may not have thought of is running 1/8" SS tube.  It's
soft enough to bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable
than 1/4" tube) and can be run in a bundle with cables.  Also available in
very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.  I've had good
success using it for remote gauge lines.

I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of those
:).

Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're
interested in one - list price is AU$198.

Cheers,
Steve
(TFM Engineering Australia)

On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it
> as it is unreliable.
>
>
>
> Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so)
> into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
>
>
>
>
>
> Br, Emile
>
>
>
> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> bounces at psubs.org] *Namens *Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
> *Verzonden:* zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
>
>
> Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
>
> I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
>
> 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
>
> hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
>
> Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
>
> An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
>
> hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
>
> inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
>
> a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
>
> Alan
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 21:04:58 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 01:04:58 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
 <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2109399614.868898.1477875898277@mail.yahoo.com>

Thanks Emile & Steve.I may combine both suggestions.I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable platea la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gaugelooks like the right option.I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywherefor a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get anestimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.?? Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?Cheers Alan?

      From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
   
Hi Alan,I?have pressure transmitters?(similar to many commonly used in industry)?that could probably be adapted for that - see attached photos.??You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable gland plate.? It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or 4-20mA (both linear).? They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the SCUBA?HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
I imagine you're worried about?leaks?of HP inside, and maybe cost as well.??Something you may not have thought of is?running?1/8"?SS tube.? It's soft enough to?bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable than 1/4" tube)?and can be run in a bundle with cables.? Also available in very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.? I've had good success using it for remote gauge lines.
I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of those :).
Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're interested in one - list price is AU$198.
Cheers,Steve(TFM Engineering Australia)
On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it as it is unreliable.?Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.??Br, Emile?Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge?Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a throughhull so?I can?display the tank contents pressure on a screen.Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a throughhull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't havea shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.Alan
?
______________________________ _________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles




_______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Sun Oct 30 23:53:49 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 14:53:49 +1100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <2109399614.868898.1477875898277@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
 <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>
 <2109399614.868898.1477875898277@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Alan
Yep, my pressure transmitter is suitable for oxygen (and is ranged
0-400bar).

A SCUBA reg HP port usually has an orifice built-in to restrict flow in the
event of hose failure.  But with even 100bar behind it, the tank will still
empty in a matter of minutes - pretty significant.  Having the
prolonged restriction of a long skinny tube will help a bit, but a total
failure would still put out a lot of gas.

Cheers,
Steve

On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 12:04 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Thanks Emile & Steve.
> I may combine both suggestions.
> I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable plate
> a la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;
> so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gauge
> looks like the right option.
> I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywhere
> for a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get an
> estimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.
>    Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?
> Cheers Alan
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> *Sent:* Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
> Hi Alan,
> I have pressure transmitters (similar to many commonly used in
> industry) that could probably be adapted for that - see attached
> photos.  You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable
> gland plate.  It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or
> 4-20mA (both linear).  They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the
> SCUBA HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
>
> I imagine you're worried about leaks of HP inside, and maybe cost as
> well.  Something you may not have thought of is running 1/8" SS tube.  It's
> soft enough to bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable
> than 1/4" tube) and can be run in a bundle with cables.  Also available in
> very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.  I've had good
> success using it for remote gauge lines.
>
> I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of
> those :).
>
> Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're
> interested in one - list price is AU$198.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
> (TFM Engineering Australia)
>
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it
> as it is unreliable.
>
> Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so)
> into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
>
>
> Br, Emile
>
> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> bounces at psubs.org <personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org>] *Namens *Alan
> James via Personal_Submersibles
> *Verzonden:* zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
> Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
> I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
> 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
> hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
> Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
> An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
> hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
> inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
> a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
> Alan
>
>
>
> ______________________________ _________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org <Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 01:31:10 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 01:31:10 -0400
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <CAGL1GvEN-DtSDjr3fCeVYqk=_fd7392NH3cgubPNVM2F9UZOFg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGL1GvHhDUbUOXWzLWgUbX=cLaaB012_n6x+nBPoWpNExCTs5Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGvxp3p+o34Pqd30BaAQNG7x9dunEtKJvrvL_Z-iDRk7w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvHfKFX2VMRqY+aw7wjLSmmd95eqP-C7ZFAGytNnfYn=xQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFvgSpkST-E3LvYUyxKBbyhuMEZurVinFRdyQS6ekWFUA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvEMje3gSfGwzi8thvtn7i3B0Ju03LJLG-NqN=VERpEH6w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvH9hJ9K2z7x70kbW_xRhDS_K10j7wm9p0-xU382yEYCXg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvHqrudyOG=_9JnBDhyz-n53e+MviF=ng3Rnv2sOmbTo+Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGYpcxy-F2SwGTmFpspCYzw=obMbO=xP3Ed-pDuhWRx+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGbLQn4be3d+oWrE8N4+Tqk+UEYy0qpGCpnjHuxb4gczA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFbZhGXYf2UkxJNTgq3MAd8cRGvSVSJu7hSxCmvqbuv3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGr3NECNJuh4J8MyqoU9zNHGUqVVqyN1btSUhYsxjB+=w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvERpu2qS6WK41Njre0ERtKjM7gm7t6d-VHDKXmN6o=mWg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvG8itpZ_a+A8nFFXw-PXUHpoEMfe2yzU5sJw4rjhC5EHg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvH6xSsym5igAUXBPVceBF0w9EtBH+p=K9VBbCt6R152BQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGoSBQ5sc6CaA9ZrDNfRvUn198BHNsy=+UkHNsCRioMUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFJ9aAKQQD3nXOAVgrGKdUmF0Ft_1bXN2utvXdZifs96Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFpJW0amXx7T3TZ__HtNeafrcRYcc3xX8jnLcKS26PR3g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvG=7bCeWuHL1oLwoES+XNK9YNabXtm1GhiuvJ9hLO2p1Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFQZP+d8bHNZ9EU1DsbNmob5SzHqFMFWzjfeDwpHsb2Vw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvEsgm_BnKjAXXrGWoHOuXL7m6Rv5RhBLxJRyNh-rDKr-Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvEN-DtSDjr3fCeVYqk=_fd7392NH3cgubPNVM2F9UZOFg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAGL1GvEC2YtcBGZrXzM5u_jTnENE6Zwi4781FeM-AZ7sC0Kfnw@mail.gmail.com>

Just a quick look in the McMaster Carr catalog reveals 0-5000 psi pressure
transducers. 1/4" NPT, all stainless with an 11,000 psi max pressure. I
doubt they're rated for O2 though. If you're concerned about leaks, I
wouldn't bother with the 1/8 tube, but instead put a second, much smaller,
flow control orifice upstream from the bulkhead. A .01" diameter orifice
gives you about .426 cfm at 3000psi. Then have a ball valve immediately
coming off your bulkhead followed by the pressure transducer.

On Oct 30, 2016 11:55 PM, "via Personal_Submersibles" <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Electronics contents gauge
      (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
   2. Re: Electronics contents gauge
      (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 01:04:58 +0000 (UTC)
From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
        <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
        <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
Message-ID: <2109399614.868898.1477875898277 at mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Thanks Emile & Steve.I may combine both suggestions.I am wanting to put my
penetrations through a removeable platea la Deep Worker. It will be behind
me in my 1 person submersible;so a pressure transmitter with wires coming
from it rather than a gaugelooks like the right option.I like the idea of
the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywherefor a 1st stage hp
port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get anestimate, to see if a
failure would be an issue anyway.?? Steve, are those pressure transmitters
suitable for oxygen?Cheers Alan?

      From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.o
rg>
 Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge

Hi Alan,I?have pressure transmitters?(similar to many commonly used in
industry)?that could probably be adapted for that - see attached
photos.??You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable
gland plate.? It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or
4-20mA (both linear).? They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the
SCUBA?HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
I imagine you're worried about?leaks?of HP inside, and maybe cost as
well.??Something you may not have thought of is?running?1/8"?SS tube.? It's
soft enough to?bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable
than 1/4" tube)?and can be run in a bundle with cables.? Also available in
very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.? I've had good
success using it for remote gauge lines.
I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of those
:).
Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're
interested in one - list price is AU$198.
Cheers,Steve(TFM Engineering Australia)
On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it as
it is unreliable.?Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with
? ?thread or so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the
outside.??Br, Emile?Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:
personal_submersibles- bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via
Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge?Is there a suitable
electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?I am after something that
plugs in to the high pressure port of the1st stage regulator & has wires
off it that I can run through a throughhull so?I can?display the tank
contents pressure on a screen.Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to
the hull.An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a throughhull
& have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the inside of
the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't havea shut off valve
if the pressure gauge failed some how.Alan
?
______________________________ _________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles




_______________________________________________
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------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 14:53:49 +1100
From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles
        <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
        <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
Message-ID:
        <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A at mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Hi Alan
Yep, my pressure transmitter is suitable for oxygen (and is ranged
0-400bar).

A SCUBA reg HP port usually has an orifice built-in to restrict flow in the
event of hose failure.  But with even 100bar behind it, the tank will still
empty in a matter of minutes - pretty significant.  Having the
prolonged restriction of a long skinny tube will help a bit, but a total
failure would still put out a lot of gas.

Cheers,
Steve

On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 12:04 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Thanks Emile & Steve.
> I may combine both suggestions.
> I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable plate
> a la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;
> so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gauge
> looks like the right option.
> I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywhere
> for a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get an
> estimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.
>    Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?
> Cheers Alan
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> *Sent:* Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
> Hi Alan,
> I have pressure transmitters (similar to many commonly used in
> industry) that could probably be adapted for that - see attached
> photos.  You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable
> gland plate.  It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or
> 4-20mA (both linear).  They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the
> SCUBA HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
>
> I imagine you're worried about leaks of HP inside, and maybe cost as
> well.  Something you may not have thought of is running 1/8" SS tube.
It's
> soft enough to bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable
> than 1/4" tube) and can be run in a bundle with cables.  Also available in
> very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.  I've had good
> success using it for remote gauge lines.
>
> I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of
> those :).
>
> Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're
> interested in one - list price is AU$198.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
> (TFM Engineering Australia)
>
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it
> as it is unreliable.
>
> Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so)
> into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
>
>
> Br, Emile
>
> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> bounces at psubs.org <personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org>] *Namens *Alan
> James via Personal_Submersibles
> *Verzonden:* zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
> Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
> I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
> 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
> hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
> Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
> An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
> hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
> inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
> a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
> Alan
>
>
>
> ______________________________ _________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org <Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 02:57:49 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Ovidiu Anghelidi via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 06:57:49 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Design Calculator Question
References: <1382306353.861331.1477897069112.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1382306353.861331.1477897069112@mail.yahoo.com>

Hi there,
I have a question regarding some of the values found in the spreadsheet iSub-Rev7-11-12.xls
Where can I find the source for 3578, 13958.3983, 12^3?
Cell: BuoyancyDB.C12?? =$Main.D5 * (3578.47)/12^3
Cell: BuoyancyDB.C13 ? =$Main.D5 * (13958.3983)/12^3

Should these values be the same for all designs?

Thank you.
Best Regards,Ovidiu

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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 05:46:39 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 22:46:39 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <CAGL1GvEC2YtcBGZrXzM5u_jTnENE6Zwi4781FeM-AZ7sC0Kfnw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGL1GvHhDUbUOXWzLWgUbX=cLaaB012_n6x+nBPoWpNExCTs5Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGvxp3p+o34Pqd30BaAQNG7x9dunEtKJvrvL_Z-iDRk7w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvHfKFX2VMRqY+aw7wjLSmmd95eqP-C7ZFAGytNnfYn=xQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFvgSpkST-E3LvYUyxKBbyhuMEZurVinFRdyQS6ekWFUA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvEMje3gSfGwzi8thvtn7i3B0Ju03LJLG-NqN=VERpEH6w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvH9hJ9K2z7x70kbW_xRhDS_K10j7wm9p0-xU382yEYCXg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvHqrudyOG=_9JnBDhyz-n53e+MviF=ng3Rnv2sOmbTo+Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGYpcxy-F2SwGTmFpspCYzw=obMbO=xP3Ed-pDuhWRx+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGbLQn4be3d+oWrE8N4+Tqk+UEYy0qpGCpnjHuxb4gczA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFbZhGXYf2UkxJNTgq3MAd8cRGvSVSJu7hSxCmvqbuv3Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGr3NECNJuh4J8MyqoU9zNHGUqVVqyN1btSUhYsxjB+=w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvERpu2qS6WK41Njre0ERtKjM7gm7t6d-VHDKXmN6o=mWg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvG8itpZ_a+A8nFFXw-PXUHpoEMfe2yzU5sJw4rjhC5EHg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvH6xSsym5igAUXBPVceBF0w9EtBH+p=K9VBbCt6R152BQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvGoSBQ5sc6CaA9ZrDNfRvUn198BHNsy=+UkHNsCRioMUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFJ9aAKQQD3nXOAVgrGKdUmF0Ft_1bXN2utvXdZifs96Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFpJW0amXx7T3TZ__HtNeafrcRYcc3xX8jnLcKS26PR3g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvG=7bCeWuHL1oLwoES+XNK9YNabXtm1GhiuvJ9hLO2p1Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvFQZP+d8bHNZ9EU1DsbNmob5SzHqFMFWzjfeDwpHsb2Vw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvEsgm_BnKjAXXrGWoHOuXL7m6Rv5RhBLxJRyNh-rDKr-Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvEN-DtSDjr3fCeVYqk=_fd7392NH3cgubPNVM2F9UZOFg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAGL1GvEC2YtcBGZrXzM5u_jTnENE6Zwi4781FeM-AZ7sC0Kfnw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9F83D648-63F4-4816-8C73-BDC2487C20E4@yahoo.com>

Thanks River,
unfortunately McMaster Carr doesn't sell to N.Z. & Australia, possibly the rest
of the World also. There have been several items I have wanted to buy from them.
I will flick President Trump an email ( on the correct server ) about this as the Chinese
have the edge over you guys here.
I liked these small profile units as I will need at least 4 on my through-hull plate.
https://www.mcmaster.com/#pressure-transducers/=14u0jxl
Cheers Alan


Sent from my iPad

> On 31/10/2016, at 6:31 pm, River Dolfi via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Just a quick look in the McMaster Carr catalog reveals 0-5000 psi pressure transducers. 1/4" NPT, all stainless with an 11,000 psi max pressure. I doubt they're rated for O2 though. If you're concerned about leaks, I wouldn't bother with the 1/8 tube, but instead put a second, much smaller, flow control orifice upstream from the bulkhead. A .01" diameter orifice gives you about .426 cfm at 3000psi. Then have a ball valve immediately coming off your bulkhead followed by the pressure transducer.
> 
> 
> On Oct 30, 2016 11:55 PM, "via Personal_Submersibles" <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> Send Personal_Submersibles mailing list submissions to
>         personal_submersibles at psubs.org
> 
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>         http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>         personal_submersibles-request at psubs.org
> 
> You can reach the person managing the list at
>         personal_submersibles-owner at psubs.org
> 
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Personal_Submersibles digest..."
> 
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
>    1. Re: Electronics contents gauge
>       (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
>    2. Re: Electronics contents gauge
>       (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 01:04:58 +0000 (UTC)
> From: Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
> Message-ID: <2109399614.868898.1477875898277 at mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Thanks Emile & Steve.I may combine both suggestions.I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable platea la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gaugelooks like the right option.I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywherefor a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get anestimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.?? Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?Cheers Alan?
> 
>       From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>  To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>  Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
>  Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
> 
> Hi Alan,I?have pressure transmitters?(similar to many commonly used in industry)?that could probably be adapted for that - see attached photos.??You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable gland plate.? It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or 4-20mA (both linear).? They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the SCUBA?HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
> I imagine you're worried about?leaks?of HP inside, and maybe cost as well.??Something you may not have thought of is?running?1/8"?SS tube.? It's soft enough to?bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable than 1/4" tube)?and can be run in a bundle with cables.? Also available in very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.? I've had good success using it for remote gauge lines.
> I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of those :).
> Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're interested in one - list price is AU$198.
> Cheers,Steve(TFM Engineering Australia)
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it as it is unreliable.?Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.??Br, Emile?Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
> Verzonden: zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
> Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge?Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a throughhull so?I can?display the tank contents pressure on a screen.Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a throughhull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't havea shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.Alan
> ?
> ______________________________ _________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 14:53:49 +1100
> From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>         <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
> Message-ID:
>         <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> Hi Alan
> Yep, my pressure transmitter is suitable for oxygen (and is ranged
> 0-400bar).
> 
> A SCUBA reg HP port usually has an orifice built-in to restrict flow in the
> event of hose failure.  But with even 100bar behind it, the tank will still
> empty in a matter of minutes - pretty significant.  Having the
> prolonged restriction of a long skinny tube will help a bit, but a total
> failure would still put out a lot of gas.
> 
> Cheers,
> Steve
> 
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 12:04 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> > Thanks Emile & Steve.
> > I may combine both suggestions.
> > I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable plate
> > a la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;
> > so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gauge
> > looks like the right option.
> > I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywhere
> > for a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get an
> > estimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.
> >    Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?
> > Cheers Alan
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------
> > *From:* Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
> > personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> > *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion <
> > personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> > *Sent:* Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
> > *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
> >
> > Hi Alan,
> > I have pressure transmitters (similar to many commonly used in
> > industry) that could probably be adapted for that - see attached
> > photos.  You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable
> > gland plate.  It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or
> > 4-20mA (both linear).  They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the
> > SCUBA HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
> >
> > I imagine you're worried about leaks of HP inside, and maybe cost as
> > well.  Something you may not have thought of is running 1/8" SS tube.  It's
> > soft enough to bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable
> > than 1/4" tube) and can be run in a bundle with cables.  Also available in
> > very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.  I've had good
> > success using it for remote gauge lines.
> >
> > I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of
> > those :).
> >
> > Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're
> > interested in one - list price is AU$198.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Steve
> > (TFM Engineering Australia)
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
> > personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> >
> > The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it
> > as it is unreliable.
> >
> > Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so)
> > into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
> >
> >
> > Br, Emile
> >
> > *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> > bounces at psubs.org <personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org>] *Namens *Alan
> > James via Personal_Submersibles
> > *Verzonden:* zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
> > *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> > *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
> >
> > Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
> > I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
> > 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
> > hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
> > Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
> > An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
> > hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
> > inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
> > a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
> > Alan
> >
> >
> >
> > ______________________________ _________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org <Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
> > <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> > Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> > http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> >
> >
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> Subject: Digest Footer
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.whoweb.com/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> End of Personal_Submersibles Digest, Vol 40, Issue 77
> *****************************************************
> 
> _______________________________________________
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 06:07:07 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 23:07:07 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
 <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>
 <2109399614.868898.1477875898277@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B93BD258-1C80-484B-9411-6485DB61EC5F@yahoo.com>

Thanks Steve,
I'll have a think about this one. In my small cabin a failure could be fatal.
With the transmitter's pressure rating it is not likely to burst apart; it would be more 
likely that it leaked because of poor sealing. I doubt this would be major 
though.
Cheers Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 31/10/2016, at 4:53 pm, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Alan
> Yep, my pressure transmitter is suitable for oxygen (and is ranged 0-400bar).
> 
> A SCUBA reg HP port usually has an orifice built-in to restrict flow in the event of hose failure.  But with even 100bar behind it, the tank will still empty in a matter of minutes - pretty significant.  Having the prolonged restriction of a long skinny tube will help a bit, but a total failure would still put out a lot of gas.
> 
> Cheers,
> Steve
> 
>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 12:04 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Thanks Emile & Steve.
>> I may combine both suggestions.
>> I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable plate
>> a la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;
>> so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gauge
>> looks like the right option.
>> I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywhere
>> for a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get an
>> estimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.
>>    Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?
>> Cheers Alan
>>  
>> 
>> 
>> From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
>> Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>> 
>> Hi Alan,
>> I have pressure transmitters (similar to many commonly used in industry) that could probably be adapted for that - see attached photos.  You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable gland plate.  It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or 4-20mA (both linear).  They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the SCUBA HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
>> 
>> I imagine you're worried about leaks of HP inside, and maybe cost as well.  Something you may not have thought of is running 1/8" SS tube.  It's soft enough to bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable than 1/4" tube) and can be run in a bundle with cables.  Also available in very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.  I've had good success using it for remote gauge lines.
>> 
>> I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of those :).
>> 
>> Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're interested in one - list price is AU$198.
>> 
>> Cheers,
>> Steve
>> (TFM Engineering Australia)
>> 
>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it as it is unreliable.
>>  
>> Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
>>  
>>  
>> Br, Emile
>>  
>> Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
>> Verzonden: zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
>> Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>> Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>>  
>> Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
>> I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
>> 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
>> hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
>> Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
>> An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
>> hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
>> inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
>> a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
>> Alan
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> ______________________________ _________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 06:26:31 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 10:26:31 +0000
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <B93BD258-1C80-484B-9411-6485DB61EC5F@yahoo.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
 <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>
 <2109399614.868898.1477875898277@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <B93BD258-1C80-484B-9411-6485DB61EC5F@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAHpB=UA-rN3=MVm-=7scCi9gu4Ja88dRQuJgCKiCGwu_XQWv=g@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Alan,

About half way down in this catalogue.  Digital O2 clean gauges.  Takes a
bit of a while to download.
http://www.undersea.uk.com/catalogue/catalogue.pdf

Regards
James

On 31 October 2016 at 10:07, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Thanks Steve,
> I'll have a think about this one. In my small cabin a failure could be
> fatal.
> With the transmitter's pressure rating it is not likely to burst apart; it
> would be more
> likely that it leaked because of poor sealing. I doubt this would be major
> though.
> Cheers Alan
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On 31/10/2016, at 4:53 pm, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Hi Alan
> Yep, my pressure transmitter is suitable for oxygen (and is ranged
> 0-400bar).
>
> A SCUBA reg HP port usually has an orifice built-in to restrict flow in
> the event of hose failure.  But with even 100bar behind it, the tank will
> still empty in a matter of minutes - pretty significant.  Having the
> prolonged restriction of a long skinny tube will help a bit, but a total
> failure would still put out a lot of gas.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
>
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 12:04 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
>> Thanks Emile & Steve.
>> I may combine both suggestions.
>> I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable plate
>> a la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;
>> so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gauge
>> looks like the right option.
>> I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywhere
>> for a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get an
>> estimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.
>>    Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?
>> Cheers Alan
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>> *Sent:* Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
>> *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>>
>> Hi Alan,
>> I have pressure transmitters (similar to many commonly used in
>> industry) that could probably be adapted for that - see attached
>> photos.  You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable
>> gland plate.  It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or
>> 4-20mA (both linear).  They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the
>> SCUBA HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
>>
>> I imagine you're worried about leaks of HP inside, and maybe cost as
>> well.  Something you may not have thought of is running 1/8" SS tube.  It's
>> soft enough to bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable
>> than 1/4" tube) and can be run in a bundle with cables.  Also available in
>> very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.  I've had good
>> success using it for remote gauge lines.
>>
>> I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of
>> those :).
>>
>> Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're
>> interested in one - list price is AU$198.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Steve
>> (TFM Engineering Australia)
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
>> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>
>> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it
>> as it is unreliable.
>>
>> Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or
>> so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
>>
>>
>> Br, Emile
>>
>> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
>> bounces at psubs.org <personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org>] *Namens *Alan
>> James via Personal_Submersibles
>> *Verzonden:* zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
>> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>> *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>>
>> Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
>> I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
>> 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
>> hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
>> Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
>> An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
>> hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
>> inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
>> a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
>> Alan
>>
>>
>>
>> ______________________________ _________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org <Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
>> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 10:23:10 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 09:23:10 -0500
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Design Calculator Question
In-Reply-To: <1382306353.861331.1477897069112@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <1382306353.861331.1477897069112.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <1382306353.861331.1477897069112@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAK4DN4AfOepURrD_Jv+gLAT+BEGs72BBuGhQ_MJYe04=2-YYcQ@mail.gmail.com>

Ovidiu, the valve of 3578 is the volume of the Variable Ballast Tank
(VBT) in units of in^3 for this simple example psub.  The valve 13958 is
the volume of the Main Ballast Tank (MBT) in in^3.  For an actual psub, you
would need to determine these two values based on your boat design.  For
the example in iSub, the MBT is a straddle tank and this volume was
calculate using Autodesk Inventor for the part.  Likewise, the VBT is
assumed to be a small internal tank and the volume and CB calculated from
Inventor.  Both of these volumes are important in calculating the
displacement of the boat.

If you don't have a 3-D cad program like Solidworks or Inventor, then you
would estimate these volumes and their associated centers of buoyancy(CB).

Cliff


On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 1:57 AM, Ovidiu Anghelidi via Personal_Submersibles
<personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Hi there,
>
> I have a question regarding some of the values found in the spreadsheet
> iSub-Rev7-11-12.xls
>
> Where can I find the source for 3578, 13958.3983, 12^3?
> Cell: BuoyancyDB.C12   =$Main.D5 * (3578.47)/12^3
> Cell: BuoyancyDB.C13   =$Main.D5 * (13958.3983)/12^3
>
> Should these values be the same for all designs?
>
> Thank you.
>
> Best Regards,
> Ovidiu
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 11:00:37 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 10:00:37 -0500
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
Message-ID: <CAK4DN4DCg2-=M8wNxM-8+48o2YeyVDMjdyTGfSLEWm=q710vSQ@mail.gmail.com>

Alan, I agree 100% with Emile on this. Given the safety implications of not
knowing the air pressure in external air tanks, this needs to be a rock
solid measurement.  On my boat, for the HP air pressure, I use a 1/4 MNPT
sensor with a 1-5 vdc analog output screwed into a 316L SS penetrator that
has a 1/4 FNPT thread on the interior side and ANSI 7/16-20 UNF thread on
the exterior.  I use a Swagelok fitting PN SS-400-1-OR that lands in the
penetrator and uses a o-ring face seal.  This fitting converts to 1/4" tube
which I use for all HP air line. 1/4NPT gage pressure sensors are always
available on Ebay with either analog voltage output or analog current
output. This sensor wires directly into PLC analog input module.  PLC
ladder logic can then implement low pressure alarms and interlocks to
prevent diving when air pressure is low or someone forgets to turn on HP
air valve.

Cliff

On Sun, Oct 30, 2016 at 3:19 PM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it
> as it is unreliable.
>
>
>
> Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so)
> into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
>
>
>
>
>
> Br, Emile
>
>
>
> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> bounces at psubs.org] *Namens *Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
> *Verzonden:* zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
>
>
> Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
>
> I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
>
> 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
>
> hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
>
> Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
>
> An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
>
> hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
>
> inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
>
> a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
>
> Alan
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 16:32:32 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 20:32:32 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <CAK4DN4DCg2-=M8wNxM-8+48o2YeyVDMjdyTGfSLEWm=q710vSQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
 <CAK4DN4DCg2-=M8wNxM-8+48o2YeyVDMjdyTGfSLEWm=q710vSQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1616818925.1580645.1477945952810@mail.yahoo.com>

Thanks Cliff,I am having 2 independent O2 systems & 2 air supply systems.Only low pressure air going in to the hull, with a cross over valvefor the ballast air. Also doing 3 or 4 days O2 supply. So althoughit wouldn't be ideal having a wrong pressure reading, it wouldn'tbe fatal. I like all that you are doing in that system & thanks for the details.BTY did you see the new LED I am playing around with?80W Flip chip that dissipates heat faster from the individual LEDs &is a round, smaller unit than normal. It will mean I can get away witha smaller lens; the lens being the most expensive part.Have just ordered 15 samples from the manufacturer (who makes theBridgelux) at $6.50 each.Alan?

      From: Cliff Redus via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Tuesday, November 1, 2016 4:00 AM
 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
   
Alan, I agree 100% with Emile on this.?Given the?safety implications of not knowing the air pressure in?external air tanks, this needs to be a rock solid measurement.? On my boat, for the HP air pressure, I use a 1/4 MNPT sensor with a 1-5 vdc analog output screwed into a 316L SS penetrator that has a 1/4 FNPT thread on the interior side and ANSI 7/16-20 UNF thread on the exterior.? I use a Swagelok fitting PN SS-400-1-OR that lands in the penetrator and uses a o-ring face seal.? This fitting converts to 1/4" tube which I use for all HP air line. 1/4NPT gage pressure sensors are always available on Ebay with either analog voltage output or analog current output.?This sensor wires directly into PLC analog input module.? PLC ladder logic can then implement low pressure alarms and interlocks to prevent diving when air pressure is low or someone forgets to turn on HP air valve.
Cliff
On Sun, Oct 30, 2016 at 3:19 PM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it as it is unreliable.?Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.??Br, Emile?Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge?Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a throughhull so?I can?display the tank contents pressure on a screen.Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a throughhull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't havea shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.Alan
?
______________________________ _________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles




_______________________________________________
Personal_Submersibles mailing list
Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles


   
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 17:21:59 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Mon, 31 Oct 2016 21:21:59 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
 <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>
 <2109399614.868898.1477875898277@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2026780612.1609905.1477948919198@mail.yahoo.com>

Steve,just had a look at your 2016 catalogue.http://www.tfmengineering.com.au/TFM_Engineering_Catalogue_2016-03.pdfWow, you've got a lot of?gear I haven't seen before.Alan???

      From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
 Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 4:53 PM
 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
   
Hi AlanYep, my?pressure transmitter is suitable for oxygen (and?is ranged 0-400bar).
A SCUBA reg HP port usually has an orifice?built-in to restrict flow in the event of hose failure.? But with even 100bar behind it,?the tank will still empty in a matter of minutes - pretty significant.??Having the prolonged?restriction of a long skinny tube will help a bit, but?a?total failure would still put out a lot of gas.
Cheers,Steve
On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 12:04 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

Thanks Emile & Steve.I may combine both suggestions.I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable platea la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gaugelooks like the right option.I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywherefor a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get anestimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.?? Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?Cheers Alan?

      From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs. org>
 To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> 
 Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
 Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
  
Hi Alan,I?have pressure transmitters?(similar to many commonly used in industry)?that could probably be adapted for that - see attached photos.??You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable gland plate.? It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or 4-20mA (both linear).? They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the SCUBA?HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
I imagine you're worried about?leaks?of HP inside, and maybe cost as well.??Something you may not have thought of is?running?1/8"?SS tube.? It's soft enough to?bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable than 1/4" tube)?and can be run in a bundle with cables.? Also available in very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.? I've had good success using it for remote gauge lines.
I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of those :).
Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce@ tfmengineering.com.au if you're interested in one - list price is AU$198.
Cheers,Steve(TFM Engineering Australia)
On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs. org> wrote:

The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it as it is unreliable.?Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.??Br, Emile?Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
Verzonden: zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge?Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a throughhull so?I can?display the tank contents pressure on a screen.Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a throughhull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't havea shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.Alan
?
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http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles




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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 19:06:25 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2016 12:06:25 +1300
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <CAHpB=UA-rN3=MVm-=7scCi9gu4Ja88dRQuJgCKiCGwu_XQWv=g@mail.gmail.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
 <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>
 <2109399614.868898.1477875898277@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <B93BD258-1C80-484B-9411-6485DB61EC5F@yahoo.com>
 <CAHpB=UA-rN3=MVm-=7scCi9gu4Ja88dRQuJgCKiCGwu_XQWv=g@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2738D264-3004-44C9-A2F5-15ED3236EE5F@yahoo.com>

James,
great catalogue. I have just had it printed & bound as a reference
for what's available.
Alan

Sent from my iPad

> On 31/10/2016, at 11:26 pm, James Frankland via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
> 
> Hi Alan,
>  
> About half way down in this catalogue.  Digital O2 clean gauges.  Takes a bit of a while to download.
> http://www.undersea.uk.com/catalogue/catalogue.pdf
>  
> Regards
> James
> 
>> On 31 October 2016 at 10:07, Alan via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>> Thanks Steve,
>> I'll have a think about this one. In my small cabin a failure could be fatal.
>> With the transmitter's pressure rating it is not likely to burst apart; it would be more 
>> likely that it leaked because of poor sealing. I doubt this would be major 
>> though.
>> Cheers Alan
>> 
>> Sent from my iPad
>> 
>>> On 31/10/2016, at 4:53 pm, Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Alan
>>> Yep, my pressure transmitter is suitable for oxygen (and is ranged 0-400bar).
>>> 
>>> A SCUBA reg HP port usually has an orifice built-in to restrict flow in the event of hose failure.  But with even 100bar behind it, the tank will still empty in a matter of minutes - pretty significant.  Having the prolonged restriction of a long skinny tube will help a bit, but a total failure would still put out a lot of gas.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Steve
>>> 
>>>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 12:04 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> Thanks Emile & Steve.
>>>> I may combine both suggestions.
>>>> I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable plate
>>>> a la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;
>>>> so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gauge
>>>> looks like the right option.
>>>> I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywhere
>>>> for a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get an
>>>> estimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.
>>>>    Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?
>>>> Cheers Alan
>>>>  
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> From: Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
>>>> To: Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> 
>>>> Sent: Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>>>> 
>>>> Hi Alan,
>>>> I have pressure transmitters (similar to many commonly used in industry) that could probably be adapted for that - see attached photos.  You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable gland plate.  It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or 4-20mA (both linear).  They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the SCUBA HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
>>>> 
>>>> I imagine you're worried about leaks of HP inside, and maybe cost as well.  Something you may not have thought of is running 1/8" SS tube.  It's soft enough to bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable than 1/4" tube) and can be run in a bundle with cables.  Also available in very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.  I've had good success using it for remote gauge lines.
>>>> 
>>>> I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of those :).
>>>> 
>>>> Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au if you're interested in one - list price is AU$198.
>>>> 
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> Steve
>>>> (TFM Engineering Australia)
>>>> 
>>>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>>>> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it as it is unreliable.
>>>>  
>>>> Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so) into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
>>>>  
>>>>  
>>>> Br, Emile
>>>>  
>>>> Van: Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles- bounces at psubs.org] Namens Alan James via Personal_Submersibles
>>>> Verzonden: zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
>>>> Aan: Personal Submersibles General Discussion
>>>> Onderwerp: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>>>>  
>>>> Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
>>>> I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
>>>> 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
>>>> hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
>>>> Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
>>>> An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
>>>> hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
>>>> inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
>>>> a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
>>>> Alan
>>>> 
>>>>  
>>>> 
>>>> ______________________________ _________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
>> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
>> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 19:58:56 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2016 10:58:56 +1100
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
In-Reply-To: <2026780612.1609905.1477948919198@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <60930755.756642.1477857727920.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
 <60930755.756642.1477857727920@mail.yahoo.com>
 <10fa01d232ea$db72b6f0$925824d0$@nl>
 <CAAzgXiP8Ft71QYhwrSTNJnXsi78kAAYqt9HYMFOUGB4+DJF_Dg@mail.gmail.com>
 <2109399614.868898.1477875898277@mail.yahoo.com>
 <CAAzgXiNU_nw8bxJigff==V1ZGV+ech4DTnGrovRb-VcwbQmW+A@mail.gmail.com>
 <2026780612.1609905.1477948919198@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAAzgXiNf_ONif-n_U9ym0vg3ywCeWoLB-NatThCbtPrOsz1L9Q@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks Alan,
Yes much of the stuff in my catalogue is dedicated to SCUBA gas mixing and
high pressure oxygen (and there is a bunch more about to be added).  A
couple of items are from Undersea UK and if you ever want some stuff from
there let me know and we might consolidate shipping.  For the record, my HP
oxygen digital gauge is US$183 compared to US$208 for the Undersea one -
they have great stuff but getting it down here is sometimes not
cost-effective (and their standard thread is 1/4" BSPP with O ring, whereas
I prefer 1/4" NPT).

Actually while on the subject of pressure monitoring, I've nearly
finished development and production of a couple of new products that may be
of interest to psubbers - an "Oxygen Watchdog" and "Pressure Watchdog".
These are self-contained panel-mount kits with sensor, display/controller
and 2 independent relay outputs.  They read and display the O2 percent
or cylinder pressure, and the controller can be set to trigger/release the
relays under various circumstances (low setpoint, high setpoint, too far
from a middle setpoint, etc.).

They are intended for SCUBA compressors and mixing systems, but would do
well (with perhaps a few minor modifications) if you want a
standalone/PLC-independent alarm system in a PSUB.  A couple of pictures of
the prototypes are below.

If anyone is interested in a kit, (or just bits of it) then let me know.
They are light enough that shipping anywhere in the world will be pretty
reasonable.

Cheers,
Steve


[image: Inline image 2][image: Inline image 3]

On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 8:21 AM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <
personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:

> Steve,
> just had a look at your 2016 catalogue.
> http://www.tfmengineering.com.au/TFM_Engineering_Catalogue_2016-03.pdf
> Wow, you've got a lot of gear I haven't seen before.
> Alan
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org>
> *Sent:* Monday, October 31, 2016 4:53 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
> Hi Alan
> Yep, my pressure transmitter is suitable for oxygen (and is ranged
> 0-400bar).
>
> A SCUBA reg HP port usually has an orifice built-in to restrict flow in
> the event of hose failure.  But with even 100bar behind it, the tank will
> still empty in a matter of minutes - pretty significant.  Having the
> prolonged restriction of a long skinny tube will help a bit, but a total
> failure would still put out a lot of gas.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
>
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 12:04 PM, Alan James via Personal_Submersibles <
> personal_submersibles at psubs.org> wrote:
>
> Thanks Emile & Steve.
> I may combine both suggestions.
> I am wanting to put my penetrations through a removeable plate
> a la Deep Worker. It will be behind me in my 1 person submersible;
> so a pressure transmitter with wires coming from it rather than a gauge
> looks like the right option.
> I like the idea of the 1/8th tube. I couldn't find a flow rate anywhere
> for a 1st stage hp port. May have to flow it in to a plastic bag & get an
> estimate, to see if a failure would be an issue anyway.
>    Steve, are those pressure transmitters suitable for oxygen?
> Cheers Alan
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* Stephen Fordyce via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
> *To:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>>
> *Sent:* Monday, October 31, 2016 12:34 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
> Hi Alan,
> I have pressure transmitters (similar to many commonly used in
> industry) that could probably be adapted for that - see attached
> photos.  You could replace the end section with a small penetrator/cable
> gland plate.  It needs a power supply of 6-30VDC and outputs 0.5-4.5V or
> 4-20mA (both linear).  They are NPT so you'd need an adaptor for the
> SCUBA HP port - but a 1/4" Swagelok thread will fit.
>
> I imagine you're worried about leaks of HP inside, and maybe cost as
> well.  Something you may not have thought of is running 1/8" SS tube.  It's
> soft enough to bend by hand (more like stiff solid-core electrical cable
> than 1/4" tube) and can be run in a bundle with cables.  Also available in
> very small inside diameters so flow is greatly restricted.  I've had good
> success using it for remote gauge lines.
>
> I also have digital HP oxygen pressure gauges if you ever need one of
> those :).
>
> Shoot me an email at Stephen.fordyce@ tfmengineering.com.au
> <Stephen.fordyce at tfmengineering.com.au> if you're interested in one -
> list price is AU$198.
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
> (TFM Engineering Australia)
>
> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 7:19 AM, emile via Personal_Submersibles <personal_submersibles at psubs.
> org <personal_submersibles at psubs.org>> wrote:
>
> The scuba pressure sensors are wireless. Most scuba divers don?t want it
> as it is unreliable.
>
> Best would be to screw a industrial pressure sensor (with ? ?thread or so)
> into the penetrator plate and attach a HP line on the outside.
>
>
> Br, Emile
>
> *Van:* Personal_Submersibles [mailto:personal_submersibles-
> bounces at psubs.org <personal_submersibles-bounces at psubs.org>] *Namens *Alan
> James via Personal_Submersibles
> *Verzonden:* zondag 30 oktober 2016 21:02
> *Aan:* Personal Submersibles General Discussion
> *Onderwerp:* [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronics contents gauge
>
> Is there a suitable electronic scuba tank contents gauge out there?
> I am after something that plugs in to the high pressure port of the
> 1st stage regulator & has wires off it that I can run through a through
> hull so I can display the tank contents pressure on a screen.
> Trying to avoid bringing high pressure in to the hull.
> An alternative may be to run a high pressure line to a through
> hull & have an electronic pressure gauge threaded in to this from the
> inside of the hull. However with the second method, I wouldn't have
> a shut off valve if the pressure gauge failed some how.
> Alan
>
>
>
> ______________________________ _________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org <Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>
>
>
> ______________________________ _________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org <Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>
>
>
> ______________________________ _________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs. org <Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org>
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/ listinfo.cgi/personal_ submersibles
> <http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Personal_Submersibles mailing list
> Personal_Submersibles at psubs.org
> http://www.psubs.org/mailman/listinfo.cgi/personal_submersibles
>
>
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From personal_submersibles at psubs.org  Mon Oct 31 23:19:22 2016
From: personal_submersibles at psubs.org (Alan James via Personal_Submersibles)
Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2016 03:19:22 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [PSUBS-MAILIST] Electronic contents gauge
References: <991360517.1811479.1477970362594.ref@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <991360517.1811479.1477970362594@mail.yahoo.com>


Steve,sending this again as I didn't receive it...Steve,I am wanting to build an O2 system like James Cameron had.An O2?valve that flows continuously with a top up from a solenoidvalve which ?triggered by?a plc that?is receiving signals from?3 x O2 sensors. Mainly because I want to keep everything as small as possible.?? With your O2 unit it looks like you could have it doing similar;turn on a solenoid to top up the O2 beyond what is flowing in froma pre-set valve. A bellows add system that replaces the bellows withyour "Oxygen Watchdog"Know what you mean about UK freight charges, have cancelled itemsbecause of ridiculous freight charges. Thanks for the offer of buyingthrough your firm.Cheers Alan
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